U.S. Politics 2018

[angus555]

Do you really think the US is not going to trade with any other countries? America First and the tax cuts are to provide jobs for Americans so they can produce "things" in the USA for consumers to purchase (because they now have jobs and funds) and to trade to other countries.

Did you read: https://army.ca/forums/threads/127262.0.html

Canada can sign all the trade deals it wants. Trade deals are the icing on nothing. No cake. They are meaningless if Canada is not business productive.

The irony here is that the people at Davos are some of those responsible for moving production jobs overseas in the last few decades, to places like China.

The house that I grew up in was built in the late 80's. All of the materials, fixtures and appliances were made in Canada at that time. Now when some of these things finally fail 30 years later and need to be replaced, I am given a selection of Chinese products that fail in a much shorter time frame.

Thank you capitalism.

 

[YZT580]

Just saying:  I was in the Toronto Airport duty free last week looking at the Canadian souvenirs available.  With the exception of a few Inuvik carvings not a single one bore a Made in Canada sticker.  Even the Canadian flag was stamped Made in China.  With a price tag of over 10 dollars it isn't as if a Canadian supplier couldn't have provided it and allowed for a reasonable profit margin either.  It is just that an Asian supplier can provide a bigger profit.  Trump is correct.  Free trade yes but on conditions that allow for fair competition from domestic suppliers.

 

[angus555]

Trump is correct.  Free trade yes but on conditions that allow for fair competition from domestic suppliers.

Unfortunately, when real restrictions on corporations are implemented, it's labeled as socialist or interventionist.

Trump is subject to the same incentive for profit margin as anyone else. Look at his merchandise all made in China.

 

[YZT580]

Unfortunately, when real restrictions on corporations are implemented, it's labeled as socialist or interventionist.

Trump is subject to the same incentive for profit margin as anyone else. Look at his merchandise all made in China.

Will be interesting to see whether there is any change won't it?

 

[angus555]

Will be interesting to see whether there is any change won't it?

I don't think so.

Unless we change our society to get rid of the stigma of manual labour or craftsmanship. Perhaps follow the German model for early vocational education that puts many people in skilled trades earlier rather than forcing them to sit through Shakespeare in high school, as if they'll all be going to university.

I think the only place left for young men that don't want to be real estate agents and bankers will be the military.

Unfortunately the military doesn't really make things, it's just there to blow things up. We need both.  :nod:

 

[FJAG]

Does anyone else find it a bit strange 5 months worth of text messages by Anti-Trump FBI agents disappeared?
During the crucial timespan in the FBI’s Russia investigation?

Coincidence right?

I don't find it strange at all. When I was PD of the JAG's Comprehensive Information Management Project I got an eyeful of how DND handles electronic records and to put it politely (with the exception of those few entities that were using RDIMS) there are many more electronic records that disappear (generally when people are posted) then are retained as required under the DSCDS.

Quite frankly, the type of emails that are being discussed in the FBI case, which is more personal chatter than corporate records anyway would under most government records retention policies not be required to be kept in any event. In our RM parlance they are transient records at best which can be/should be disposed of by the user when no longer needed. All too often we keep useless junk around because we are too lazy to take the time to get rid of it.

I would have hoped that the FBI has a bit better e-record retention system than DND but then since these were undoubtedly not corporate records, I'm not surprised that they (together with those of hundreds of other users) were not readily available.

:cheers:

 

[Kat Stevens]

I don't think so.

Unless we change our society to get rid of the stigma of manual labour or craftsmanship. Perhaps follow the German model for early vocational education that puts many people in skilled trades earlier rather than forcing them to sit through Shakespeare in high school, as if they'll all be going to university.

I think the only place left for young men that don't want to be real estate agents and bankers will be the military.

Unfortunately the military doesn't really make things, it's just there to blow things up. We need both.  :nod:

That will be quite enough of that kind of talk. People who work with their backs and their hands are contemptibles. Bill Mahr, Jon Stewart, Steven Colbert, and Hillary Clinton have already told us so.  No room for those sorts in Utopia.

