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Election 2015

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George Wallace said:
"Nickel and diming" to keep the National Debt down is part and parcel of a responsible government.  Do we really have the silly notion that money grows on trees?  Don't overlook the fact that all Government Departments have also been trimming their fat.

Does that nickel and diming include taking such measures as eliminating benefits such as extended HHTs, pet boarding during HHTs, pet boarding/transportation expenses at origin/destination, utility disconnect/connect fees at origin/destination, interest on home relocation loan, etc. from the CFIRP, when those benefits continue to be available in the NJC Relocation Directive for public servants (which the CFIRP is supposed to closely follow)?  Not to mention having a Home Equity Assistance policy for >$15K losses that TBS has never paid out on because, apparently, we had no depressed real estate markets anywhere in Canada for years...

Seems the CF was an easy target; nothing like a union to represent them, and members who can't speak out to the press to publicize the unfairness.  For those who think I'm advocating for a union, I'm not, so perish that thought - but who is looking out for the best interests of CF members when they're getting nickel and dimed?
 
Quote from: Altair on Today at 09:07:55

    Trudeau promises to restore lifelong pensions to injured veterans

    http://www.nationalpost.com/m/wp/news/blog.html?b=news.nationalpost.com/news/world/liberals-woo-disgruntled-veterans-with-promise-to-restore-lifetime-pensions-for-injured-ex-soldiers&pubdate=2015-08-24

    Really surprised that's not getting more attention here considering it effects you guys the most.

Ah, the other shoe has to drop. To fund this promise Trudeau will slash DND's budget to the bone and restrict all deployments to peacekeeping situations where the two sides do not have any lethal force. Accidents happen, but reducing exposure to death and wounds will negate any claims to VAC.

Anyhow, it was a Liberal Bill in the first place in case the media forgot. Is he promising to fix poor Liberal legislation??
 
Rifleman62 said:
Ah, the other shoe has to drop. To fund this promise Trudeau will slash DND's budget to the bone and restrict all deployments to peacekeeping situations where the two sides do not have any lethal force. Accidents happen, but reducing exposure to death and wounds will negate any claims to VAC.

Anyhow, it was a Liberal Bill in the first place in case the media forgot. Is he promising to fix poor Liberal legislation??
Sure. It was a horrible policy brought in by the liberals. They are promising to fix it. Why is that an issue?

The conservatives not only supported the issue at the time, they owned it. They had 9 years to change it. They simply said that the liberals introduced it and left it at that.

By the way, Paul martin isn't Justin Trudeau.
 
Altair said:
By the way, Paul Martin isn't Justin Trudeau.

Isn't that the truth.  Paul Martin was one of the best finance ministers ever.  Trudeau - the best substitute drama teacher ever to lead a 3rd place political party.

Anyone who is looking for military friendly policies from the Liberals or NDP is delusional.  The rhetoric has changed to win the election but under Trudeau and Chretien, the military was slashed.  The NDP has never been anything other than pacifist.  While the Conservatives haven't been all that much better they have tended to maintain what they inherited.
 
Raiding EI and other plans, to balance your budgets, is not being one of the "Best Finance Ministers ever".
 
recceguy said:
Raiding EI and other plans, to balance your budgets, is not being one of the "Best Finance Ministers ever".

He didn't talk about balancing the budget.  He balanced the budget.
 
Rifleman62 said:
Ah, the other shoe has to drop. To fund this promise Trudeau will slash DND's budget to the bone and restrict all deployments to peacekeeping situations where the two sides do not have any lethal force.
Any evidence this is the only place the cash can come from?  I'm not a big fan of le Dauphin, but I haven't seen anything pointing to "mo' $ for vets = less $ for military" - yet, anyway.

recceguy said:
Raiding EI and other plans, to balance your budgets, is not being one of the "Best Finance Ministers ever".
:nod:
 
Rocky Mountains said:
Isn't that the truth.  Paul Martin was one of the best finance ministers ever.  Trudeau - the best substitute drama teacher ever to lead a 3rd place political party.

