2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

[Remius]

Haha yup. Should we not aim high when discussing the potential leaders of the country?

From this pool Aitchison's not far off, though completely unproven. From the broader caucus, I'd like to think I voted for one among the backbenchers. Some of you likely know him.

Aitchison at least has a more fleshed out policy platform. He’ll be one of the names on my ranked ballot. I’ve been impressed with him, but sadly he likely won’t stand a chance but could help play kingmaker.

 

[Good2Golf]

It’s all poorly calculated. Party unity be damned. But it’s short term gains that won’t necessarily translate well in the long term.

Failed to recover Blue Grits and to likely loose some more Red Tories, will cost him. It’ll be another example of inefficient vote power. Overkill on the safe numbers and harder right party members, and a notable weakening of the ‘make a difference’ numbers elsewhere.

 

[Blackadder1916]

Little game to take down the temperature of the thread- Build your ideal CPC Leader

Background -upbringing, education, career (non-political), career (political)
Approach/style
Policies - 3 or 4 key ones, could be broad could be specific

Mine
Background

• blue collar or rural roots
• business or stem educated (or life experience thereof)
• track record of success, merit driven advancement in a field that isn't legal, consulting, politics etc.
• no politics before 35

Approach

• consensus/bridge builder
• someone that can influence policy while not in power by working with others
• even keeled
• willing to stand up to and lead the membership and base

Policies

• Balance budgets
• Lean government. Trim fat, cut waste, deliver service in accountable manner.
• Reform defense procurement and meet NATO targets
• Grounded in reality, rises above conspiracy bs and partisan narratives
• Sensible climate policy to enable a smooth and profitable long term transition to a post oil economy, take advantage of our resources and support Canadians throughout that time
• Socially centre. Put abortion, LGBTQ rights etc to bed, acknowledge that people are people and stop being scared of differences, but also stop the viscous spiral of identity politics and moral grandstanding

So, bring back Joe Clark or resurrect Bob Stanfield and don't let him near a football.

Am I showing my age and political leaning?

 

[OldSolduer]

So, bring back Joe Clark or resurrect Bob Stanfield and don't let him near a football.

Am I showing my age and political leaning?

Yes you and I both. I remember that picture and that had an influence on the election.

 

[The Bread Guy]

To the bold- I've seen the cynical suspicion in a couple places that he fully knows that he's taking the CPC somewhere unelectable, but it's as the champion to an extremely vocal and committed portion of the membership and will be able to survive a couple leadership reviews. Result being a decade at Stornoway with Leader of the opposition pay and perks to do nothing but rail away from his soapbox and contribute nothing to the governance of the country - pretty cushy gig. But that's a little....... conspiratorial

Hey, even paranoids have real enemies, right? I suspect he'd be happy in just the position you describe, but you may be attributing more premeditation toward that specific end game than me. We may just disagree on how much higher than zero the premeditation dial is, though.

 

[IKnowNothing]

Hey, even paranoids have real enemies, right? I suspect he'd be happy in just the position you describe, but you may be attributing more premeditation toward that specific end game than me. We may just disagree on how much higher than zero the premeditation dial is, though.

To be clear, I've read it in a couple places - not my theory or something that I believe. Agreed completely. A fallback position at most.

 

[Remius]

To be clear, I've read it in a couple places - not my theory or something that I believe. Agreed completely. A fallback position at most.

Honestly I think he’s always had eyes on being PM. He’ll never have a better opportunity to try and go for it.

 

[QV]

Little game to take down the temperature of the thread- Build your ideal CPC Leader

Background -upbringing, education, career (non-political), career (political)
Approach/style
Policies - 3 or 4 key ones, could be broad could be specific

Mine
Background

• blue collar or rural roots
• business or stem educated (or life experience thereof)
• track record of success, merit driven advancement in a field that isn't legal, consulting, politics etc.
• no politics before 35

Approach

• consensus/bridge builder
• someone that can influence policy while not in power by working with others
• even keeled
• willing to stand up to and lead the membership and base

Policies

• Balance budgets
• Lean government. Trim fat, cut waste, deliver service in accountable manner.
• Reform defense procurement and meet NATO targets
• Grounded in reality, rises above conspiracy bs and partisan narratives
• Sensible climate policy to enable a smooth and profitable long term transition to a post oil economy, take advantage of our resources and support Canadians throughout that time
• Socially centre. Put abortion, LGBTQ rights etc to bed, acknowledge that people are people and stop being scared of differences, but also stop the viscous spiral of identity politics and moral grandstanding

So you’re 80%-85% of the way to Bernier.

