Op IMPACT: CAF in the Iraq & Syria crisis
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Colin Parkinson
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Interestingly Chin Peng in his book “My side of history” he explicitly states that when in Beijing, he was told that the Chinese did have a “domino theory” at work for SE Asia, but they also chastised him for starting a revolution without the “proper conditions for success”.
Eye In The Sky
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Our forces in the Middle East deserve clarity. Now
On Saturday, two Canadian CF-18 jets dropped precision guided bombs on an Islamic State (ISIL) fighting position near the Iraqi city of Ramadi. Two days before that, it was a pair of Canadian jets bombing ISIL forces near Fallujah. The day before that, an enemy munitions production centre near ISIL-occupied Palmyra, Syria.
All in all, that was a pretty typical week for the Canadian military contingent in the Middle East. As of Jan. 30, the air group deployed there has conducted more than 2,000 sorties (one plane carrying out one mission constitutes one sortie) against ISIL. About 60 per cent of those sorties have been by the fighters, with the balance conducted by our refuelling and reconnaissance planes. It’s not a gigantic effort, by international or historical standards, but it’s a conspicuously large one considering no one seems to know why the planes are still there at all.
It’s becoming almost trite to repeat this, but, once more with feeling, the Liberals, while campaigning last fall, pledged to end the combat mission in the Middle East. The jets would come home — or the CF-18s would, at any rate. It’s possible that the refuellers and recon planes would stay. The Liberals gave every sign that they’d maintain the small ground training mission — non-combat, except for the odd defensive skirmish — and might even enhance it, along with ramping up humanitarian support to those directly impacted by ISIL’s rampage across the region. But the main thing, and there was no ambiguity here, was that the combat mission would end. The CF-18s would come home.
A decision will apparently be made in the weeks to come. Fine. Thing is, a Liberal decision on the jets seems to be Ottawa’s version of the quest for sustainable fusion power — 20 or so years away … just like 20 years ago and 20 years before that.
In all things, I strive to be reasonable. I don’t expect the Liberals to immediately master every file, and it’s fair to point out that timing was against them. Elected in late October, they didn’t take office until the first week of November. Then the government was occupied by a series of international conferences that Canada had already committed to, and which would have required a lot of attention no matter which party had won on Oct. 19. By the time those were done, it was Christmas, and most of January would have been taken over by putting final touches on full-time staffs, returning to Parliament, and all the various other things that new governments have to do. Getting a government going requires time even in optimal conditions, and for all the reasons above, these conditions were not optimal.
But enough is enough. The military is not just another unit of the civil service, and troops operating in war zones are not akin to bureaucrats punching the clock until they get clear new mandates from their ministers. Our military forces in the Middle East are in danger. The danger is not huge — we aren’t sending infantry into trenches to clear them out with bayonets and grenades — but you simply can’t put troops on the ground, or planes in the air, during a war without incurring very real risks.
Canada has already lost one soldier in Iraq. Andrew Doiron, a special forces soldier assigned to the training mission, died almost a year ago after a friendly fire incident. This is tragic, but part of what putting boots on the ground — even non-combat boots — means. There have been also at least two instances where our soldiers have directly engaged the enemy after being caught up in battles that overran their positions. No Canadians have died, but that’s as much a matter of luck as training and equipment.
If we’re going to ask our personnel to be separated from their families, they need to know the government believes they’re over there for a purpose.
As to the jets, while ISIL isn’t believed to have any air defences of note, jets just sometimes … break down. A Canadian jet could easily be forced to land in hostile territory, or a pilot with a broken plane could bailout and come down behind enemy lines. Consider that for a moment. We know what ISIL does to captured enemy personnel. They’ve sent us the videos.
I would never suggest that any Canadian government would be careless or callous with the lives of our military personnel, or that soldiers should never be put in danger. That’s what they sign up for. But I do suggest that this government has put off a decision as long as it can.
If our military forces are going to be put in harm’s way, it’s unacceptable for any government, even a relatively new one, to be anything less than clear about what the mission is. If we’re going to ask our personnel to be separated from their families, they need to know the government believes they’re over there for a purpose. The new government needed time. That’s fair, but it’s had it. Make a decision.
Our forces in the Middle East deserve clarity. Now
On Saturday, two Canadian CF-18 jets dropped precision guided bombs on an Islamic State (ISIL) fighting position near the Iraqi city of Ramadi. Two days before that, it was a pair of Canadian jets bombing ISIL forces near Fallujah. The day before that, an enemy munitions production centre near ISIL-occupied Palmyra, Syria.
