Iran Super Thread- Merged

[Marauder]

You know, if JSOC were to just liquidate all those pointy headed nuclear scientists who speak Farsi, and make an example of any free agents *coughrussianschinesekoreanscough* who went to Iran to try and rebuild that capability...

Oh, the glee  I would feel to see the wacky lefty academics here shite the bed over that...

 

[Love793]

What about the reactor technology we sell everyone?

 

[Armymatters]

What about the reactor technology we sell everyone?

The CANDU reactor technology? It requires no enrichment, but it is easy to get plutonium from this reactor design as you do not need to enrich the uranium, and it can be reloaded without having to turn off the reactor.

 

[couchcommander]

That's how India got the bomb, if I remember correctly. Not CANDU, but another Canadian heavy water reactor.

 

[Armymatters]

That's how India got the bomb, if I remember correctly. Not CANDU, but another Canadian heavy water reactor.

It was based off the NRX design and was donated by us in 1960 (curiously, NRX suffered a partial meltdown in 1952). The Americans supplied the heavy water needed to operate the reactor. When the Indians blew up their first bomb, it prompted a major outcry here, and we cut off any future exchange of nuclear materials and technology with India.

 

[Navy_Blue]

My point about Afghanistan and Iraq being push overs stands.  The conventional forces folded within days if not hours after air strikes and assaults began.  What we are fighting now is a gorilla war (completely different).  I challenge anyone to find few if any instances where conventional forces (plains, tanks, ships and 1000's of infantry) fought and won against a gorilla force.  Iran would turn into this type of conflict very soon after any attack.

The people leading the insurgency in both Iraq and Afghanistan know that they just have to hold out a few years and the governments will change and promises will be made to pull out of these places.  I don't agree with it but it will happen.  Our western society has no stomach for casualties.  We don't see past four years and we can't possibly see the benefits of having a middle east where everyone plays nice.

Anytime the British had problems involving insurgents in the past they sent in the SAS won harts and minds of the locals and demoralized the opposition.  If the British would have carpet bombed some of there quite conflicts and sent in troops and killed civi's it would have turned out much differently.  The Brits aren't perfect though...they never really did crush the IRA and they are now stuck in a bind with the Yanks. The US and Russians always figured overwhelming force would break there opponents.  They had to pull out of both Vietnam and Afghanistan.

Our only real alternative just may be to let them grow up on there own build there nukes and let them know that no one on this planet will stand by and let them use them.  All these little countries who have nukes should get an understanding that they will be wiped from the Earth if they use them.  The Russians, the Chinese, France, the UK and the Yanks (all the big kids with nukes) should all agree too this kind of enforcing an understanding of M.A.D. on the others.

I'll leave it at that for now...

:threat:

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Nobody ever wants a gorilla war.  All that poop and banana peels  ;D

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Israel will be 'annihilated,' says Iran's president

So of course, more posturing and more threats to Israel.  Mahmoud Ahmadinejad must have called FTD and ordered a bouquet of daisy cutters.  At least he is making the case to have him taken out pretty clear to the UN for us. 

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/cbc/s/14042006/3/world-israel-annihilated-says-iran-s-president.html

 

[muskrat89]

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/04/14/D8GVSUC0H.html

By ALI AKBAR DAREINI
Associated Press Writer

TEHRAN, Iran

The president of Iran again lashed out at Israel on Friday and said it was "heading toward annihilation," just days after Tehran raised fears about its nuclear activities by saying it successfully enriched uranium for the first time.

President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad called Israel a "permanent threat" to the Middle East that will "soon" be liberated. He also appeared to again question whether the Holocaust really happened.

"Like it or not, the Zionist regime is heading toward annihilation," Ahmadinejad said at the opening of a conference in support of the Palestinians. "The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm."

Ahmadinejad provoked a world outcry in October when he said Israel should be "wiped off the map."

On Friday, he repeated his previous line on the Holocaust, saying: "If such a disaster is true, why should the people of this region pay the price? Why does the Palestinian nation have to be suppressed and have its land occupied?"

The land of Palestine, he said, referring to the British mandated territory that includes all of Israel, Gaza and the West Bank, "will be freed soon."

He did not say how this would be achieved, but insisted to the audience of at least 900 people: "Believe that Palestine will be freed soon."

"The existence of this (Israeli) regime is a permanent threat" to the Middle East, he added. "Its existence has harmed the dignity of Islamic nations."

The three-day conference on Palestine is being attended by officials of Hamas, the ruling party in the Palestinian territories.

