Divining the right role, capabilities, structure, and Regimental System for Canada's Army Reserves

[Michael OLeary]

You know Michael, your little "funny how we only talk about officers bit" is getting a little tiring. 

As for passing courses being the only criteria for promotion, perhaps you would like to enlighten us as to where we can get promoted without any courses.

Lighten up!

As tiring as your junior officer with a map barbs?

Shall I explain the entire career management system for you?

 

[the 48th regulator]

Guys c'mon,

Let's not get dang petty.

There have already been too many pot shots, I am guilty of it too in the last day.

Let's try to keep this clean.

Listen, I was fired up.  Fuck, I am and will always fight for the reserves.

it's who I am.  I have to admit, MCG and Dap, bring some good points.  I live in a town where we have 4 infantry regiments, and four God damn armouries!!!

That, I will concede is downright ridiculous.  However, and I have already touted this, this is an army cross board affliction.

Let us look in my area alone (I live in the GTA).  The Lorne Scots are an excellent example (before the armouries for the QOR and TorScots)

They (LS) have been able to control and area, with three armouries all on their own.  Always good troops, from the bottom to the top.  If this is not an example where an area can be commanded by a single command, over long distance, well one needs to just see the quality of phenomenal troops that come from them.

We in Toronto do not need 4 infantry, and three armoured regiments.  Okay, I concede.  However, I will stand on my pedestal and say this once again.  If the Army as a whole is broke, with regards to manning and the amount of regiments, why start at the red headed step child??  Go for the Foster Parents I say!  We all need a change and reason to reorganize.

The Brits did it, the amalgamated all of the regiments in Scotland in to the Highland brigade, and that included Regs and Reserves.

Either way, let us stop the petty jabs please….

BTW, for the Reg force guys, there is no life like it, cuz there no life in  it!!!  :nana:

dileas

tess

 

[Kat Stevens]

BTW, for the Reg force guys, there is no life like it, cuz there no life in  it!!!  :nana:

dileas

tess

...and fuck all after it.

 

[Brad Sallows]

People rise automatically in many places where single file succession exists.  I suppose most reservists with a good chunk of time-in know a buffoon or two who made it to MWO or Maj (and sometimes beyond) on the strength of "met standard on courses", "attended regularly", and "sole candidate".

Past certain rank levels, "qualified" isn't enough.  Passed courses and accumulated time-in can not elevate a person past his maximum level of competence.  When there is only one candidate, there can be no objective comparison; an objective assessment of one person's skills and aptitude is more difficult than a comparison among candidates.

Some sub-unit OCs undoubtedly merit Maj rank; but, we should eliminate the cultural expectation that all OCs should be Maj.  Start the bar at Capt, and promote outstanding performers (observed and measured, not predicted) to Maj.

I am not sure of the best criteria to measure candidates for advancement beyond, say, Capt/WO; but "in single file, one pace forward: march" isn't it.

 

[George Wallace]

Brad

I can tend to agree with you on this as a generalization. 

If I may try again (reference your previous post); this is already happening in various locations.  If one looks at the CFTPO and Msgs coming out, positions are advertised to be filled on various taskings, Domestic and International, as well as Backfills.  Most have a rank desired, and list a rank or two lower as being acceptable if they meet the criteria.  Some even list that a higher rank can apply to fill the posn if they revert to the lower rank. 

I don't think we need to change the Reserves too drastically, but taking the amalgamation idea to heart we can see a compromise of what you and some others have proposed.  Existing Regiments keeping their hatbadges, but basically becoming Coys/Sqns of a larger 'amalgamated Regiment'.  Their COs would be Majors and their Sergeant Majors would be MWOs.  This would still keep much of the existing Col/CWO positions commanding the Bdes, LCol posns in command of 'amalgamated Regiments' and Majors commanding Coys/Sqns.  It would maintain Senior officers for Staffing, CWOs and MWOs for guidance and discipline and Junior officers, WOs, Sgts and MCpls for Training.  If amalgamation would have to be reversed, the building blocks would still be in place to do so. 

Many "Acting/Lacking" appointments exist today, and many confuse them for 'actual' appointments.  Don't forget that many in those positions have time constraints as to how long they may hold that position or rank before they must get the proper qualifications or are required to revert back to their previous rank.  The system is not perfect, but has come a long way. 

