Sikh & India (Alleged) Shenanigans in Canada (split fm Non-Muslim terr thread)

[Good2Golf]

I doubt that PP's security clearance is the crux of the issue. It is a convenient sideswipe, though.

Again, a useful pictorial…


Canada seems to be going all in with the Khalistanis should be able to pursue their independent destiny and India doesn’t have the moral authority to enforce its sovereignty over the region and a whole bunch of Canadian government representatives fully support the Khalistani independence movement. On the specifics of Najji’s death, Canada needs to stop with the “we have information about potential (they keep using that word, never ‘confirmed’) involvement of the Indian federal government in his killing. Hiding behind the “we’re (still) investigating so we can say anything” excuse is getting rather thin. Especially when one sees the willingness of the Canadian government to suspend activities that would actually out more heat and light in the issue…at least until PMJT is back in Canada after his extended visit to India.

 

[Haggis]

Again, a useful pictorial…
View attachment 80187
Especially when one sees the willingness of the Canadian government to suspend activities that would actually out more heat and light in the issue…at least until PMJT is back in Canada after his extended visit to India.

The PM has been back for several days. He made the revelations in person in the House on Monday.

The only way he may be able to return to India now is in disguise. I'm sure he has quite a few costumes.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

I doubt that PP's security clearance is the crux of the issue. It is a convenient sideswipe, though.

It is amazing that PP is such a powerful force of nature that according to this Government, literally everything is his fault. And all that from the Opposition Benches…

 

[Good2Golf]

The PM has been back for several days. He made the revelations in person in the House on Monday.

The only way he may be able to return to India now is in disguise. I'm sure he has quite a few costumes.

Doh. Meant that to be in past tense…”was” (back in)

 

[brihard]

And the Gov could have given him a gag order as well, no ?

PP is smart to stay away from the SC, for the moment...

Classified information doesn’t work by “gag order”. Protection of classified info is by virtue of the Security of Information Act (SOIA), and an individual can be subject to a lifetime permanent binding of secrecy by virtue of their individual work or their employment with certain designated organizations. It’s not a matter of “here sign this NDA and we’ll show you some SIGINT”.

With that said, Parliamentary privilege is very powerful, and the courts have recently, in Alford v Canada 2023, upheld parliamentary privilege against statutory bars to disclosing classified information. That specific case was in relation to s.12 of the statutory authority for the National Security and Intelligence Committee of Parliamentarians that prevented NSICOP members from asserting Parliamentary privilege, but the legal principle so established by the court would likely be more broadly applicable. I believe that the leader of the opposition, in the context of good faith exercise of his privileged parliamentary functions, would have legal protections against prosecution if it was necessary to discuss or disclose classified information. While we could expect this more in the context of an in camera committee or caucus meeting versus question period, nonetheless he has some legal ability to make use of such information- to the point where I question the validity of a claim that disclosing classified intelligence to him is much of a political trap.

 

[RangerRay]

Again, a useful pictorial…
View attachment 80187

Canada seems to be going all in with the Khalistanis should be able to pursue their independent destiny and India doesn’t have the moral authority to enforce its sovereignty over the region and a whole bunch of Canadian government representatives fully support the Khalistani independence movement.

Oddly enough, in present day, the only support for Khalistan is in the overseas Sikh diaspora. Based on what I’ve read, there is no support (I.e. zero, zilch, nada) support for separatism in Punjab itself.

 

[OldSolduer]

Oddly enough, in present day, the only support for Khalistan is in the overseas Sikh diaspora. Based on what I’ve read, there is no support (I.e. zero, zilch, nada) support for separatism in Punjab itself.

If there is ONE thing Canada should be doing is not butting its nose in India's business. We resent it when others do it (Vive Quebec Libre) so we should STFU and sit down

 

[RangerRay]

One thing that I have been thinking about…

If the reason PMJT made this announcement was to get ahead of the Globe’s story, why didn’t they use the same statement they always do about open investigations (“this is under investigation, all leads are being followed, we won’t say anything that will pre-judge the outcome, etc.”). Is the investigation complete and the result was the diplomat bounced was responsible and that’s it? Is it still ongoing and this announcement took a big dump in it?

Something stinks about this whole situation and I don’t think anyone is acting in good faith here.

 

[Good2Golf]

It is amazing that PP is such a powerful force of nature that according to this Government, literally everything is his fault. And all that from the Opposition Benches…

Woah, woah, woah!!!

It’s not Poilievre’s fault…it’s…

 

[Halifax Tar]

Classified information doesn’t work by “gag order”. Protection of classified info is by virtue of the Security of Information Act (SOIA), and an individual can be subject to a lifetime permanent binding of secrecy by virtue of their individual work or their employment with certain designated organizations. It’s not a matter of “here sign this NDA and we’ll show you some SIGINT”.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the whole reason he wouldn't get a SC ? He could be told things and then gagged and be unable to thus criticize the gov ?

I seem to remember something like that.

