Voluntary Occupational Transfer ( VOT )

[aesop081]

Not only that, but morally, do you think it wise to waste the CF's time, money, and possibly take the spot from someone who actually wants to make a career of the trade you use to get in?

Now hear this....from a guy who remustered

The military, in its infinite wisdom, has created programs for people to change occupations. While there are no guarantees of success, people can apply for these programs if they so desire. The CF has placed certain limitations so that it gets at least some form of acceptable return on its initial investment. In doing so, the CF has decided it worthwhile to retain valuable members by allowing them to continue in another MOS rather than see then go out the door completely.

Since the CF has created these programs, it logically follows that the CF expects people to take advantage of them.

I joined as a field engineer in 1993 because nothing else was available. I knew from day one that i wanted to be in the air force and if the opportunity came up, i would apply for a remuster. I guess that you now find me morally reprehensible. My trade was closed "out" until 2003. I sucked it up and finally things opened and i put in my papers the day of my QL6A grad parade in Gagetown. I suppose that, for you, i took away not only a spot in the trade but also a valuable spot on a senior course.

Joining the CF on the hopes that you may remuster early on is stupid. I say it to everyone. I say it because i know what happens first hand. I learned it the hard way.

But if a guy joins, does his time and works as hard as anyone else, he/she didn't take up anyone's place and didn't waste the CF's time and money. If the CF didn't want him/her to remuster, they wouldn't have created programs for it to happen. You can take your morals and your soapbox and go preach somewhere else.

Got it ?

 

[niceasdrhuxtable]

If the CF didn't want him/her to remuster, they wouldn't have created programs for it to happen. You can take your morals and your soapbox and go preach somewhere else.

Also keep in mind that at the time that was the only way for people to get into the AES Op MOC. I guess they figured there'd be a few of us morally reprehensible types out there 

 

[Lare]

I personally have no problems with remustering, I do however have a problem with those who take whatever they can get, and are unwilling to give 100% because "this isn't the trade they wanted." People like that can drag everyone around them down with overwhelming negativity and only doing a half assed job because half their time is spent complaining about something they signed up for.

Likewise, like a lot of far-wiser than I people here (yourself included) have stressed, making sure that the trade you do use as a stepping stone is something you will enjoy doing, possibly for a very long time, is imperative.

Am I wrong in this?

 

[Pusser]

I personally have no problems with remustering, I do however have a problem with those who take whatever they can get, and are unwilling to give 100% because "this isn't the trade they wanted." People like that can drag everyone around them down with overwhelming negativity and only doing a half assed job because half their time is spent complaining about something they signed up for.

Likewise, like a lot of far-wiser than I people here (yourself included) have stressed, making sure that the trade you do use as a stepping stone is something you will enjoy doing, possibly for a very long time, is imperative.

Am I wrong in this?

No you're not wrong at all, but neither is CDN Aviator.  Both of you raise good points.  Yes the CF has re-muster programs and yes, should take advantage of them.  However, I've also had to deal with unmotivated personnel whose chief excuse for poor work and poor work ethic, was often, "well I never wanted to be..."  Those folks are a huge pain in the hindquarters.  The best advice on this subject has already been given here:  Don't join with the expectation that you will be able to re-muster immediately.  However, if opportunity presents itself, by all means go for it.

 

[brandon_]

Likewise, like a lot of far-wiser than I people here (yourself included) have stressed, making sure that the trade you do use as a stepping stone is something you will enjoy doing, possibly for a very long time, is imperative.

Am I wrong in this?

No, I don't think your wrong.  But you're not right either, I agree with CDN Aviator on most (if not all) points.
    Currently I'm in the reserves Infantry, since i'm not yet old enough to join the REGF infantry, i'm using this as a stepping stone, doing something I love to do, in till i'm able to make it in to a full time job.
          I want to be an Infantryman full time, I'm going to do as much time as  I can, because as of right now I love it.  I don't think I am, or will be wasting any time in my current/future units. 
But my goal isn't to be in the Infantry for an entire Career, I'm CT'ing to the Regs, to one day re-muster as a SAR TECH, but I've got a long time before the time for me comes, and if it never does, I'll still be happy in the Infantry int till my body isn't.

 

[vmalin84]

everyone is making very valid points and I agree with most of you.  I am not going to join iny trade just so I can get in and be bored out of my mind. Thats why i am on here and trying to find which trades I would be willing to take. I just have a strong feeling because of pulling troops out of afghanistan and already hearing reports of the CF offering incentives to guys in the CA to take other trades, its going to be a while before I'm able to go Infantry like I want.  Thats why I'm trying to find another trade that is available that I could see myself doing as a full career and just go along hoping that I will be able to re-muster into infantry if it presents itself, or apply for JTF2 whenever possible.

Thankyou again, for all your input and suggestions

 

[Cleric515]

This is my situation, I am a marine electrician and i love my trade, the thing is I can't hack it when we go to sea. I thought I would be able to handle it but every day i dred about the next trip out to sea and it makes me miserable. I love my trade to bits though so I was thinking that tomorrow I'm going to go through my chain of command to remuster to Avionics System Technician as that is a land posting and is basically the electrical side of the air force. Because i haven't recieved any training such as going on a ql3 course or NETP, I'm wondering if remustering is possible for me. I came in semi skilled due to my own doing of post secondary education so if anything I saved the forces from having to put me on course.