Iran has previously said it will give money to the Palestinian Authority to make up for the withdrawal of donations by Western nations who object to Hamas' refusal to recognize Israel and renounce violence. But no figure has been published.

On Tuesday, Ahmadinejad announced that Iran had successfully enriched uranium using a battery of 164 centrifuges, a significant step toward the large-scale production of enriched uranium required for either fueling nuclear reactors or making nuclear weapons.

The United States, France and Israel accuse Iran of using a civilian nuclear program to secretly build a weapon. Iran denies this, saying its program is confined to generating electricity.

The U.N. Security Council has given Iran until April 28 to cease enrichment. But Iran has rejected the demand.

The chief of Israeli military intelligence, Maj. Gen. Amos Yadlin, was quoted Wednesday as saying Iran could develop a nuclear bomb "within three years, by the end of the decade."

 

[muskrat89]

and more....

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/04/15/060415084241.xdv0o3w3.html

Iran issues stark military warning to United States
Apr 15 4:42 AM US/Eastern


Iran said it could defeat any American military action over its controversial nuclear drive, in one of the Islamic regime's boldest challenges yet to the United States.

"You can start a war but it won't be you who finishes it," said General Yahya Rahim Safavi, the head of the Revolutionary Guards and among the regime's most powerful figures.

"The Americans know better than anyone that their troops in the region and in Iraq are vulnerable. I would advise them not to commit such a strategic error," he told reporters on the sidelines of a pro-Palestinian conference in Tehran.

The United States accuses Iran of using an atomic energy drive as a mask for weapons development. Last weekend US news reports said President George W. Bush's administration was refining plans for preventive strikes on Iran's nuclear facilities.

"I would advise them to first get out of their quagmire in Iraq before getting into an even bigger one," General Safavi said with a grin.

"We have American forces in the region under total surveillance. For the past two years, we have been ready for any scenario, whether sanctions or an attack."

Iran announced this week it had successfully enriched uranium to make nuclear fuel, despite a UN Security Council demand for the sensitive work to be halted by April 28.

The Islamic regime says it only wants to generate atomic energy, but enrichment can be extended to make the fissile core of a nuclear warhead -- something the United States is convinced that "axis of evil" member Iran wants to acquire.

At a Friday prayer sermon in Tehran, senior cleric Ayatollah Ahmad Janati simply branded the US as a "decaying power" lacking the "stamina" to block Iran's ambitions.

And hardline President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad told AFP that a US push for tough United Nations sanctions was of "no importance."

"She is free to say whatever she wants," the president replied when asked to respond to comments by US Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice highlighting part of the UN charter that provides for sanctions backed up by the threat of military action.

"We give no importance to her comments," he said with a broad smile.

On Thursday, Rice said that faced with Iran's intransigence, the United States "will look at the full range of options available to the United Nations."

"There is no doubt that Iran continues to defy the will of the international community," Rice said, after Iran also dismissed a personal appeal from the UN atomic watchdog chief Mohamed ElBaradei.

The International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) chief must give a report at the end of April on Iranian compliance with the Security Council demand. In Tehran he said that after three years of investigations Iran's activities were "still hazy and not very clear."

Although the United States has been prodding the council to take a tough stand against the Islamic republic, including possible sanctions, it has run into opposition from veto-wielding members Russia and China.

Representatives of the five permanent members of the Security Council plus Germany are to meet in Moscow Tuesday to discuss the crisis.

In seeking to deter international action, Iran has been playing up its oil wealth, its military might in strategic Gulf waters and its influence across the region -- such as in Iraq, Lebanon and the Palestinian territories.

At the Tehran conference, Iran continued to thumb its nose at the United States and Israel.

"The Zionist regime is an injustice and by its very nature a permanent threat," Ahmadinejad told the gathering of regime officials, visiting Palestinian militant leaders and foreign sympathizers.

"Whether you like it or not, the Zionist regime is on the road to being eliminated," said Ahmadinejad, whose regime does not recognise Israel and who drew international condemnation last year when he said Israel should be "wiped off the map."

Unfazed by his critics, the hardliner went on to repeat his controversial stance on the Holocaust.

"If there is serious doubt over the Holocaust, there is no doubt over the catastrophe and Holocaust being faced by the Palestinians," said the president, who had previously dismissed as a "myth" the killing of an estimated six million Jews by the Nazis and their allies during World War II.

"I tell the governments who support Zionism to ... let the migrants (Jews) return to their countries of origin. If you think you owe them something, give them some of your land," he said.

Iran's turbaned supreme leader, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, also accused the United States of seeking to place the entire region under Israeli control.

