The current navy uniform

[Mike Baker]

Spoken from your vast experience with the Army and Navy is it? The CADPAT uniform was designed by the "Clothe the Soldier" program. The disruptive camoflage pattern was field tested for approximately ten years to come up with a uniform that best suited field soldiers. The uniform also has a coating to make it somewhat resistant to IR sensors.
We need uniforms in the Navy that suit our environment. we don't need a uniform to help us hide in the bush or evade IR sensors. We need a uniform that helps when fire breaks out onboard due to enemy action or other misadventures. When we go to action stations we have to close all the openings on our clothing and don flash gear etc......a one piece overall is best suited to that.
what exactly is silly about all of the above?

I may not have no military background, but I sure do know enough that wearing camo on a ship is weird, and makes no sense as you said before. It is like wearing an orange jump suite and trying to hide from someone in the winter.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

I may not have no military background, but I sure do know enough that wearing camo on a ship is weird, and makes no sense as you said before. It is like wearing an orange jump suite and trying to hide from someone in the winter.

Sorry I thought you meant what I was saying about Sailors uniforms was silly...my bad.
We are in agreement...army camoflage gear on board is not appropriate. The other things we need is steel toed boots and warm outer clothing. There are a lot of nasty heavy things that fall on ones toes onboard ships and when you're out on a wind and spray swept deck in the North Atlantic in winter you have to have proper weather gear.

 

[Mike Baker]

No worries. I know what the Navy goes through, because my cousin in Halifax is in the Navy and he usually tells me of what it is all about on ship, and some of the proplems that they face.

 

[Neill McKay]

1) the Square rig or whatever you call it...wow...no way would i want to be wearing that let alone working in it, it just seems very unprofessional, not to mention the hat, seems cumbersome and ill-suited for duty. Basically that uniform is in the past and for gods sake let it rest there.

There's not much doubt that it's not suitable as a working rig, but it does mark the wearer as a sailor -- everybody knows what a sailor looks like.  I understand that the USN did away with it for a time, but brought it back after a strong majority of junior ranks voted to.  I don't know the circumstances around that -- obviously voting on things is rare enough in any military organization.

2) I also agree about the distinction between ratings and officers...contrary to how things were 100 + yrs ago, ratings are educated now, and in my opinion shouldnt be segregated or made fun of because they do not have a commission

But officers are made fun of because we HAVE a commission!   More seriously, but not wanting to take the thread in the direction of an officers vs. NCMs argument, I've seen more NCMs express disdain for officers than I have officers for NCMs.  No sensible officer -- and such a thing does exist in large numbers -- seeks to diminish the NCM cadre.

wash and dry them a few times and the fire retardant qualities are rendered almost null.

I don't believe that's correct.

I must say that i also dont understand why a WORK uniform i.e a uniform you wear to paint, or fix a dirty engine, and do all that fun stuff should be ironed, it baffles my mind that you need creases in your shirt in the morning or whenever your watch is on, to only screw them up by rolling your sleeves or working which naturally dirties and ruins your wonderful ironing job

I won't try to speak for those who make such decisions, but I will say that NCDs, being the usual dress of the day for a pretty large fraction of the navy, are worn in a lot of circumstances where there's no likelihood at all of getting them dirty, greasy, torn, or otherwise buggered up.  Maybe the problem is that we're expecting NCDs to be too many things to too many people -- they're almost turning into a present-day garrison dress, i.e. a rig that can't decide if it's for hard-core filthy work or wearing around the office, so it's not quite right for either environment.

 

[axeman]

I must say that i also dont understand why a WORK uniform i.e a uniform you wear to paint, or fix a dirty engine, and do all that fun stuff should be ironed, it baffles my mind that you need creases in your shirt in the morning or whenever your watch is on, to only screw them up by rolling your sleeves or working which naturally dirties and ruins your wonderful ironing job

I won't try to speak for those who make such decisions, but I will say that NCDs, being the usual dress of the day for a pretty large fraction of the navy, are worn in a lot of circumstances where there's no likelihood at all of getting them dirty, greasy, torn, or otherwise buggered up.  Maybe the problem is that we're expecting NCDs to be too many things to too many people -- they're almost turning into a present-day garrison dress, i.e. a rig that can't decide if it's for hard-core filthy work or wearing around the office, so it's not quite right for either environment..


Well what about us that do expect it to stand up to the abuse of a normal work day, wich is around the engines ,diesels, and various plants that are part of the SHIP,or training that is expected to happen? as to Ironing when I was in the infantry i was tasked with the guns [ARTY FOR YOU NAVY TYPES]and was promptly told iron my combats and spit polish my combat boots . I told em to look at the tag which proscibed that exact order. well the tags say it is allowable but the Question is "Is it really required?.