Anyone who is looking for military friendly policies from the Liberals or NDP is delusional.  The rhetoric has changed to win the election but under Trudeau and Chretien, the military was slashed.  The NDP has never been anything other than pacifist.  While the Conservatives haven't been all that much better they have tended to maintain what they inherited.
Paul martin dumped the costs onto the province's,  raided EI, and gutted the military to achieve those balanced budgets and surpluses,  but that was not my point.

My point was that a previous liberal goverment brought in a stupid policy and that the current liberal leadership is looking to fix it. Sure you can go over the sins of previous goverments to judge the current, but I think that's foolish considering that it's different people proposing different things.

With your logic, I should never vote for harper or any other conservative leader because a conservative leader burdened the CAF with the LSVW.
 
recceguy said:
Raiding EI and other plans, to balance your budgets, is not being one of the "Best Finance Ministers ever".

This is precisely what our current government just did to balance the last budget.
 
Thucydides said:
Let's just say that based on his record to date, there is no evidence that there would be any follow through either if elected or in the "kingmaker" position in a minority government (i.e. support this bill ro we pull the plug). Of course at this point I would be equally dubious if any other party was to try to pander to military voters now.

His record to date?  We live in a dictatorial democracy.  What opportunities has he had?
 
Altair said:
Joe Oliver is no Jim Flaherty.

Or Paul Martin. And I think Flaherty, RIP, would have made a better leader than Martin or Harper, but that's probably because he wasn't gagging for the job.

Maybe that's what it boils down to: anyone who really wants the job probably doesn't deserve it.

 
Altair said:
I actually don't mind harper on any of those issues.

The circumventing of democracy, the omnibus bills, the vilification of everyone who opposes him, the non answers in question period, the attack advertising that has taken political discourse to a new low, the nickel and diming the Canadian armed forces while saying that he is the only one that cares about it, those are things I want harper gone for. Just harper. Conservatives on a whole aren't too bad a party, and I would probably vote for someone like ambrose or Baird, definitely the late Flaherty. (I have the feeling harper would prefer pierre poilievre as his heir apparent)

But it's being lead by Steven Harper, and the best way for renewal in the conservative party is for them to lose.

:bravo:

I don't think he's damaged the party as much as Mulroney damaged the PCs, but I'd rather he not get the chance to do any more. If he won't take his walk in the snow voluntarily, the electorate needs to ask him to leave.

As already mentioned by ERC, I don't think any of the current crop of leaders is "bad." I also don't think a four year interregnum of NDP or Liberal rule will ruin the country, and perhaps the backlash will focus the conservative mind a little.

 
Acorn said:
Or Paul Martin. And I think Flaherty, RIP, would have made a better leader than Martin or Harper, but that's probably because he wasn't gagging for the job.

Maybe that's what it boils down to: anyone who really wants the job probably doesn't deserve it.
Anyone who doesn't really want the job doesn't get it.

It's so much work and hassel to get to be party leader that only those who want it the most even have a sniff at getting it.
 
I don't expect Harper will stay around even if he does get to form the next government.  My 2 cents says he will wait until after his first budget in order to carry the flack, if any, from cuts etc. and then ask for a leadership convention.  That way, he would go out a winner in about 18 months. That will give the new leader sufficient time to stamp his own image on the party and demonstrate that he/she is different from Harper.  If he loses, he won't get the choice of asking for a convention.
 
George Wallace said:
. . . . .  A protest vote, just because you don't like a person without any other reason is absurd.

I would disagree.  While it may not be the way you decide your ballot choice, for some it may be a perfectly valid reason.  And if questioned further most who "don't like" a particular candidate or leader have probably reached that conclusion because of the candidate's performance, policies or priorities.  Even if they formed their impression based on an unfavourable interaction with the candidate or his staff that is understandable.  To be honest, I don't like Stephen Harper (based on my last noted reason - unfavourable interaction).  I will admit that he has yet to overcome that bad first impression and it's approaching twenty years since the idiot who ran his constituency office responded to my request for assistance in sorting out a problem getting my first military pension cheque with "oh, military . . . we don't get involved with you guys because your votes don't matter in this riding".  (If you hire idiots and give them authority to speak in your name, you are responsible.)  By the way, I contacted the office of the MP in a neighbouring riding and I had my pension sorted out within one week.  Thus, I had a lot of time for Preston Manning despite my generally unfavourable opinion of the Reform Party.