"The plots by the American government against Iran, Iraq, Syria and Lebanon aimed at governing the Middle East with the control of the Zionist regime will not succeed," Khamenei said.

There was no immediate reaction from Washington, but French Foreign Minister Philippe Douste-Blazy severely condemned Ahmadinejad for his latest remarks on Israel.

"As I have had occasion to do before, when the Iranian president made similar statements, I condemn these inacceptable remarks in the strongest possible terms," Douste-Blazy said in a statement.

"Israel's right to exist and the reality of the Holocaust should not be disputed," he added.

 

[GAP]

http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/04/15/D8H0CJ882.html

"Like it or not, the Zionist regime is heading toward annihilation," Ahmadinejad said at the opening of a conference in support of the Palestinians. "The Zionist regime is a rotten, dried tree that will be eliminated by one storm."

Palestinian Foreign Minister Mahmoud Zahar also began a fundraising tour of Arab nations Friday seeking new aid, but Arab states have been reluctant to back up their vocal support for the Palestinians with cash. ]

How many Arab countries have spouted the rhetoric about helping Palestine, but when it come time to anty up...well the quote about Palestinian Foreign Minister Mahmoud Zaha kinda says it all. Granted there is a potential issue here, but maybe the Iranians are counting on the West to shoot from the hip thus giving them the argument "see what they are trying to do!!!" The converse is North Korea. The US made all the same noise, but backed off. That was a mistake we will pay for for decades to come.

 

[1feral1]

Well, as for the Iran cutting off oil, the Price as of 0730 this morning in Windsor is $1.05 a litre.  And that is just with the rumours of sabre rattling.

Well, here in Brisbane, today its $1.18-$1.22/L. For propane 51 to 56 cents /L, diesel around $1.30/L. One Aussie $ = about 72 cents US


Cheers,

Wes

 

[MarkOttawa]

William Arkin of the Washington Post outlines US war planning against Iran:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/04/14/AR2006041401907.html

His overall conclusions:

'Contingency planning for a bolt-out-of-the-blue attack, let alone full-fledged war, against Iran may seem incredible right now. But in the secretive world of military commands and war planners, it is an everyday and unfortunate reality. Iran needs to understand that the United States isn't hamstrung by a lack of options. It needs to realize that it can't just stonewall and evade its international obligations, that it can't burrow further underground in hopes that it will "win" merely because war is messy.

On the surface, Iran controls the two basic triggers that could set off U.S. military action. The first would be its acquisition of nuclear capability in defiance of the international community. Despite last week's bluster from Tehran, the country is still years away from a nuclear weapon, let alone a workable one. We may have a global strike war plan oriented toward attacking countries with weapons of mass destruction, but that plan is also focused on North Korea, China and presumably Russia. The Bush administration is not going to wait for a nuclear attack. The United States is now a first-strike nation.

The second trigger would be Iran's lashing out militarily (or through proxy terrorism) at the United States or its allies, or closing the Strait of Hormuz to international oil traffic. Sources say that CENTCOM and the Joint Chiefs of Staff have developed "flexible deterrent options" in case Iran were to take such actions.

One might ask how these options could have any deterrent effect when the government won't talk about them. This is another reason why Rumsfeld should acknowledge that the United States is preparing war plans for Iran -- and that this is not just routine. It is specifically a response to that country's illegal pursuit of nuclear weapons, its meddling in Iraq and its support for international terrorism.

Iran needs to know that the administration is dead serious. But we all need to know that even absent an Iranian nuke or an Iranian attack of any kind, there is still another catastrophic scenario that could lead to war...'

Mark
Ottawa

 

[The Bread Guy]

A little something else to throw into the "factors" basket when considering "Courses Open"....

Shared in accordance with the "fair dealing" provisions, Section 29, of the Copyright Act (http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/info/act-e.html#rid-33409).

http://tinyurl.com/q8uws

Iran hardliners register volunteers for suicide raids
Sun Apr 16, 2006 7:13 PM IST

''By Parisa Hafezi

TEHRAN (Reuters) - Some 200 Iranians have volunteered in the past few days to carry out "martyrdom missions" against U.S. and British interests if Iran is attacked over its nuclear programme, a hardline group said on Sunday.

The United States and other Western nations accuse Iran of seeking to master enrichment technology to build atomic weapons, a charge Iran denies. Washington says it wants a diplomatic solution, but has not ruled out a military option.

Mohammad Ali Samadi, spokesman for the Committee for the Commemoration of Martyrs of the Global Islamic Campaign, said fresh fears over a possible U.S. attack on Iran's nuclear sites helped attract volunteers during its latest recruitment drive.

