U.S. Military Deserters in Canada Megathread

[niner domestic]

IIRC, the National Resource Mobilization Act didn't come into effect until April 1941, so any Canucks fleeing conscription to the US would have been pounding salt by Dec. 

 

[AJFitzpatrick]

True enough (I think there was similar timing for WWI as well), but I was more curious as to volunteers (as opposed to draftees) who may have deserted since that is  similar to the current situation.

 

[Trinity]

http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/28783/post-485481.html#msg485481

885. ART. 85. DESERTION
(a) Any member of the armed forces who--
(1) without authority goes or remains absent from his unit, organization, or place of duty with intent to remain away therefrom permanently;
(2) quits his unit, organization, or place of duty with intent to avoid hazardous duty or to shirk important service; or
(3) without being regularly separated from one of the armed forces enlists or accepts an appointment in the same or another on of the armed forces without fully disclosing the fact that he has not been regularly separated, or enters any foreign armed service except when authorized by the United States; is guilty of desertion.
(b) Any commissioned officer of the armed forces who, after tender of his resignation and before notice of its acceptance, quits his post or proper duties without leave and with intent to remain away therefrom permanently is guilty of desertion.
(c) Any person found guilty of desertion or attempt to desert shall be punished, if the offense is committed in time of war, by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct, but if the desertion or attempt to desert occurs at any other time, by such punishment, other than death, as a court-martial may direct. 

 

[wannabe SF member]

Canada does not support death sentence so logically if we were to send him back wouldn't that be the same as sentencing him to death?

(hypothetically speaking)

Further PS: (no understatement here ;D)

 

[GO!!!]

Canada does not support death sentence so logically if we were to send him back wouldn't that be the same as sentencing him to death?

(hypothetically speaking)

Further PS: (no understatement here ;D)

No.

His court martial will decide on his punishment, and it is not especially common for deserters to be executed remember the "or some other punishment". Usually they seem to be sentanced to death, but have it commuted to life imprisonment on appeal.

A US muslim soldier who threw a few grenades into a CP and then shot the people escaping was sentanced to death, but the appeals will take about a decade - so is it really a death sentance?

Also, keep in mind that he knew the consequences of his actions when he deserted. He was a volunteer who elected not to fulfill his contractual obligation, and now, hopefully, will reap the consequences.

 

[Kat Stevens]

Not that I'm particularly in the mood to draw fire, but here goes.  Does Canada's extradition policy not prevent us from returning anyone who has even the slightest possibility of a death sentence in their homeland?  Not that I give a soaring rodent's rectum either way, do the crime, do the time.

 

[geo]

Kat  +1

 

[Zell_Dietrich]

Not that I'm particularly in the mood to draw fire, but here goes.  Does Canada's extradition policy not prevent us from returning anyone who has even the slightest possibility of a death sentence in their homeland?  Not that I give a soaring rodent's rectum either way, do the crime, do the time.

Yes and no.

We send them back under the agreement they receive a punishment other than death.

 

[armyvern]

Not that I'm particularly in the mood to draw fire, but here goes.  Does Canada's extradition policy not prevent us from returning anyone who has even the slightest possibility of a death sentence in their homeland?  Not that I give a soaring rodent's rectum either way, do the crime, do the time.

Well that's true. And I feel as you do. I figure if we can ship back Charles Ng, to what surely was an absolute death penalty sentence (and which I had zero problems with by the way); why not a deserter, who's odds of actually being sentenced to death are the least of my worries. As was stated below, no ifs, no ands, and no buts, just a big bye-bye, see ya!!

 

[schart28]

you bet!!

U.S. Military deserters should be returned immediately, no if ands or buts! 

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Well that's true. And I feel as you do. I figure if we can ship back Charles Ng, to what surely was an absolute death penalty sentence (and which I had zero problems with by the way); why not a deserter, who's odds of actually being sentenced to death are the least of my worries. As was stated below, no ifs, no ands, and no buts, just a big bye-bye, see ya!!

Just a point Miss Librarian, Ng only caught sent back because a coilition of Police services pulled a fast one on his lawyers/Canadian polititions........


Almost certain favourable ruling+fueled jet with flight clearance+ co=operation = over the border before his lawyers got thier ruling.

 

[armyvern]

Just a point Miss Librarian, Ng only caught sent back because a coilition of Police services pulled a fast one on his lawyers/Canadian polititions........

That's OK...it was allowed to happen. We all knew he was here.... ;D and, I'd think, the overwhelming majority of us were more than pleased to see the door hitting his butt on the way out.  ;D

 

[wannabe SF member]

U.S. Military deserters should be returned immediately, no if ands or buts! 

I agree, but wouldn't the authorities get problems with human right activists and such?

 

[Kat Stevens]

Just look at them as missing US govt property, screwdriver, wrench, coward, hammer.  Send all lost US kit back to its rightful owners.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I agree, but wouldn't the authorities get problems with human right activists and such?

Human Rights should not be ignored........... Activists and such should be.

 

[geo]

Hmmm...

US army deserters,
Russian spies.............. what next?

Someone please close the door, there's a draft bringing em in

 

[Danjanou]

Hmmm...

US army deserters,
Russian spies.............. what next?

Someone please close the door, there's a draft bringing em in

Let’s not forget Canada’s first family of terrorism Scarborough’s very own Kadr family

http://www.cbc.ca/news/story/2004/03/04/khadr_040304.html

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060110.wguankhad0110/BNStory/International/?page=rss

If there's a door it's a revolving one with no lock. :



Edit because the alzheimers is affecting my spelling  :-[

 

[geo]

Sigh!

 

[wdewitt]

During the Second WW2 all personnel were order to step forward if they would fight. Two corporals refused and they were drum out of the PPCLI. Why bother having them and just get rid of them. Less hassle and less problem dealing with them. It a volunteer force and dragging useless one give use nothing but problems.
Nobody want them and they should pay back all there training it cost the forces.

 

[geo]

During the Second WW2 all personnel were order to step forward if they would fight. Two corporals refused and they were drum out of the PPCLI. Why bother having them and just get rid of them. Less hassle and less problem dealing with them. It a volunteer force and dragging useless one give use nothing but problems.
Nobody want them and they should pay back all there training it cost the forces.

Hmmm....
during WW1 and WW2, Canada had a volunteer army AND conscripts.  For the most part, the conscripts (aka Zombies) and the Old guard provided troops for the Home front while the volunteers went overseas.  What were the circumstances of the Patricias you are talking about?  (reference?)

Then again, it all depends on how well motivated you make your conscripts.  In the old USSR, the NKVD did a commendable job of inspiring young troops of always moving forward - Or else!