All in all, that was a pretty typical week for the Canadian military contingent in the Middle East. As of Jan. 30, the air group deployed there has conducted more than 2,000 sorties (one plane carrying out one mission constitutes one sortie) against ISIL. About 60 per cent of those sorties have been by the fighters, with the balance conducted by our refuelling and reconnaissance planes. It’s not a gigantic effort, by international or historical standards, but it’s a conspicuously large one considering no one seems to know why the planes are still there at all.
It’s becoming almost trite to repeat this, but, once more with feeling, the Liberals, while campaigning last fall, pledged to end the combat mission in the Middle East. The jets would come home — or the CF-18s would, at any rate. It’s possible that the refuellers and recon planes would stay. The Liberals gave every sign that they’d maintain the small ground training mission — non-combat, except for the odd defensive skirmish — and might even enhance it, along with ramping up humanitarian support to those directly impacted by ISIL’s rampage across the region. But the main thing, and there was no ambiguity here, was that the combat mission would end. The CF-18s would come home.
A decision will apparently be made in the weeks to come. Fine. Thing is, a Liberal decision on the jets seems to be Ottawa’s version of the quest for sustainable fusion power — 20 or so years away … just like 20 years ago and 20 years before that.
In all things, I strive to be reasonable. I don’t expect the Liberals to immediately master every file, and it’s fair to point out that timing was against them. Elected in late October, they didn’t take office until the first week of November. Then the government was occupied by a series of international conferences that Canada had already committed to, and which would have required a lot of attention no matter which party had won on Oct. 19. By the time those were done, it was Christmas, and most of January would have been taken over by putting final touches on full-time staffs, returning to Parliament, and all the various other things that new governments have to do. Getting a government going requires time even in optimal conditions, and for all the reasons above, these conditions were not optimal.
But enough is enough. The military is not just another unit of the civil service, and troops operating in war zones are not akin to bureaucrats punching the clock until they get clear new mandates from their ministers. Our military forces in the Middle East are in danger. The danger is not huge — we aren’t sending infantry into trenches to clear them out with bayonets and grenades — but you simply can’t put troops on the ground, or planes in the air, during a war without incurring very real risks.
Canada has already lost one soldier in Iraq. Andrew Doiron, a special forces soldier assigned to the training mission, died almost a year ago after a friendly fire incident. This is tragic, but part of what putting boots on the ground — even non-combat boots — means. There have been also at least two instances where our soldiers have directly engaged the enemy after being caught up in battles that overran their positions. No Canadians have died, but that’s as much a matter of luck as training and equipment.
If we’re going to ask our personnel to be separated from their families, they need to know the government believes they’re over there for a purpose.
As to the jets, while ISIL isn’t believed to have any air defences of note, jets just sometimes … break down. A Canadian jet could easily be forced to land in hostile territory, or a pilot with a broken plane could bailout and come down behind enemy lines. Consider that for a moment. We know what ISIL does to captured enemy personnel. They’ve sent us the videos.
I would never suggest that any Canadian government would be careless or callous with the lives of our military personnel, or that soldiers should never be put in danger. That’s what they sign up for. But I do suggest that this government has put off a decision as long as it can.
If our military forces are going to be put in harm’s way, it’s unacceptable for any government, even a relatively new one, to be anything less than clear about what the mission is. If we’re going to ask our personnel to be separated from their families, they need to know the government believes they’re over there for a purpose. The new government needed time. That’s fair, but it’s had it. Make a decision.
Eye In The Sky
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Attention: Latest News - Air operations
As of 31 January 2016, Air Task Force-Iraq conducted 2096 sorties:
•CF-188 Hornet fighters conducted 1338 sorties;
•CC-150T Polaris aerial refueller conducted 365 sorties, delivering some 21,397,000 pounds of fuel to coalition aircraft; and
•CP-140 Aurora aircraft conducted 393 reconnaissance missions.
Definition - sortie: In air operations, a sortie refers to an operational flight by one aircraft. A sortie starts when one aircraft takes off and ends upon landing.
As of 31 January 2016, Air Task Force-Iraq conducted 2096 sorties:
•CF-188 Hornet fighters conducted 1338 sorties;
•CC-150T Polaris aerial refueller conducted 365 sorties, delivering some 21,397,000 pounds of fuel to coalition aircraft; and
•CP-140 Aurora aircraft conducted 393 reconnaissance missions.
Definition - sortie: In air operations, a sortie refers to an operational flight by one aircraft. A sortie starts when one aircraft takes off and ends upon landing.
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Blah. One thing that is consistently clear about Canada and war fighting in the past 2 decades is that nothing is, or ever will be, clear. Stop dragging the families into it, the guy is just setting up the next "I told you so" play.