The first time I voted (over a dozen federal elections ago) I voted Progressive Conservative.  There was probably some of your "absurd" reasoning in that decision.  I suppose you could say that I came from a Conservative (the party, large "C", not necessarily small "c" thinking) household.  Probably the big indicator was the patriarch of the family (my Grandfather) "hated" Joey Smallwood (a Liberal).  PET (though not associated with that most cardinal of sins - the joining of Nfld to Canada) was painted with the same brush simply because he was a Liberal (okay, he was also a flake).  In a majority of the subsequent federal elections (and a few by-elections) I generally voted along similar party lines with often (especially when I was still serving) a primary reasoning that they would be "better" for the military.  I now consider that thinking to be "absurd" because I've come to believe that regardless of the party in power they will only allocate resources to the military if it is necessary to accomplish an immediate unavoidable requirement (e.g. Afghanistan) - the rest of the time, the military, as a political commitment, (though necessary) will only be given the minimum to function or a bit extra if needed to avoid political embarrassment.

However, on only one occasion has my actual personal dislike of a person formed the sole reasoning for not voting for them.  Back in the 1980s, on going to the military polling place, I was surprised to discover that my riding had changed (the boundary shifted by one street past where I had declared my ordinary residence when I joined) and the candidate running for the party for which I would have normally voted had a familiar name.  I was able to excuse myself from the polling place and immediately contacted my brother back on The Rock.  When I asked him if the candidate was who I thought it was, he confirmed it and commented "guess he's not getting your vote - you never did like him, did you".  However, my personal objections to the very existence of that individual were inconsequential in keeping him from being elected.

In later years, while I've maintained a similar political view and voted accordingly, there has been occasion when the candidate of the party who I would have normally considered did not meet my expectations - I do consider the individual who I actually vote for as well as the party platform.  In the case of the upcoming federal election, I haven't made up my mind yet, but the incumbent "empty suit" in my riding  (Mr. Harper is no longer my MP) is not high on my list of possibilities.
 
Blackadder1916 said:
I would disagree.  While it may not be the way you decide your ballot choice, for some it may be a perfectly valid reason.  And if questioned further most who "don't like" a particular candidate or leader have probably reached that conclusion because of the candidate's performance, policies or priorities.  Even if they formed their impression based on an unfavourable interaction with the candidate or his staff that is understandable.  To be honest, I don't like Stephen Harper (based on my last noted reason - unfavourable interaction).  I

Once again, I can point to Alberta and Ontario as examples of what a "Protest Vote" result in. 

I don't think it is wise to mark you ballot on whom the PM is going to be.  That does you no good.  Vote for the best person in your Riding, whom is going to do the most for your Riding, not their leader.  None of the leaders are any glowing examples of moral or ethical character, and it has been decades since we have seen any of our 'leaders' who have been anywhere close to resembling a 'Statesman'. 

You gave the example of having to go to another Riding to get results.  Well.  Vote for the best person in your Riding that will give you results.  Voting in a village fool from one of the other Parties, just because you don't like the leader of the ruling party is absurd.  You have improved nothing in your Riding.

I have seen the unethical parachuting of Liberal candidates into several Ridings, mine include, and that is offensive to me.  Sorry, Justin, but that move lost at least one vote for your candidate. 
 
Considering that most of the power today is concentrated in the PMO, it's better to vote for the guy who will be in that office.

The backbench MPs today are glorified yes men IMHO.
 
Altair said:
Considering that most of the power today is concentrated in the PMO, it's better to vote for the guy who will be in that office.

The backbench MPs today are glorified yes men IMHO.


???

PMO are not elected officials
 
George Wallace said:
???

PMO are not elected officials
naturally. But the Prime Minister chooses who will be in the PMO, so I want my vote to reflect who is going to be Prime Minister.

The powerless MP means very little to me.
 
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