>

 

[aesop081]

like someone else said wash and dry them a few times and the fire retardant qualities are rendered almost null. 

Thats the problem when FR clothing is washed with your other clothes.  Cotton ( or whatever else) fibers will get into the fiber of you NCDs in the wash and dry....thats whats ruining the FR properties ( non-FR fiber mixed in with the nomex).  Same with putting them in the dryer with those dryer sheets.......wax isnt exactly FR now is it ?

I wash my flightsuits seperate from everything else for a reason

 

[CallOfDuty]

  The NCD's just look so damn sloppy....if you are doing any sort of heavy work, the shirt starts coming undone...the pants get caught in the seaboots...they get wrinkley.  Then after you wash them so many times they become a dark shade of green instead of black...etc etc. 
    Then when you are walking around at stad, and you've been working hard that day, you get in trouble for looking dirty!!  " Yes P.O. I'm sorry I have some dust on my work pants P.O.......won't happen again!!"
CHeers
COD

 

[Stoker]

Naval Improved Clothing and Equipment (NICE)

   NICE, A Navy Project created to correct and improve some of the deficiencies that were with our naval operational dress and equipment.  This $91 Million dollar plan is subdivided into 17-smaller projects is now underway.  Many items will add new capabilities to support work/operations in wet/hot/cold/windy weather.  In conjunction to the NICE project items, other Naval Combat Dress and associated equipment will be revisited for possible product improvement to capitalize on new fabric technology that has developed over the past few years.  As examples, the NCD jacket and trousers will be improved for better fit and appearance and other items such as the anti-flash hood will be studied in order to find better fabrics and/or design that could possibly bring this and other garment to the next higher level.
   Clothing and items included as part of the trial and a brief description are included below.
   
NICE Clothing and Issue
2-in-1 Rain suit/wind breaker - A 2 piece waterproof, static dissipative suit of navy blue / black color.  Intended for  wear as a walking out dress with NCDs during hot, cool weather and during low relative humidity conditions. It will have thermal dissipative characteristics to be wearable from +10 to +25C. This item is presently being trialed.
Boots - Safety Boots - Hot Weather - Non-insulated (wearable to + 40C) safety boots with static dissipative or insulative penetration.  POL resistant with non-slip soles. A waterproof, Moisture Vapour Permeable (MVP) capability.
Boots - Safety Boots - Temperate Weather - Insulated (wearable to -25C) with static dissipative or insulative penetration, POL resistant with non-slip soles. A waterproof, Moisture Vapour Permeable (MVP) capability.
Socks - This foot covering will incorporate the new wicking properties (e.g.: Cool Max) to ensure maximum anti-blister capability.
Drawers, Temperate Underwear (Unisex)
“T” Shirts, Cotton, crewneck - To provide the standard issue of a black coloured shirt for wear with NCDs and for Naval personnel who are required to wear CADPAT.
Coveralls Hot Weather - Tan colour, lightweight (5.5 oz Nomex), fire retardant, anti-static one-piece coverall (MOTS). This item, currently in the naval inventory is required for additional issue to submariners and clearance divers.
Coveralls Temperate Weather - Navy blue in colour (7.5 oz Nomex), fire retardant, anti-static one piece coverall (MOTS). This item, currently in the naval inventory is required for additional issue to submariners and clearance divers.
Thermal Underwear - The NICE issue to all naval personnel of 5 shirts and 5 drawers.
Environmental Clothing - It will be worn as field operational clothing in place of the current naval combat clothing. It will be the same as or similar to the Integrated Clothing Ensemble (ICE) currently being fielded by DSSPM. Suitable for Port Security and Base Defence Force duties as well as, field clothing for Training Establishments CFFSE and CFNOS (anti-static, POL phobic).
Gloves Cold/Wet Weather - Combat Gloves.
Sunglasses - Sunglasses for universal issue to naval personnel, for protection from UV rays in both summer and winter. The lenses will be shatterproof and the frame compatible for wear with headsets, helmets and ear defenders.
Ballistic Vest - Ballistic protection for ships' bridge personnel, Force Protection Teams, Naval Boarding Party and Port Security personnel.
Anti-flash Hoods & Gloves - Protection for ships' personnel during action/emergency stations in the event of flash or fire resulting from incoming ordinance or domestic fire. NICE project will explore market improvements in FR materials. There will be no design change to the current hood and glove.
Hot Weather Hat - This headwear will be wide brimmed combat hat, in Navy blue or natural in colour. Issue of this hat would be limited to personnel deploying on “Hot Weather” operations only.
Fleece Liner (removable) Navy Winter Parka - The current Navy Winter Parka is acceptable for wear in temperatures of +15C to -10C. Naval personnel are subjected to extreme cold temperatures dipping to -40C. A removable fleece liner would compliment the Navy Winter Parka for comfort in extreme cold temperatures.
Multi-tool - For members in occupations who work in austere conditions will require a multi-purpose tool, incorporating a knife blade, pliers etc. The multi-tool will be for limited issue regulated by Scale of Issue.