 

[Good2Golf]

So you’re 80%-85% of the way to Bernier’s PowerPoint.

Seems some take the simple route pointing to Bernier as the only option out there to represent the true libertarian…

 

[suffolkowner]

can we give Harper another kick at the can? He might not be conservative enough for some now. Joe Clark would have as much chance in todays party as Charest

 

[QV]

Seems some take the simple route pointing to Bernier as the only option out there to represent the true libertarian…

Happy to look at other options. And I won’t disparage you from pointing it out either.

 

[Remius]

can we give Harper another kick at the can? He might not be conservative enough for some now. Joe Clark would have as much chance in todays party as Charest

His own party as it stands would likely reject him.

 

[Lance Wiebe]

I'm having a particularly hard time trying to figure out why PP is considered the front runner.
The only thing I can figure is name recognition, he's had his name is the news a lot more than his opponents over the last few years. It might work, it worked for our current PM.
Aitchison has the most thought out platform, and one I can get behind. It's unfortunate that virtually everyone says he hasn't got any hope of becoming leader. Still, he's going to be at or near the top of my ranked ballot.

 

[TacticalTea]

SNC Lavalin/AG

I don't want to divert the thread too much but it is strange to me that some conservatives tried to run so much mileage on this. There was no better option. If you're gonna go the criminal route, you go after the individuals, which they already had. With a corporation, it's much more effective to take administrative measures and assert a better control than what the criminal justice system allows. It's also much more efficient.

Haha yup. Should we not aim high when discussing the potential leaders of the country?

From this pool Aitchison's not far off, though completely unproven. From the broader caucus, I'd like to think I voted for one among the backbenchers. Some of you likely know him.

I liked him during the debate. Two fundamental issues that make him unacceptable however: 1. "our team will have a real plan to fight climate change. But we will never support a carbon tax." That's 1980s talk. 40 years late. If your plan is to have a plan, you've failed already, and voters will see right through it. 2. ''Bill 21 is wrong, and Scott will stand against it.'' I don't give a cr*p. Focus on keeping the country together. You want to fight on provincial issues? Run in a provincial riding.

So, despite his Huawei affair, I think Charest remains the best candidate. Working for Huawei, he acted in his personal capacity, there's nothing there, in my view, that is relevant to politics unless some evidence of actual malfeasance is uncovered.

He has the best understanding of the federation. The guy single-handedly saved the country in '95, and has lead one of its provinces for a long time, I don't think anyone is better qualified to lead it. And I say that, mind you, as someone who strongly disliked him as provincial premier, as well as, admittedly, someone who falls squarely in the PC part of CPC.

 

[Remius]

I don't want to divert the thread too much but it is strange to me that some conservatives tried to run so much mileage on this. There was no better option. If you're gonna go the criminal route, you go after the individuals, which they already had. With a corporation, it's much more effective to take administrative measures and assert a better control than what the criminal justice system allows. It's also much more efficient.



I liked him during the debate. Two fundamental issues that make him unacceptable however: 1. "our team will have a real plan to fight climate change. But we will never support a carbon tax." That's 1980s talk. 40 years late. If your plan is to have a plan, you've failed already, and voters will see right through it. 2. ''Bill 21 is wrong, and Scott will stand against it.'' I don't give a cr*p. Focus on keeping the country together. You want to fight on provincial issues? Run in a provincial riding.

So, despite his Huawei affair, I think Charest remains the best candidate. Working for Huawei, he acted in his personal capacity, there's nothing there, in my view, that is relevant to politics unless some evidence of actual malfeasance is uncovered.

He has the best understanding of the federation. The guy single-handedly saved the country in '95, and has lead one of its provinces for a long time, I don't think anyone is better qualified to lead it. And I say that, mind you, as someone who strongly disliked him as provincial premier, as well as, admittedly, someone who falls squarely in the PC part of CPC.

Charest pretty much won the French debate tonight from my observation. Not sure it makes a difference though but he was on his A game.