With that said, Parliamentary privilege is very powerful, and the courts have recently, in Alford v Canada 2023, upheld parliamentary privilege against statutory bars to disclosing classified information. That specific case was in relation to s.12 of the statutory authority for the National Security and Intelligence Committee of Parliamentarians that prevented NSICOP members from asserting Parliamentary privilege, but the legal principle so established by the court would likely be more broadly applicable. I believe that the leader of the opposition, in the context of good faith exercise of his privileged parliamentary functions, would have legal protections against prosecution if it was necessary to discuss or disclose classified information. While we could expect this more in the context of an in camera committee or caucus meeting versus question period, nonetheless he has some legal ability to make use of such information- to the point where I question the validity of a claim that disclosing classified intelligence to him is much of a political trap.

 

[Kirkhill]

I doubt that PP's security clearance is the crux of the issue. It is a convenient sideswipe, though.

I believe that the Privy Council has the requisite security clearances. In Canada the Leader of the Opposition is not a member of the Privy Council.

In the UK he is. As are members of the shadow cabinet.

Jeremy Corbin is a member of the King's Privy Council in the UK as is Diane Abbott.

National Security and Intelligence Committee of Parliamentarians Regulations

Federal laws of Canada

laws.justice.gc.ca

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_current_members_of_the_King%27s_Privy_Council_for_Canad

List of current members of the British Privy Council - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[brihard]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that the whole reason he wouldn't get a SC ? He could be told things and then gagged and be unable to thus criticize the gov ?

I seem to remember something like that.

I don’t know. I can’t speak to whether he has a clearance, or why/why not, or if so, what type/level/compartment of clearance he has. I’m sure if he needed one that would be (or has been) facilitated.

As for “gagged”, I think different law would apply to discussions and disclosures within the scope of parliamentary function versus, say, an interview on Power and Politics.

 

[Haggis]

A good read on Parliamentary Privilege in Canada.

Parliamentary Privilege - Our Procedure - ProceduralInfo - House of Commons of Canada

In short, parliamentarians can say things in the House which, if said in public, could result in a civil suit. At times, even some ad hominem attacks are tolerated by the Speaker, but not often and members must be very careful when going down that road. That's why many inflammatory statements are aimed at the Party and not the individual member.

 

[RangerRay]

I believe that the Privy Council has the requisite security clearances. In Canada the Leader of the Opposition is not a member of the Privy Council.

In the UK he is. As are members of the shadow cabinet.

Jeremy Corbin is a member of the King's Privy Council in the UK as is Diane Abbott.

National Security and Intelligence Committee of Parliamentarians Regulations

Federal laws of Canada

laws.justice.gc.ca

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_current_members_of_the_King%27s_Privy_Council_for_Canad

List of current members of the British Privy Council - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I seem to remember Harper being made a member of the Privy Council when he became OLO.

 

[OldSolduer]

I see the China thread is not as active.

Hmmmmm

 

[Good2Golf]

I see the China thread is not as active.

Hmmmmm

 

[RangerRay]

I see the China thread is not as active.

Hmmmmm

You know what else happened Monday? The public enquiry into foreign interference kicked off.

Terry Glavin: Trudeau wins by making himself the centre of attention — again

On India murder plot allegations, all we know is what the prime minister is telling us

nationalpost.com

 

[RangerRay]

So Trudeau scuppered an effort to reconcile Khalistan separatists and the Indian government?

Terry Glavin: After Trudeau alleges murder plot, Canada-India relations may be irreparable

Who are these 'credible allegations' coming from?

nationalpost.com

Little was accomplished by the Canada-India “cooperation framework” on intelligence and security signed during Trudeau’s disastrous costume-pageantry tour of India in 2018. Even before then, the newly-elected Trudeau government had already alienated India by shutting down efforts Modi was making to reconcile with Khalistanis who for years had been fomenting violence in India from their Canadian safe haven.

In the foreground is the June 18 gangland-style killing of Hardeep Singh Nijjar outside the Guru Nanak Temple in Surrey, B.C., where Nijjar served as president. But in the background is what became largely a covert operation, a backchannel reconciliation effort between Modi’s Bharatiya Janata Party and veteran Canadian Khalistanis who were growing weary of agitating for a separate Sikh state in India that India’s Sikhs want nothing to do with.

That initiative was facilitated mostly by the British Sikh activist Jasdev Singh Rai, who had met with the Canadian Security and Intelligence Service during several visits to Canada, but the Trudeau government bowed to a Khalistani-influenced group of gurudwara leaders and “obstructed the peace dialogue process,” Rai said at the time. Rai found himself barred from Canada.

 

[Kirkhill]

If there is ONE thing Canada should be doing is not butting its nose in India's business. We resent it when others do it (Vive Quebec Libre) so we should STFU and sit down

I don't think India's concern is with the Canadian government per se.

I think their greater concern is with the potential for a repeat of this:

Khomeini launched a revolution from a sleepy French village

NEAUPHLE-LE-CHATEAU, France (AP) — From a sleepy village outside Paris, the man who would become the supreme leader of the Islamic Republic of Iran sat cross-legged beneath an apple tree, delivering messages daily to hundreds of followers clamoring to glimpse the glowering cleric in the black turban

apnews.com

A good friend would not allow that situation to develop.

 

[RangerRay]

I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised.


Trudeau declines to offer more evidence on Indian accusations

There is an active RCMP investigation into Nijjar’s death and Trudeau said the government doesn’t want to interfere in that process.