"Because of the recent threats, we have started to register more volunteers since Friday," Samadi told Reuters by telephone.

"Some 200 people have registered to carry out operations against our enemies. America and Britain are definitely considered enemies."

Chanting "Death to America" and "Nuclear technology is our right", volunteers registered their names at the former American Embassy in southern Tehran on Sunday.

They signed a document called "Registration form for martyrdom-seeking operations" and pledged to "defend the Islamic Republic's interests".

"We will give a good lesson to those who dare to attack our country," said Ali, a 25-year-old masked volunteer, after filling out registration form.

When asked why he had covered his face, Ali said: "I do not want to be recognised when travelling abroad to harm American and British interests."

TENS OF THOUSANDS REGISTERED

The Committee for the Commemoration of Martyrs of the Global Islamic Campaign, which says it has no affiliation with the government, was formed in 2004. Since then Samadi said some 52,000 people have signed up to be involved in possible attacks.

The Sunday Times of London, quoting unnamed Iranian officials, reported Iran had 40,000 trained suicide bombers prepared to strike western targets if Iran is attacked.

"The main force, named the Special Unit of Martyr Seekers in the Revolutionary Guards, was first seen last month when members marched in a military parade," the report said.

But Samadi denied the report.

"The Revolutionary Guards have no links to martyrdom-seeking operations. We are the only martyrdom seeking group in Iran," he said. "And we are an independent group."

No Iranians are thought to have directly executed suicide bombings in recent years. But the United States has accused Iran of being a state sponsor of terrorism.

In Sunday's New York Times a former White House counterterrorism expert said Iran's response to any U.S. military attack would be to use "its terrorist network to strike American targets around the world".

"Iran has forces at its command far superior to anything al Qaeda was ever able to field," wrote former White House counterterror chief Richard Clarke and former State Department official Steven Simon.

The "martyrdom" registration coincided with a conference on the Palestinian cause. Iran has refused to recognise Israel and supports anti-Israeli groups like Hamas and Hizbollah.

Inside the embassy, the walls were decorated with pictures of Palestinian suicide bombers. Videos of Israeli army attacks on Palestinians were shown on a wide screen. Books and CDs on the Palestinian uprising were also for sale.

In 1979, the then-American embassy was seized and its staff were taken hostage by militant students in 1979. The 52 hostages were freed after 444 days in captivity. ''

(DON'T LOOK HERE IF YOU WANT TO AVOID A BLATANT SELF PROMOTIONAL PLUG  - I'm collecting & posting news/background on Iran here:
http://milnewstbay.pbwiki.com/IRN:%20%20Mil%20Options - feel free to drop by; feedback always welcome! )

 

[tomahawk6]

I don't see the US accepting 40,000 Iranian visa applications for quite some time. Seriously this nuclear strike issue was cooked up by the New Yorker to sell magazines and to stick it to the Bush administration. I dont see any US President using nuke's under any circumstance except retaliatory. The regime is determined to have nuclear weapons. How determined is the west to prevent that prospect ? Iran may be betting that we dont want to risk war to stop them. Saddam made the same calculation though and he is in a cell now. If the military card is played then I think there will be some form of regime change as part of the overall plan. Until the regime changes we will constantly be looking over our shoulder.

 

[Navy_Blue]

But the change in leadership in Iraq hasn't solved much.  Iran would be just the same insurgents and locals blowing themselves up to kill soldiers of what ever coalition the US can talk into rolling over Iran.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

But the change in leadership in Iraq hasn't solved much.  Iran would be just the same insurgents and locals blowing themselves up to kill soldiers of what ever coalition the US can talk into rolling over Iran.

Hasn't solved much?  When is the last time Iraq threatened to re-invade Kuwait?  When was the Republican Guard operation against the Kurds or the Shiaa in the Euphrates delta?  Not saying all is rosy in Iraq, but some problems were solved...

Not saying that I have inside info, but who says that the US would necessarily have to invade Iran to change the regime?

 

[Clément Barbeau Vermet]

From Macleans January 23rd 2006 :
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is rumoured to have taken part in the 1979 seizure of the American embassy in Tehran during the early days of the Islamic revolution, and some former hostages and a journalist who covered the crisis say they recognise him from that time.
Wow, it's starting to make a looooong list...

 

[muskrat89]

How many Arab countries have spouted the rhetoric about helping Palestine, but when it come time to anty up

Coincidentally today (or maybe yesterday) Iran committed $50 million in aid to the Palestinians

 

[zipperhead_cop]

You aren't a suicide bomber until you go "boom".  Until then, you are a just a big talker.  Middle eastern hype and propaganda knows no bounds.