 

[angus555]

That will be quite enough of that kind of talk. People who work with their backs and their hands are contemptibles. Bill Mahr, Jon Stewart, Steven Colbert, and Hillary Clinton have already told us so.  No room for those sorts in Utopia.

People who work with their hands are angry, no doubt. They chose Trump as their savior. A guy that can't take a shite in a toilet if it's not golden.

Would working class people in Germany, who make much more than those in the US and Canada on average choose the same leader? I don't think so.

 

[FJAG]

That will be quite enough of that kind of talk. People who work with their backs and their hands are contemptibles. Bill Mahr, Jon Stewart, Steven Colbert, and Hillary Clinton have already told us so.  No room for those sorts in Utopia.

I listen to all of those people quite often and don't remember any of them denigrating the working men or women of this country. Quite frankly I think that they have high respect for the working class.

The people that they hold as contemptible (more accurately deplorable) are those people who show intolerance for others, who expressed hateful views (particularly against blacks, Hispanics and Muslims) which ran/runs rampant amongst the more extreme Trump followers. It had nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not individuals work with their backs and hands.

Don't you think that it's slightly arrogant to say/suggest that only Republicans/conservatives belong to the working class and that all Democrats/liberals are members of the elite?

[cheers]

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

To be fair, I seem to remember someone in the Democratic party suggesting strongly that the "basket of deplorable" was located within the ranks of Trump supporters.

Just Sayin'

But I agree that neither Mahr, Stewart or Colbert have had a bad word for the working class.

[cheers]

 

[Blackadder1916]

To be fair, I seem to remember someone in the Democratic party suggesting strongly that the "basket of deplorable" was located within the ranks of Trump supporters.

To be completely fair, when the "someone in the Democratic party" coined "basket of deplorables", her explanation of who it included did not delineate by class, education, colour of collar, or occupation, but rather by views.

http://time.com/4486502/hillary-clinton-basket-of-deplorables-transcript/

“You know, to just be grossly generalistic, you could put half of Trump’s supporters into what I call the basket of deplorables. Right?”
“The racist, sexist, homophobic, xenophobic, Islamaphobic—you name it. And unfortunately there are people like that. And he has lifted them up.”

If one thing that the past couple of years of American politics has reminded me of is that all those -ist(s) and -phobic(s) are far from exclusively found within the stereotypical image of poorly educated, working class, rural and southern.

 

[Kat Stevens]

I listen to all of those people quite often and don't remember any of them denigrating the working men or women of this country. Quite frankly I think that they have high respect for the working class.

The people that they hold as contemptible (more accurately deplorable) are those people who show intolerance for others, who expressed hateful views (particularly against blacks, Hispanics and Muslims) which ran/runs rampant amongst the more extreme Trump followers. It had nothing whatsoever to do with whether or not individuals work with their backs and hands.

Don't you think that it's slightly arrogant to say/suggest that only Republicans/conservatives belong to the working class and that all Democrats/liberals are members of the elite?

[cheers]

On one of the very rare times I've manager to sit through a Bill Mahr show he, pre election, made a statement that ended, verbatim, with "non university educated, blue collar morons."  The subtext of any monologue from these guys is that a lack of a university education equates to stupidity. Not everyone wants a bright future as a barista with crippling student debt. Some people are happy to just build and fix the things all those baristas can't afford. Doesn't make them stupid. The Dems dismissed that population as not worthy, and Trump is what they got for their troubles.  Mahr is a pseudo intellectual elitist prick.  As for angry German workers, they elected a pretty nasty piece of work eight decades or so ago. As a result of their national self flagellation of that poor choice, they now limit themselves to leaders like  Reichschancellor Urkell.

 

[mariomike]

I listen to all of those people quite often and don't remember any of them denigrating the working men or women of this country. Quite frankly I think that they have high respect for the working class.

