2022 CPC Leadership Discussion: Et tu Redeux

[AmmoTech90]

I don't think the CPC membership is going to go for a eastern based MP without the strong SOCON roots.

He's from Calgary and I'm sure he would be quite willing to leverage that fact in a leadership race.

 

[Good2Golf]

Not sure what needs to be clarified.

Abortion is a medical procedure. The practice of medicine is regulated by the provinces.

Once upon a time, providing abortion in Canada was criminal. Morgentaler struck this down on Charter grounds, albeit with the court divided on precisely why. Nonetheless, the Criminal Code section outlawing it was struck down. It is therefore not an offence to get an abortion. Theoretically a government could pass a new law on the matter since the Morgentaler decision resulted in no binding precedent due to the judge split. I think, however, that in the past couple decades we have likely moved as a society well away from where this would be politically survivable.

There’s no lingering, unresolved legal question on this. A party would have to be dumb enough to try to re-criminalize it for there to be such a question. It would be a race to see if the courts or the legislature would reverse it first.

Sorry, should have been clearer. I was commenting specifically on the internal politics of the CPC and the combatting factions, such that the party has not to my knowledge ever explicitly said that it’s position mirrors that of Canadian law. I think the LPC last had a member’s bill proposing for a re-criminalization of at least a portion of the abortion spectrum in the mid-2000s, but not since.

 

[brihard]

The cynical part of this is, the Left could explicitly legalize it as well.

But they leave it undefined as bait so the second someone (CPC) suggest doing anything the LPC can pounce on them.

It is explicitly legal. Anything is in the absence of a law making it illegal. While the Criminal Code does carry some “it is not an offense to…” provisions, the absence of same does not in and of itself out the legality of an act in doubt.

 

[Good2Golf]

He's from Calgary and I'm sure he would be quite willing to leverage that fact in a leadership race.

And has consistently won his riding by healthy margins in the Nation’s Capital Region amongst a sea of red…

 

[KevinB]

It is explicitly legal. Anything is in the absence of a law making it illegal. While the Criminal Code does carry some “it is not an offense to…” provisions, the absence of same does not in and of itself out the legality of an act in doubt.

Because Canadian Law makes so much sense...

When child becomes human being

• 223 (1) A child becomes a human being within the meaning of this Act when it has completely proceeded, in a living state, from the body of its mother, whether or not
  
  • (a) it has breathed;
  • (b) it has an independent circulation; or
  • (c) the navel string is severed.
• Marginal note:Killing child
  (2) A person commits homicide when he causes injury to a child before or during its birth as a result of which the child dies after becoming a human being.

So you can pummel a pregnant woman - and as long as the the child dies inside the woman who is pregnant - you can't be charged with a homicide related to the death of the child -- just the assault on the woman who was carrying the baby...

Oh Canada, you really make me want to puke these days.

 

[Altair]

It is explicitly legal. Anything is in the absence of a law making it illegal. While the Criminal Code does carry some “it is not an offense to…” provisions, the absence of same does not in and of itself out the legality of an act in doubt.

Yes, its not illegal.

But they could just take that next step, akin to the the Civil Marriage Act in 2005, the abortion act or something of the like.

They haven't. The courts knocked down the previous bans and nothing has been done since.

 

[Altair]

Because Canadian Law makes so much sense...

When child becomes human being

• 223 (1) A child becomes a human being within the meaning of this Act when it has completely proceeded, in a living state, from the body of its mother, whether or not
  
  • (a) it has breathed;
  • (b) it has an independent circulation; or
  • (c) the navel string is severed.
• Marginal note:Killing child
  (2) A person commits homicide when he causes injury to a child before or during its birth as a result of which the child dies after becoming a human being.

So you can pummel a pregnant woman - and as long as the the child dies inside the woman who is pregnant - you can't be charged with a homicide related to the death of the child -- just the assault on the woman who was carrying the baby...

Oh Canada, you really make me want to puke these days.

No worries, maybe the next CPC leader makes this their headline issue.

 

[brihard]

Because Canadian Law makes so much sense...

When child becomes human being

• 223 (1) A child becomes a human being within the meaning of this Act when it has completely proceeded, in a living state, from the body of its mother, whether or not
  
  • (a) it has breathed;
  • (b) it has an independent circulation; or
  • (c) the navel string is severed.
• Marginal note:Killing child
  (2) A person commits homicide when he causes injury to a child before or during its birth as a result of which the child dies after becoming a human being.

So you can pummel a pregnant woman - and as long as the the child dies inside the woman who is pregnant - you can't be charged with a homicide related to the death of the child -- just the assault on the woman who was carrying the baby...

Oh Canada, you really make me want to puke these days.

Yes, that’s right, but it would be a hell of an aggravated assault sentencing. The law is quite clear.

 

[KevinB]

No worries, maybe the next CPC leader makes this their headline issue.

I don't vote in Canada anymore - so until the invasion no one needs to listen to my opinion.

 

[Altair]

I don't vote in Canada anymore - so until the invasion no one needs to listen to my opinion.

You know we all care very much about your opinion Kevin.

 

[brihard]

You know we all care very much about your opinion Kevin.

Some of us do. He has a solid head on his shoulders coupled with a breadth of experiences and perspectives, some borne of living outside of Canada while still caring a lot about what happens here. I don’t always agree with the guy, but I do always listen to what he had to say.

 

[KevinB]

FWIW, I totally understand that abortion issues are a colossal minefield politically in Canada (and down here too, and it's going to be an interesting year this year down here for that).
I have my own beliefs on what is ethical and moral, but I don't usually try to force them down peoples throats.
I do find it extremely interesting that the "rights of everyone" crowd don't seem to include the unborn, but I guess that's the original cancel culture.

Bringing up Abortion as an issue for a Canadian Politician is a lose-lose proposition, kind of like white soldiers PeaceKeeping in Africa.
Not matter what you do, others will damn you to hell.

 

[MilEME09]

Conservatives name Candice Bergen as interim leader after O'Toole voted out

The Conservative Party of Canada has named Candice Bergen as interim leader following a private vote late Wednesday evening.

www.ctvnews.ca

and here we go, Candice Bergen is the interim leader

 

[The Bread Guy]

I don't vote in Canada anymore - so until the invasion no one needs to listen to my opinion.

 

[KevinB]

View attachment 68457

I don't believe in open carry -- I like to have surprise on my side...

 

[Remius]

And has consistently won his riding by healthy margins in the Nation’s Capital Region amongst a sea of red…

Most yes. There was the one in 2015 that was quite close considering his significant margins prior to. Was only won by 2000 votes. Compare that to 20k previously.

 

[brihard]

Conservatives name Candice Bergen as interim leader after O'Toole voted out

The Conservative Party of Canada has named Candice Bergen as interim leader following a private vote late Wednesday evening.

www.ctvnews.ca

and here we go, Candice Bergen is the interim leader

Oh good. They picked someone most recently known for a photograph of her literally wearing a MAGA hat. No own-goal there at all.

 

[Altair]

Oh good. They picked someone most recently known for a photograph of her literally wearing a MAGA hat. No own-goal there at all.

Its pretty clever actually.

Its signaling which path the party wants to take without officially saying which path the party wants to take.

Which only makes me think Poilievre should be feeling about as confident as Peter Mackay or Maxime Bernier did at this point in their leadership races.

 

[Kat Stevens]

Pretty smart, makes her interim leader during a minority govt. Takes her out of the running for leader before the next election.

 

[QV]

Oh good. They picked someone most recently known for a photograph of her literally wearing a MAGA hat. No own-goal there at all.

It wouldn’t matter who they picked. There will always be people and media picking it apart.