Eye In The Sky
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The families are 'in it' though, and for a smaller % of the total # of JTF-I folks [the ones married to the aircrew folks], they are the ones who have their sons/daughters/wives/husbands/moms/dads, etc going into theatre.
I know, some (most?) people outside the air force, and even some in it, think that flying is an easy job. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. There is always a risk you are going to put 'er down before making homeplate, part of the job. It's a bit more hairy if you consider how much of the LOAC and Geneva Convention, etc that ISIS adheres to.
Keeping that in mind, the families of those who worked 'outside the wire' when we were in Afghanistan probably worried and were 'in it', much the same as the families of the RCAF folks who are working over The Badlands are 'in it' now.
I don't think he is setting anything up. :2c:
The guy is talking about reality; not just for the people doing the flying, but also for the ones who are waiting for them back home.
I know, some (most?) people outside the air force, and even some in it, think that flying is an easy job. Sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't. There is always a risk you are going to put 'er down before making homeplate, part of the job. It's a bit more hairy if you consider how much of the LOAC and Geneva Convention, etc that ISIS adheres to.
Keeping that in mind, the families of those who worked 'outside the wire' when we were in Afghanistan probably worried and were 'in it', much the same as the families of the RCAF folks who are working over The Badlands are 'in it' now.
I don't think he is setting anything up. :2c:
The guy is talking about reality; not just for the people doing the flying, but also for the ones who are waiting for them back home.
Wow! Consider the implications of the International Development Minister announcing that the details of our new operation against ISIS will be revealed soon. This is posted under the Fair Dealing provisions of the Copyright Act.
Liberals to unveil new Iraq, Syria mission within days
LEE BERTHIAUME, OTTAWA CITIZEN
Published on: February 4, 2016 | Last Updated: February 4, 2016 5:35 PM EST
The Liberal government will unveil its new plan for fighting the Islamic State in days.
International Development Minister Marie-Claude Bibeau confirmed the pending announcement in a telephone call with reporters from London Thursday. She said Prime Minister Justin Trudeau will present the plan with her, Foreign Minister Stephane Dion and Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan.
“We’re talking about days,” she said. “We really want to announce a holistic approach and this includes all our contributions in terms of military, in terms of diplomacy and in terms of humanitarian assistance and development. So it’s important for us to do it together, and we’ll do so.”
Bibeau would not provide specifics, including whether the plan will be presented before a NATO defence ministers’ meeting in Brussels next week, which will focus on the war against ISIL. The two-day meeting begins Feb. 10.
Six Canadian fighter jets have been bombing ISIL targets in Iraq since October 2014. The mission was expanded to include Syria in March 2015. Canada also has two surveillance aircraft and a refuelling plane operating in the two countries, and 69 commandos training Kurdish forces in northern Iraq.
During the election campaign, the Liberals committed to withdraw the fighter jets, but have said they will expand Canada’s fight against the Islamic State in other ways. The government has previously suggested it will keep its other aircraft in the region, and expand the number of Canadian military trainers on the ground.
The government has also said that the new plan will be focused not just on fighting ISIL militarily, but also politically and through development assistance. Bibeau was in London taking part in a Syrian refugee donor conference, but would not yet say what additional money Canada is prepared to offer.
Sajjan told a foreign policy conference last week that the government was taking its time deciding on a new mission to ensure Canada’s contribution was both meaningful and wouldn’t make things worse. He has previously called for better intelligence and an approach that deals with the region, not just Iraq and Syria.
Dion told the same conference that the Liberal government’s plan would focus not only on Iraq and Syria, but also on Lebanon and Jordan. Canada has been accepting thousands of Syrian refugees from Lebanon and Jordan, which have been overwhelmed with asylum-seekers, and has provided other support to the countries.
It’s unlikely that the new plan will involve any escalation in direct military action against ISIL. Aside from promising to stop the bombing of ISIL targets, Trudeau has previously worried that any on-the-ground involvement would draw Canada into a Middle East quagmire from which there would be no easy escape.
Liberals to unveil new Iraq, Syria mission within days
LEE BERTHIAUME, OTTAWA CITIZEN
Published on: February 4, 2016 | Last Updated: February 4, 2016 5:35 PM EST
The Liberal government will unveil its new plan for fighting the Islamic State in days.
International Development Minister Marie-Claude Bibeau confirmed the pending announcement in a telephone call with reporters from London Thursday. She said Prime Minister Justin Trudeau will present the plan with her, Foreign Minister Stephane Dion and Defence Minister Harjit Sajjan.
“We’re talking about days,” she said. “We really want to announce a holistic approach and this includes all our contributions in terms of military, in terms of diplomacy and in terms of humanitarian assistance and development. So it’s important for us to do it together, and we’ll do so.”