 

[daftandbarmy]

I find it odd that anyone wants to reduce the footprint of regiments across Canada, given the many and increasing demands on the Forces these days. Amalgamation smacks too much of 'retreat' and defeatism. I've seen the negative impacts of this in the UK.

I'm all for going on the maketing 'offensive' and building up the strengths of all our regiments through improving recruiting and retention.

We used to have 100 soldier companies during the time of Vietnam and the immediate aftermath of general military negativity. Why not now when the image of Canada's military is so positive (and you can bet that it is far more positive compared with the 70s)?

We just need to get better at marketing to new and more savvy audiences, and making sure that we have first class leadership at the senior levels in all units. From what I've seen of some of the people we have at the Capt/Lt?WO/Sgt level right now, we're in good shape to achieve long term growth if we get it right at the LCol/Maj/CWO/MWO level now.

On les auras!

 

[dapaterson]

But we're at the strength the government has mandated now.  That is a key limiting factor in any calculation - what's the top limit paid strength?

The R2K crowd who want every unit on the ORBAT (and some to be brought back to the ORBAT) to parade 400+ ignore the government's direction on strength.  To parade 400 at each unit (ignoring the demographic challenge in some smaller communities that are shrinking as Canada becomes more and more urban) would need a paid strength of roughly 50000, or over 2 1/2 times the current paid strength target.

We need to temper "perfect world" desires with cold hard realities.  And maybe make some hard choices - how much should we invest in a location if they steadfastly refuse to parade more than 35 people month to month, year to year - should that really be a unit, with 6 or so full-time staff that could better be used to support something else?

As long as we insist that all is fine and no units have problems we can't seriously request any additional funding - if we can piss away funds and personnel to support a dozen places like the one above, we're obviously over-resourced.

 

[tango22a]

Gentlemen:
First of all please excuse my babbling, but don't you think that if each PRes Regiment/Battalion was able to support one(1) Sqdn/coy fully manned PLUS a fully manned echelon that this would solve a lot of problems? I think that in today's times this is reasonable and affordable. Mind you there will be a need for more vehs, wpns and above all the horrible word...MONEY. If this plan was carried out I can see eventually that the better-situated Regt/Batt could double in size. If absolutely necessary you might group these sqdn/coy/bty into arms-specific ad hoc Regt/Batt groupings while retaining cap badges/honours/affiliations. How does this sound to you?

Babbling away, I remain

tango22a

 

[George Wallace]

Without the Echelon, that was more or less what I was getting at.  A great number of the Regiments are basically at manning levels of Sqn/Coys now.  I think a fully manned Echelon for each Sqn/Coy would be a goal, but not in the cards at the moment.  It would give these units a bit more breadth in recruiting, as they would now be recruiting "Purple" Tradesmen as well as Cbt Arms.  That could be the solution to past problems of not having maintainers and support for equipment held locally.  But again, we are back to the question of funding, and that is what will dictate if these ideas are plausible.

daftandbarmy

These amalgamations wouldn't reduce any footprints currently held, other than doing away with a good number of LCol and CWO positions and reduction in Major and MWO positions as some Coys and Sqns merge.  I am sure that many of these MWOs and Majors will then be moved to HQ, and other Staff and Training positions initially. 

 

[daftandbarmy]

Without the Echelon, that was more or less what I was getting at.  A great number of the Regiments are basically at manning levels of Sqn/Coys now.  I think a fully manned Echelon for each Sqn/Coy would be a goal, but not in the cards at the moment.  It would give these units a bit more breadth in recruiting, as they would now be recruiting "Purple" Tradesmen as well as Cbt Arms.  That could be the solution to past problems of not having maintainers and support for equipment held locally.  But again, we are back to the question of funding, and that is what will dictate if these ideas are plausible.

daftandbarmy

These amalgamations wouldn't reduce any footprints currently held, other than doing away with a good number of LCol and CWO positions and reduction in Major and MWO positions as some Coys and Sqns merge.  I am sure that many of these MWOs and Majors will then be moved to HQ, and other Staff and Training positions initially.