 

[JamieR]

Can someone tell me what the white sleves and white hood/masks are that navy wear during combat/combat training? What are they for?

http://www.navy.forces.gc.ca/cms_images/gallery/large/ISD01-9605a_L.jpg

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Flash Gear...worn to protect the wearer from flash burns and fires

 

[jollyjacktar]

Well i have to say
1) the Square rig or whatever you call it...wow...no way would i want to be wearing that let alone working in it, it just seems very unprofessional, not to mention the hat, seems cumbersome and ill-suited for duty. Basically that uniform is in the past and for gods sake let it rest there.

As you can see by my avatar, I like a "proper" sailor's uniform and would love to have that as my walking out dress.  I am not, a Commissioned Officer and do not wish to even look similar to one while in my DEU.  Officer's should look like officers, and that uniform is fine and correct for them.  However, the RCN died in 67 and the traditional uniforms soon after.  I don't think you have to honestly fear that they would ever return.  Each to their own, mate.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

Well i have to say
1) the Square rig or whatever you call it...wow...no way would i want to be wearing that let alone working in it, it just seems very unprofessional, not to mention the hat, seems cumbersome and ill-suited for duty. Basically that uniform is in the past and for gods sake let it rest there.

So you're sayind that the RN, USN, and most of the other Navys in the world have unprofessional looking sailor's uniforms. ha ha ha ha ha ha
It's us that are out of step my friend. The USN brought the sailor suit back....and we would do well to follow suit. You'll never be mistaken for a commisionaire again!  ;D

 

[Navy_Blue]

2010 is fast approaching.  What better time to get back to the basics of Square Rig and any other radical change in the way we look act and work.  A nice Birthday present for the Canadian/Royal Canadian Navy.  ;D  Three years to bug the higher ups and politicians to make it happen too.

 

[M Feetham]

OK, you don't have to iron your NCD's at sea, as long as they are clean and wrinkle free. Also, at sea when you do your laundry, military clothing is washed seperatley from your civies. When you are along side you should at least have one crease running down the center of the front of the leg. the shirt should at the very least be wrinkle free. Ironing your NOMEX clothing will not destry the FR capability of the clothes if you follow the instructions that are on the labels. As far as Camouflage onboard ship's, there was talk about some sort of weird ass CBT that were supposed to be blue and grey. I saw it on a post here somewhere but cannot verify it. As for Nametapes and rank insignia, for those wearing combats the Canforgen put out this year states that they will be for Nametpes- OD green background, black lettering with a black fouled anchor, black border. The rank insignia will be OD background with black rank and canada. I have already seen some of them here in St Jean and they lool very sharp. The black t-shirt at the moment will not be issued, and the acquisition of them will be at the members cost until further notice. I am unsure about the square rig, I think it looks sharp, but it would be expensive to bring it back into service. Here is the ref for the canforgen. Sorry no link, i'm not sure how to do it.
CANFORGEN 027/07 -07 CMS 008-07 191431Z FEB 07
NAVAL DRESS UPDATE - NAVAL ENVIRONMENTAL INDICATORS - CADPAT
Cheers.
Feet

 

[axeman]

If the uniform is intended for use in combat what  purpose does the crease do?

 

[M Feetham]

AT sea, there is no purpose for the crease, but along side, it is still a matter of dress and deportment, we are still expected to dress and behave as professionals. A lot of people bitch and moan about having to iron their clothes. Really, c'mon is it really that difficult. Personnaly i think they are just being lazy. We still get paid by the crown and the crown expects certain things in return for that paycheck. Not really all that much when you think about it.
Cheers, Feet

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

Depends on the ship you're on whether you require creases or not at sea.

 

[M Feetham]

I agree, however for the most part, as long as your NCD's are clean and wrinkle free at sea you won't have any problems. I do know that some PO1's like to have inspections on the odd occasion and a very few insist that clothes be pressed even at sea. The situation usually dictates, if you are in any type of sea state above a flat calm, ironing in the mess can be a little difficult and I absolutley agree with ironing your uniforms when alongside, but then I have been at the recruit  school for two years and I am little brainwashed.
Cheers, Feet

 

[Ex-Dragoon]

You must be almost due to come back soon there M.

 

[M Feetham]

Posted on 16 july, going to HMCS Algonquin, house is sold, setting up my DIT today. It's gonna be rough going back to a ship after working here for two years.
Marc