Bibeau would not provide specifics, including whether the plan will be presented before a NATO defence ministers’ meeting in Brussels next week, which will focus on the war against ISIL. The two-day meeting begins Feb. 10.
Six Canadian fighter jets have been bombing ISIL targets in Iraq since October 2014. The mission was expanded to include Syria in March 2015. Canada also has two surveillance aircraft and a refuelling plane operating in the two countries, and 69 commandos training Kurdish forces in northern Iraq.
During the election campaign, the Liberals committed to withdraw the fighter jets, but have said they will expand Canada’s fight against the Islamic State in other ways. The government has previously suggested it will keep its other aircraft in the region, and expand the number of Canadian military trainers on the ground.
The government has also said that the new plan will be focused not just on fighting ISIL militarily, but also politically and through development assistance. Bibeau was in London taking part in a Syrian refugee donor conference, but would not yet say what additional money Canada is prepared to offer.
Sajjan told a foreign policy conference last week that the government was taking its time deciding on a new mission to ensure Canada’s contribution was both meaningful and wouldn’t make things worse. He has previously called for better intelligence and an approach that deals with the region, not just Iraq and Syria.
Dion told the same conference that the Liberal government’s plan would focus not only on Iraq and Syria, but also on Lebanon and Jordan. Canada has been accepting thousands of Syrian refugees from Lebanon and Jordan, which have been overwhelmed with asylum-seekers, and has provided other support to the countries.
It’s unlikely that the new plan will involve any escalation in direct military action against ISIL. Aside from promising to stop the bombing of ISIL targets, Trudeau has previously worried that any on-the-ground involvement would draw Canada into a Middle East quagmire from which there would be no easy escape.
Eye In The Sky
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Old Sweat said:
Getting some basic facts straight would be nice. :
Diplomacy with ISIS; can't wait to see the plan for that.
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Diplomacy legitimizes their leadership. They're nothing more than barbarians, trying to use Islam to cover their desire to brutalize and control people. What an absolute joke.
J
jollyjacktar
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A "holistic" approach... That sounds very hugs and kisses like. A round of Kumbyah everybody. :
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It could also be one man's "holistic" is another man's "whole of government" - you know, a mix of fighting (or helping fight), training and helping.jollyjacktar said:A "holistic" approach... That sounds very hugs and kisses like. A round of Kumbyah everybody. :
Dare to dream ...Eye In The Sky said:Getting some basic facts straight would be nice. :
IF that's the case, :facepalm:Eye In The Sky said:
Eye In The Sky
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Remius said:
Maybe I got the context wrong...
:dunno:
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Eye In The Sky said:
I think it's easy to read into the statement "in terms of diplomacy" that theya re talking about direct diplomoacy with ISIS; especially given that they seemingly have said such (ridiculus) things before.
However, giving the benefit of the doubt, it's also easy to think they are talking about diplmoacy amongst everybody else; ie influencing what the international community is doing. That has been going on from the start, and the minute it stops we have a much bigger problem.
You know better than I it is a complex situation, with people lining up in all corners, some in more than one at the same time:
- ISIS, supported by no-one (internationally), but with plenty of sympathizers everywhere
- Iraq, ie the country, supported by the US
- Other Iraqi opposition, supported by? Maybe Iran, who has a dog in their as well?
- The Kurds, pretty much on thier own, and with Turkey trying to use the opportunity to smash them
- Other Syrian opposition, supported by the US and Allies (but not all of them by everybody, eg Turkey has a choice)
- The Syrian Government, supported by Russia
Just those last two scare me; it goes the wrong way and we have a bigger problem.
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Eye In The Sky said:
You did get the context wrong, they definitely mean working with other partners in the region through diplomatic channels. On a personal level I'm furious, on a professional level I don't really care. Canadians voted for this government, they can live with the consequences of their actions for the next four years.
The average Canadian just doesn't care about the Middle East or the Military, it really is that simple. We're the New Zealand of the North, piggy backing off our next door neighbour.
I thought the air mission was a worthy cause and I thought that the fact we were helping the Kurds was even more awesome, they're possibly one of the few groups actually worth supporting over there.
Eye In The Sky
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Baz said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Db_qXKBle08
Eye In The Sky
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Humphrey Bogart said:
Copy that, thanks for clearing up my take on the statement. I am far from anything close to an expert on the ME and how governments do their business, having grown up and existed in the tactical level almost exclusively over 26 years in the mob.
Great thing about this site, you learn something new pretty much every day.
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That said, thanks for sharing (more than just) a bit more than what we read in the media to give us the REST of the story of the mission underway.Eye In The Sky said:
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