 

[brihard]

I'm having a particularly hard time trying to figure out why PP is considered the front runner.
The only thing I can figure is name recognition, he's had his name is the news a lot more than his opponents over the last few years. It might work, it worked for our current PM.
Aitchison has the most thought out platform, and one I can get behind. It's unfortunate that virtually everyone says he hasn't got any hope of becoming leader. Still, he's going to be at or near the top of my ranked ballot.

PP has been prominently employed as an attack dog. He sinks his teeth in well during question period. But attacking your opposition and highlighting perceived failings to a standard of sound bytes or tweets is not the same think as presenting your own sound and viable alternatives. That needs to be proven independently, regardless of one’s demonstrated ability to take shots at the other guy.

 

[IKnowNothing]

I liked him during the debate. Two fundamental issues that make him unacceptable however: 1. "our team will have a real plan to fight climate change. But we will never support a carbon tax." That's 1980s talk. 40 years late. If your plan is to have a plan, you've failed already, and voters will see right through it. 2. ''Bill 21 is wrong, and Scott will stand against it.'' I don't give a cr*p. Focus on keeping the country together. You want to fight on provincial issues? Run in a provincial riding.

So, despite his Huawei affair, I think Charest remains the best candidate. Working for Huawei, he acted in his personal capacity, there's nothing there, in my view, that is relevant to politics unless some evidence of actual malfeasance is uncovered.

He has the best understanding of the federation. The guy single-handedly saved the country in '95, and has lead one of its provinces for a long time, I don't think anyone is better qualified to lead it. And I say that, mind you, as someone who strongly disliked him as provincial premier, as well as, admittedly, someone who falls squarely in the PC part of CPC.

Re: Aitchison, honestly his platform is nothing special. It's the pragmatism, temperament, and party direction that I like. Brains to not get sucked into the bs, balls to tell the base its bs, and desire to bring discourse back to one of debate to find solutions rather than shouting to score points. I want a leader that can work with other parties, that can see the MP's across the floor as fellow Canadians that just have a different idea of what is right for the country rather than blood enemies and an existential threat. I think Charest has that, and with his experience is the better candidate. It's just unfortunate that he comes with a lot of baggage.

Frankly, it doesn't matter what PP's platform is. Barring an extremely unlikely majority, he's going to have to work with others to get things done. Unfortunately building a brand as a smarmy combative dick has its cost down the line. How long does a PP lead minority hold confidence? Does a PP lead minority even get a chance to form government, or does shit really hit the fan when the rest of the parties sit down and collectively reject him to form a coalition?

 

[The Bread Guy]

... attacking your opposition and highlighting perceived failings to a standard of sound bytes or tweets is not the same think as presenting your own sound and viable alternatives ...

... or governing. That's why I feel the "professional attack dog" fits PP's (known) strengths than the whole governing and party management stuff. We'll see, though.

 

[GK .Dundas]

Re: Aitchison, honestly his platform is nothing special. It's the pragmatism, temperament, and party direction that I like. Brains to not get sucked into the bs, balls to tell the base its bs, and desire to bring discourse back to one of debate to find solutions rather than shouting to score points. I want a leader that can work with other parties, that can see the MP's across the floor as fellow Canadians that just have a different idea of what is right for the country rather than blood enemies and an existential threat. I think Charest has that, and with his experience is the better candidate. It's just unfortunate that he comes with a lot of baggage.

Frankly, it doesn't matter what PP's platform is. Barring an extremely unlikely majority, he's going to have to work with others to get things done. Unfortunately building a brand as a smarmy combative dick has its cost down the line. How long does a PP lead minority hold confidence? Does a PP lead minority even get a chance to form government, or does shit really hit the fan when the rest of the parties sit down and collectively reject him to form a coalition?

Well you're obviously some sort commie pinko.
Seriously, you're unfortunately a part of the minority/majority.
I call it that because at one time people like you actually did have more control of the party before the loons either shouted you down or forced you out.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Centrists need to ask themselves what part they played in driving the "loons" to take over, and follow up asking what they can do themselves to change. Populism is just appeal to the masses. Why don't the centrists appeal to the masses? Did they lose their appeal; if so, why? Could they gain/regain appeal; how?

Populists usually gain traction when established centrist factions go on ignoring too many people for too long.