Iran Super Thread- Merged

[CanuckTroop]

Can we help you out with the airfare?  I'm sure you would be wlecomed with open arms in Tehran... :

I was being sarcastic. Are you saying you would support an attack on Iran, a democratically elected government, seeking nuclear tech just like the rest of us? Would you die or send your troops to possibly be killed for US foreign policy? Let's hear some debate. I wanna know if ANYONE would actually support this action.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

I am betting I will be told to not "feed the trolls", but here goes.

I was being sarcastic. Are you saying you would support an attack on Iran, a democratically elected government, seeking nuclear tech just like the rest of us? Would you die or send your troops to possibly be killed for US foreign policy? Let's hear some debate. I wanna know if ANYONE would actually support this action.

Okay, first, you call yourself CanuckTroop.  You are telling us that you are a member of the CF, and even a member of the Armoured Corp?  So fill in your profile and indicate to which unit you owe allegiance.  I find it very difficult to believe anyone who has real military experience would post as you have been. 
Next, the reason to deal with Iran is because they DONT have nukes yet.  N Korea does, so it is a much more difficult situation.  In simple terms:  A country that has a nuclear bomb, can USE a nuclear bomb.  If a country does NOT have a nuclear bomb, they cannot USE a nuclear bomb.  See how that works?
The only country that is putting itself in a corner is Iran.  They are the ones that started with the anti-Israel talk and made comments about the death of that nation.  How is that supposed to be taken?  Iran is trying to take the spiritual lead in the middle east, and they are rolling some very dangerous dice. 
Last, only a complete donkey would suggest nuclear proliferation as a solution to middle east conflict.  If Iran is getting big milage with anti-Israel TALK, how "cool" would they be if they nuked Tel Aviv?  And don't forget, Israel HAS nukes.  Two decades after the end of the cold war, we really need to see a nuclear exchange?  Stick to playing HALO on your X-Box, champ.  I'm sure you are a very effective "troop" there.

 

[Peacenik]

CanuckTroop, You've bought into Iranian propaganda.  There is no doubt that they are after the bomb. 
There are several proven, and more economical routes to generate nuclear power... the fact that they
are pursuing uranium enrichment means they want the bomb.

Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.  The only remaining question is whether we have the political will
to go, how we do it, and when...

 

[CanuckTroop]

CanuckTroop, You've bought into Iranian propaganda.  There is no doubt that they are after the bomb. 
There are several proven, and more economical routes to generate nuclear power... the fact that they
are pursuing uranium enrichment means they want the bomb.

Don't delude yourself into thinking otherwise.  The only remaining question is whether we have the political will
to go, how we do it, and when...

You have to enrich uranium to make it useful for ANYTHING, including nuclear power (under 5%). It's all you guys that seem to be buying into US propaganda. Iran has said that they would allow "intrusive" IAEA inspections as long as can keep a peaceful program for nuclear power- so everyone would know if they were trying to make a bomb anyway. This is all US government hype and only the ignorant masses are buying into it.

 

[tomahawk6]

Actually its the ignorant folks on the left that have bought into Iran's Big Lie. Unless they are stopped they will have nuclear weapons. Based on their rhetoric they will use them or just by threatening to use nuclear weapons they could force oil prices over $100 a barrel, which is unacceptable as well.

 

[CanuckTroop]

Actually its the ignorant folks on the left that have bought into Iran's Big Lie. Unless they are stopped they will have nuclear weapons. Based on their rhetoric they will use them or just by threatening to use nuclear weapons they could force oil prices over $100 a barrel, which is unacceptable as well.

Who cares if they get nuclear weapons? Israel has enough.

 

[CanuckTroop]

I am betting I will be told to not "feed the trolls", but here goes.
Okay, first, you call yourself CanuckTroop.  You are telling us that you are a member of the CF, and even a member of the Armoured Corp?  So fill in your profile and indicate to which unit you owe allegiance.  I find it very difficult to believe anyone who has real military experience would post as you have been. 
Next, the reason to deal with Iran is because they DONT have nukes yet.  N Korea does, so it is a much more difficult situation.  In simple terms:  A country that has a nuclear bomb, can USE a nuclear bomb.  If a country does NOT have a nuclear bomb, they cannot USE a nuclear bomb.  See how that works?
The only country that is putting itself in a corner is Iran.  They are the ones that started with the anti-Israel talk and made comments about the death of that nation.  How is that supposed to be taken?  Iran is trying to take the spiritual lead in the middle east, and they are rolling some very dangerous dice. 
Last, only a complete donkey would suggest nuclear proliferation as a solution to middle east conflict.  If Iran is getting big milage with anti-Israel TALK, how "cool" would they be if they nuked Tel Aviv?  And don't forget, Israel HAS nukes.  Two decades after the end of the cold war, we really need to see a nuclear exchange?  Stick to playing HALO on your X-Box, champ.  I'm sure you are a very effective "troop" there.

I'm a former reserve infantry member. You can take it or leave it cab driver. Ask me some skill testing question if you really need to, or shut your pie hole.