Sounds good to me. You could even (sharp intake of breath) use the spare officers and NCOs to run locally established courses to get people qualified faster, or shuffle them over to units that need people at that rank level. After all, in the militia, a Major's job is pretty much the same whether you're a grunt or a gunner.

I'd also like to finally see the Service Battalions tasked with providing echelon support for units, but that one is way above my pay grade...

 

[George Wallace]

...... You could even (sharp intake of breath) use the spare officers and NCOs to run locally established courses to get people qualified faster, ......

That is something that I have always wondered about.  Why don't the various Bdes or Areas have a Fulltime Battle School staffed to run through candiates on BMQ/BMOQ, SQ and PLQ courses?  It would probably be more efficient and cost effective that how things are running currently.  Just wondering?

 

[MJP]

That is something that I have always wondered about.  Why don't the various Bdes or Areas have a Fulltime Battle School staffed to run through candiates on BMQ/BMOQ, SQ and PLQ courses?  It would probably be more efficient and cost effective that how things are running currently.  Just wondering?

38 Bde has full time staff for running courses, a few of my friends are living the class B life teaching away.  Certainly makes sense and allows for IMHO better instruction all around.

 

[McG]

Why don't the various Bdes or Areas have a Fulltime Battle School staffed to run through candiates on BMQ/BMOQ, SQ and PLQ courses? 

I'd be happy to create Bde Trg Coy concurrent with consolidation of regiments into larger (fuller) units.

 

[mariomike]

I live in a town where we have < snip > four God damn armouries!!!
tess

I don't think having four armouries ( Moss Park, Dalton, Fort York, Denison and HMCS York ) is unreasonable. Many reservists take transit. 
Armouries can also be used as quasi community centres in case of emergency such as the 2008 propane explosion.

 

[geo]

That is something that I have always wondered about.  Why don't the various Bdes or Areas have a Fulltime Battle School staffed to run through candiates on BMQ/BMOQ, SQ and PLQ courses?  It would probably be more efficient and cost effective that how things are running currently.  Just wondering?

A lot of reserve Bdes do have thier own schools.... that are subserviant to the Area schools.  However, the Area schools limit the bde schools to some very basic courses - turf wars IMHO
(in LFQA at least)

 

[kratz]

I don't think having four armouries ( Moss Park, Dalton, Fort York, Denison and HMCS York ) is unreasonable. Many reservists take transit. 
Armouries can also be used as quasi community centres in case of emergency such as the 2008 propane explosion.

As an added note, you are not able to merge Army Reserve, ARAF and NRDs training goals in most communities to the point where it is logical to have on reserve building. ARAF needs to be near an airport, NRDs need to be on the water. This discussion is about the changes to the Army Reserve, so adding in the NRDs (not armouries)  into the discussion is not useful at this point.

 

[George Wallace]

............., NRDs need to be on the water.

;D


Been to the Naval Reserve in Calgary or Saskatoon, or any other Naval Reserve in the Prairies?

Now back to our regularly scheduled programming.

 

[ltmaverick25]

That is something that I have always wondered about.  Why don't the various Bdes or Areas have a Fulltime Battle School staffed to run through candiates on BMQ/BMOQ, SQ and PLQ courses?  It would probably be more efficient and cost effective that how things are running currently.  Just wondering?

I was under the impression that we were already doing this.  I know the Toronto Bde and the London Bde (forget the Bde numbers) both have battle schools that do just that.  They each run one PLQ on weekends throughout the year, a few BMQs and at least one BMOQ.  I think they even do some LFC Driver Wheeled courses and basic comms courses.

 

[daftandbarmy]

In the west, it comes and goes in a dreary  'flavour of the month' type procession. There is a constant battle between the 'centralist forces' who insist on everyone congregating at the 'Centre of Excrescence' in Wainwright, and the 'decentralist forces' who want to run it all on the West Coast, so the staff can go home to their families, look after their grow ops etc on the weekends.

IMHO you can run everything you need to train infantry in BC, making use of the field firing areas in Washington State - of course - where appropriate. But then you'd be contradicting the Principles of Micro-Management which seem to hold sway over most things Infantry these days.  ;D

 

[mariomike]

'Centre of Excrescence'

:rofl: :rofl:
Thank you! I learned a new word today!