 

[Occam]

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/90118.0

Are you QL4 qualified?  You're also going to need a VOT waiver from the Navy, assuming that requirement is still in place.

 

[Cleric515]

Academically im only missing 3 courses from being ql5 qualifed, in the mean time they want me to work on my ojt packages, so if i were to finish my ql3 ojt, ql4 ojt, write my fleet exam, then the military would have to schedule me for the 3 courses that im missing

 

[agc]

Are you QL4 qualified?  You're also going to need a VOT waiver from the Navy, assuming that requirement is still in place.

I think they just got rid of that.  Will check at work tomorrow.

 

[Occam]

Academically im only missing 3 courses from being ql5 qualifed, in the mean time they want me to work on my ojt packages, so if i were to finish my ql3 ojt, ql4 ojt, write my fleet exam, then the military would have to schedule me for the 3 courses that im missing

Sooooo....the answer is "No, I'm not QL4 qualified at the moment".  That means you cannot yet apply for a remuster under the VOT program.

 

[Cleric515]

even if the person is not fit for sea they would still keep him?

also, why would the military spend that money on training a person to just have him opt out of it, you would think the person would be doing the military a favor of saving them the hassle of all that training

 

[aesop081]

even if the person is not fit for sea they would still keep him?

You dont understand.

You do not meet the requirements for the VOT program. Simple as that. This means that you cannot change occupation through this program.

There are other avenues to go through for someone in your situation. VOT is not one of them.

 

[Cleric515]

well hopefully when i talk to my divisional officer he'll know something that can help, thx for the input though

 

[Occam]

even if the person is not fit for sea they would still keep him?

Elaborate on that.  There's probably a big difference between what you think is unfit for sea, and what the CF feels is unfit for sea.  Are you medically unfit resulting in a change in medical category? 

 

[Cleric515]

not fit meaning that im just one of those people who can't hack it at sea as it affects me behaviour wise, i just simply can't bear it and feel as if im gonna go crazy and obviously the only way a person can find out how the sea affects them is by having a trip out to sea, i'm sure im not the only one that has been in this situation before, i just know that i'd be better off using my expertise and love for electronics on a land posting which is why i will be asking about remustering to Avionic Systems Technician

 

[Stoker]

not fit meaning that im just one of those people who can't hack it at sea as it affects me behaviour wise, i just simply can't bear it and feel as if im gonna go crazy and obviously the only way a person can find out how the sea affects them is by having a trip out to sea, i'm sure im not the only one that has been in this situation before, i just know that i'd be better off using my expertise and love for electronics on a land posting which is why i will be asking about remustering to Avionic Systems Technician

So what are you going to do when you are posted to a ship? You know you could have to go to sea right?

 

[Occam]

not fit meaning that im just one of those people who can't hack it at sea as it affects me behaviour wise, i just simply can't bear it and feel as if im gonna go crazy and obviously the only way a person can find out how the sea affects them is by having a trip out to sea, i'm sure im not the only one that has been in this situation before, i just know that i'd be better off using my expertise and love for electronics on a land posting which is why i will be asking about remustering to Avionic Systems Technician

I think you better prepare yourself for disappointment.  There might be something they can do, but I wouldn't bet on it.  I saw more than a few sailors "not fit in" or "can't stand it" who were forced to play the game until such time as they could get a VOT or pull the pin altogether.  If you push the "I'm gonna go crazy" line, you may just find yourself on the business end of a 5(d) release.  Be careful.

You do realize that even as an aircraft maintainer, you could still end up at sea on a Sea King (or Cyclone, if we ever get them) det?

 

[aesop081]

not fit meaning that im just one of those people who can't hack it at sea as it affects me behaviour wise, i just simply can't bear it and feel as if im gonna go crazy and obviously the only way a person can find out how the sea affects them is by having a trip out to sea, i'm sure im not the only one that has been in this situation before, i just know that i'd be better off using my expertise and love for electronics on a land posting which is why i will be asking about remustering to Avionic Systems Technician

Sorry but all that just sounds like a BS cop-out !

...And just so you know, we send AVS techs to sea too.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Sorry but all that just sounds like a BS cop-out !

...And just so you know, we send AVS techs to sea too.

Yes your right we do send them to sea but you can get a PCAT that will keep one from ever getting a sea going position, I am not sure of the career implications that may have seeing as one would breach the universality of service no ?

I know when I first started going to sea I was deathly sea sick it was contemplated, by my CoC and Snr Med A, to put me on this permanent category. I begged and pleaded to be let to fight through it and I came out the other end just fine but needing to have the patch permanently attached just behind my ear.

Cleric515 1 Question, have you been to sea yet ? If not I encourage you to give it a chance you may just be surprised how much you enjoy it. If not your probably going to have to punch the clock until such time as you meet the requirements for a VOT then apply. Having said that applying for a VOT is no way guarantees you will be accepted for the VOT. I know many people who tried 2,3 and 4 times before they were accepted into the trade they desired.

Hang in there sailor and ride it out is my advice.