As far as the topic of discussion goes. Yes I guess that makes me a donkey, because I believe Iran has the same right to nuclear power as anywhere else on earth. Fossil fuels are coming to an end in the not so distant future and every other country is ramping up it's nuclear power capabilty. Just look at the price of uranium right now, or the number of Candu reactors we're selling worldwide. How can the United States, or any other country, tell an independant nation "you are not allowed to continue research" into something that Iran and the rest of us WILL need regardless at some point. This whole Bush doctrine of attacking anywhere that threatens Israel or oil supplies thing is such a joke and it sickens me that there are so many buying into it. I thought Canadians, especially military members, were smarter than this.

As far as Israel goes, they have enough nukes to defend themselves. IMO they shouldn't be in the middle east anyway, since they are a failed concoction of the UN and not a real country. I agree with the arabs on this. Move them to Northern Ontario or something and put them out of our misery.

I only hope there are some more enlightened CF members out there that can use their own grey matter rather than handing that over to politicians. As far as I recall, when you get your commission, you don't sign away your brain as well. Of course being an LT Zipper head oughtta know that.

 

[Franko]

I'm a former reserve infantry member. You can take it or leave it cab driver. Ask me some skill testing question if you really need to, or shut your pie hole.

Lose the attitude or I'll punt you right now. There is no need of this type of diatribe here at all.

You don't want to fill out your profile, so be it...."Former Reserve Infanteer" it is then.

You're attitude, thusfar, has reveiled enough that most of the senior posters will place you on ignore.

For someone who joined this site not even 2 days ago you're already on the radar of every mod here.

You're on the ramp with out a chute right now....how's that for a skill testing question.    :

Regards

 

[CanuckTroop]

Lose the attitude or I'll punt you right now. There is no need of this type of diatribe here at all.

You don't want to fill out your profile, so be it...."Former Reserve Infanteer" it is then.

You're attitude, thusfar, has reveiled enough that most of the senior posters will place you on ignore.

For someone who joined this site not even 2 days ago you're already on the radar of every mod here.

You're on the ramp with out a chute right now....how's that for a skill testing question.    :

Regards

I was just returning fire..........ooh the military puns.....

 

[Franko]

I was just returning fire..........ooh the military puns.....

Returning fire or not, this is not the first time you've acted in such a manner on this site and it will not  be tolerated.



Be more professional in your approach and responses from now on.

Next thing you will hear if this happens again will be....

STAND-BY

Regards

 

[A O G 101]

canuck troop.
There is absolutely no doubt that they will want to develop weapons,One can't compare Israel to Iran,Israel has been threatened by Iran,Don't need to say more about that.Iran is a very unstable country,The elected versus the non-elected ,president versus Ayatollah. For them joining the IAEA it is simply a way of making the rest of us think that they want nuclear power,So ,while inspectors are overseeing their program,they can enrich Uranium,to a point where they can build a bomb,perhaps nothing to large,say,About the size of the Hiroshima blast,By todays standards a primative device but none the less a nuclear device. So ,by joining the IAEA,has part of the non-proliferation treaty,you build your weapons grade plutonium under the noses of the inspectors,when you feel you have reached the point when you want to announce that you have done so,You declare that being part of the treaty jeopardizes the interests of the state,and you withdraw from the NPT with three months notice. North korea? I can explain how a cascade enrichment system works,But,bottom line they are attempting to upgrade their cascade system they have now,to where they will be able to make a higher grade plutonium,Do they want the plutonium for bombs?Well.If someone offers to build them a reactor that can generate power,which three countries have.And they refuse because with these types of reactors they can not refine the heavy water .what does that tell you, about what they want the plutonium for?

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Who cares if they get nuclear weapons? Israel has enough.

Given the level of threat that Israel has experienced in the past, and the fact that they have used restraint in using their nuclear arsenal should suggest to most that they are a responsible nation and do not need to be disarmed.  NOBODY should have nukes.  If there was a way to strip the planet of all nukes, ours, theirs, the technology and the information to making them, I would love to see it happen.  Nukes stopped WWII, and no good since then has come of nuclear weapons.  UGH.  My long repressed inner hippie is clawing out.  BACK, FOUL IMPULSE, BACK!!

I believe Iran has the same right to nuclear power as anywhere else on earth.

And as AOG101 pointed out, there are other ways of producing nuclear power without creating by products that can be used as weapons. 
Besides, you are in conflict with your own argument.  One one hand, you argue that Iran as a nation should have the right to pursue a legitmate power program.  Then, on the other hand, you indicate your hatred of Israel, and that Iran should in fact have nuclear weapons.  What reserve unit did you say you were in?  The Al-Aqsa Martyrs Brigade?

I thought Canadians, especially military members, were smarter than this.
I only hope there are some more enlightened CF members out there that can use their own grey matter rather than handing that over to politicians. As far as I recall, when you get your commission, you don't sign away your brain as well. Of course being an LT Zipper head oughtta know that.

As Franko is already sorting out your trolling, I will not react to that.  However, to suggest that the whole of the CF is unintelligent just because they don't agree with your idea of "Nukes for Iran" as a viable peace process is, if nothing else, wildly ironic.