That was the impression I got from Bill Maher and Mike Rowe of "Dirty Jobs".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ls1YhhMHdNY

As far as getting schooled,

300 million Americans are now enrolled in "Trump University".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_University

 

[angus555]

On one of the very rare times I've manager to sit through a Bill Mahr show he, pre election, made a statement that ended, verbatim, with "non university educated, blue collar morons."  The subtext of any monologue from these guys is that a lack of a university education equates to stupidity. Not everyone wants a bright future as a barista with crippling student debt. Some people are happy to just build and fix the things all those baristas can't afford. Doesn't make them stupid. The Dems dismissed that population as not worthy, and Trump is what they got for their troubles.  Mahr is a pseudo intellectual elitist prick.  As for angry German workers, they elected a pretty nasty piece of work eight decades or so ago. As a result of their national self flagellation of that poor choice, they now limit themselves to leaders like  Reichschancellor Urkell.

Yusuf Stevens,

I don't think that the jokes that Bill Maher and others deliver are to blame. They are an easy target, but the real targets are not so easy. Even if the comedians have ridiculed the Trump fanatics, many of whom are working class. They are still comedians, not political leaders. The people that have tossed the working class aside for the sake of their profit margins are to blame. The leaders of the past that complied with the interests of the super rich are to blame.

As for the Germans, I don't think bringing up Hitler will help your train of thought. That was their demagogue for hard times. People vote for crazy people in crazy times. Welcome to the repetition of history.

 

[Kat Stevens]

Yusuf Stevens,

Who?

I don't think that the jokes that Bill Maher and others deliver are to blame. They are an easy target, but the real targets are not so easy. Even if the comedians have ridiculed the Trump fanatics, many of whom are working class. They are still comedians, not political leaders. The people that have tossed the working class aside for the sake of their profit margins are to blame. The leaders of the past that complied with the interests of the super rich are to blame.

You're kidding, right?  Those guys, along with Jimmies Kimmel and Fallon,and several Kardashians do more to form public opinion than a thousand hours of MacNeil Lehrer.

As for the Germans, I don't think bringing up Hitler will help your train of thought. That was their demagogue for hard times. People vote for crazy people in crazy times. Welcome to the repetition of history.

You brought up Teutonic unwillingness to elect mental defectives, I pointed out that they have done so, and only a deeply ingrained self shame prevents them from doing so again.  Godwin does not apply, as the H word was not invoked.

 

[angus555]

You brought up Teutonic unwillingness to elect mental defectives

Yusuf Islam,

I would never underestimate the ability of people to elect mental defectives.

My point was that at this point in time, the German working class is well off enough to not vote for a Trump Drumpf at least in terms of economics. They don't really need to "bring jobs back" the same way we do.

Other factors in their society I'm not going to get into. They'll probably get rid of Merkel soon anyway.

If you can't handle the humour of those comedians, I don't think we're going to come to an understanding here.

 

[Kat Stevens]

Yusuf Islam,

I would never underestimate the ability of people to elect mental defectives.

My point was that at this point in time, the German working class is well off enough to not vote for a Trump Drumpf at least in terms of economics. They don't really need to "bring jobs back" the same way we do.

Other factors in their society I'm not going to get into. They'll probably get rid of Merkel soon anyway.

If you can't handle the humour of those comedians, I don't think we're going to come to an understanding here.

There are three things I take seriously in this world; My job, my family, and West Ham United Football Club.  I view pretty much everything else one gigantic hybrid Greek tragedy/Laurel and Hardy film.  I appreciate humour, even when it's delivered with anything but humourous intent.  At the end of the day, the Dems got the president they deserved by marginalizing stoopid people that work for a living. That is all.

 

[angus555]

There are three things I take seriously in this world; My job, my family, and West Ham United Football Club.  I view pretty much everything else one gigantic hybrid Greek tragedy/Laurel and Hardy film.  I appreciate humour, even when it's delivered with anything but humourous intent.  At the end of the day, the Dems got the president they deserved by marginalizing stoopid people that work for a living. That is all.

Gotcha.

Hey no need to edit Yusuf.. I can handle being called Teat Vajajay.

 

[Kat Stevens]

I didn't edit to save your feelings. I edited because it's infantile to mess with peoples user names, and I was ashamed of myself for stooping to it.

 

[angus555]

I didn't edit to save your feelings. I edited because it's infantile to mess with peoples user names, and I was ashamed of myself for stooping to it.

Well I happen to like Yusuf Islam...didn't think you would be so offended. But the sensitivity is starting to become clearer.