As far as Israel goes, they have enough nukes to defend themselves.

Kay, just a heads up:  you don't really defend from nukes.  The last time this was tried was in the 80's, and it was a game called Missile Command from Atari.  Not using them is a good idea.  Not having them is better. 

IMO they shouldn't be in the middle east anyway, since they are a failed concoction of the UN and not a real country. I agree with the arabs on this. Move them to Northern Ontario or something and put them out of our misery.

Over and above the anti-Semitic flavour of this, there have been many other threads about Israel.  This one is about Iran.  Besides that, if you had beach front Mediterranean property, would you trade it in for outside of Sudbury?  I sincerely doubt it. 

 

[17thRecceSgt]

I'd more likely sign up to help defend Iran from the aggressors than join in any US led crap- if it happens.

I hope you didn't pick teams in school in Phys Ed did you?  Win many games? :blotto:

 

[CanuckTroop]

If there was a way to strip the planet of all nukes, ours, theirs, the technology and the information to making them, I would love to see it happen.

Superman did it in "Superman 4-The Quest for Peace".  He threw all the Nuclear Weapons into the sun.... 

BTW disagreeing with the existence of Israel in the middle of a bunch of Arab states is not being anti-semetic- it's being rational. And like I said before, Iran has agreed to "intrusive inspections" so any attempt to enrich uranium to the grades necessary for producing a bomb would be found out. They would be caught in the act long before they ever got enough nuclear weapons to threaten Israel. Let's face it Israel supposedly has at least 200 weapons at this point. Iran has a long way to go and it would be a 200-1 nuclear exchange if they started launching anything- gee who wins that one? That's another thing I take issue with- The urgency with which the US is pursuing this hedgemony and the lack of Diplomacy being evidenced. There is no attempt to talk at all here, they're pushing for war asap. The US refuses to have direct talks with the Iranian leadership- what does that tell you? They don't want a diplomatic solution. The fact is diplomacy is what's needed here, not threats. Threatening Iran is only making them more bold and getting the young population there on the governments side. There was talk in Iran of revolution before the West started threatening them. Now that the leadership can play innocent victim, the people are rallying to the cause of nuclear technology.

IMO the US and UN (we're a member) cannot start another conflict in that region without disasterous results. Remember China and Russia don't even want sanctions. This is not the time to start WW3 (there is no good time for that). I don't wanna glow in the dark........how bout you?

 

[scoutfinch]

I was being sarcastic. Are you saying you would support an attack on Iran, a democratically elected government, seeking nuclear tech just like the rest of us? Would you die or send your troops to possibly be killed for US foreign policy? Let's hear some debate. I wanna know if ANYONE would actually support this action.

Anyone who describes the Iranian government as being democratically elected has boldly indicated their ignorance. : :

Ladies and gentlemen, I suggest we leave Mr. CanuckTroop to stew in his own juices because he has proven that he knows nothing of which he so loudly pontificates.

 

[scoutfinch]

CanuckTroop:

Riddle me this:  why would a nation with the second largest natural gas reserves in the world (second only to Russia) require nuclear power?

Shake your head.  Hear anything?

 

[scoutfinch]

...The US refuses to have direct talks with the Iranian leadership- what does that tell you? They don't want a diplomatic solution. The fact is diplomacy is what's needed here, not threats.

The fact that the US is not talking to Iran is not surprising given the history between the two countries since 1953.  I commend for your reading The Persian Puzzle by Kenneth Pollack which goes into great detail regarding the long and tortuous diplomatic relationship between Iran and the US.  I suggest you read it (or atleast something) so as to minimize your ignorance on the subject. 

...There was talk in Iran of revolution before the West started threatening them. Now that the leadership can play innocent victim, the people are rallying to the cause of nuclear technology.

Wrong again.  There was not talk of revolution but of reform.  Unfortunately, Iranian reformists were effectively shut out of the last election when Khameni and Rafsanjani used the Guardians Council's power to vet all electorate candidates to all but eliminate the reformist bloc in the Seventh Majlis (2004).  But I am sure you already knew that right? :

 

[mdh]

The urgency with which the US is pursuing this hedgemony

I'm equally concerned about US hedgemony - I don't know how the yanks managed to grow them that high, must be using the labor of the millions of illegal aliens foolishly surging into the Lair of the Great Satan. They should be surging into the "democratically elected" Islamic Republic of Iran instead. 

 

[scoutfinch]

mdh:

This isn't so much directed at you as it is to CanuckTroop.... but it is spelled *hegemony*.  And since the end of the Cold War, the US has been the sole superpower (also referred to as a hyperpower) which by definition means it has achieved hegemony (or is a hegemon, however you wish to express it).

 

[mdh]

mdh:

This isn't so much directed at you as it is to CanuckTroop.... but it is spelled *hegemony*.  And since the end of the Cold War, the US has been the sole superpower (also referred to as a hyperpower) which by definition means it has achieved hegemony (or is a hegemon, however you wish to express it).

I know... I was trying to make a heavy-handed play on "hedge" - oh well time to go to the air force forum