PTSD / OSI [Merged]

[the 48th regulator]

For someone who claims to have such an interest in PTSD.....
One wonders why you haven't participated in any of these discussions
since you started this thread back in early Nov. ?
I'm actually surprised at how many people fell for this !

C'mon folks didn't we learn anything over those years in the CF
about sharing personal information with people we don't know.......

Just a thought 

Well are we not the shining light in the land of darkness. So what you are saying is PTSD definately should be kept hidden, especially the way those that suffer are treated.  Dang now opsec is in tatters.

dileas

tess

(Sarcasm off.....naw,  I will keep it on)

 

[Sabre1918]

Well are we not the shining light in the land of darkness. So what you are saying is PTSD definately should be kept hidden, especially the way those that suffer are treated.   Dang now opsec is in tatters.

dileas

tess

(Sarcasm off.....naw,   I will keep it on)

Not saying that at all........
What I was implying was that the person who originally started this thread
hasn't been heard from since. That leaves me wondering what he/she was really after in the first place.
Perhaps to get a rise out of everyone here, and he/she definately did just that !
My second statement is self explanitory. And that is; we shouldn't be so quick to hand out information.
Allthough, no names were mentioned here, I was able to identify at least 3-4 individuals
that were talked about in different replies...


Some Directing Staff in this forum seem to think there $#%^ don't stink....Why's that ?
RU better than us less godly ?

 

[Guy. E]

ive been living through all of this PTSD most of my life. My father was with 1CER out of Chilliwack (for those of you who don't know, the first ones to leave for the gulf) i still remember the day he left and came back from Kuwait. he also made tours in Croatia and Bosnia. hes told me stories of the "Highway to Hell", hes told me about limbless children in Bosnia...

We watched the documentary on CBC. alot of what they spoke of on there, i have lived under. only recently (past few years) have we gotten serious help. and it does help.

i find it particularly insulting how some of yous act in relation to this subject. you are supposed be supportive of your comrads. not suspective and persecutive. no wonder its so hard for people with the real issues to come out, what if you had real issues and everyone thought you were faking it for a buck?

2 days after i watched the documentary on CBC, i went to see Jarhead. its in a way  one of the most touching films i have seen, it brought everything to a newer and clearer understanding.

i agree, the system is not perfect as of right now. 10 years ago, there was no real system that i know of. it will eventually be perfected and corrected. we will see what happens in the future and if the new CDS will change anything around.

theres allot here i haven't talked about and alot i wont talk about.

id guess half of this is just rambling by someone who isn't even in the CF yet.


On your own time, at your own target, Flame at will...

 

[Armymedic]

i find it particularly insulting how some of yous act in relation to this subject. you are supposed be supportive of your comrads. not suspective and persecutive. no wonder its so hard for people with the real issues to come out, what if you had real issues and everyone thought you were faking it for a buck?

We generally are. And for most of us who have had a friend or coworker have real difficulties, there is a period of disbelief that this particular soldier can be afflicted with this condition. But we understand if there has been something truly shocking happen to them, that this may happen.

But it is also very hard for those of us to understand why a coworker, Pte Joe Blow, after having gone through the same training and experiences as I have during the last tour:

is now not showing up to work, and I have to take up his load, cleaning and readying the unit kit,
is now not having to go out on ex and I have to,
doesn't have to go do any duties, but I am now on my third,
how he is now getting a pension, still at work, and still not doing anything, but I am expected to go again on tour,
all because he says he has PTSD.
I am not sure why I would be bitter...


I think this and the other thread have pretty well run their course...PTSD and the handling of mental illnesses (and yes, that is what it is) in the CF is improving...more complaining about it here isn't going to improve it any.
If you think you might have a problem, then look here:

Operational Trauma and Stress Support Centres:
http://www.forces.gc.ca/health/services/engraph/otssc_home_e.asp?Lev1=1&Lev2=2

If you are still not satisfied, take it up with your chain of command.

mods, lets lock this up.

 

[Infanteer]

Done.

 

[silentbutdeadly]

How many people out there actually think members are Faking PTSD/OSI injuries out there? or could be faking this injury. I suffer from a OSI and was reading a thread and someone mentioned Faking and it kinda hit me and i thought well what do other members think as i have experienced others within my Bn as being brand with the Faking tag. I hope this helps. If not someone sort me out please!

 

[the 48th regulator]

How many people out there actually thing members are Faking PTSD/OSI injuries out there? Just curious! Is it lack of education or what?

You lost me here.

Lack of ecdcuation on who's part?

Are you suggesting that the testing for OSI's such as PTSD, is easy to fake?

dileas

tess

 

[Strike]

How many people out there actually thing members are Faking PTSD/OSI injuries out there? Just curious! Is it lack of education or what?

You've just opened a whole can of worms there my friend.  I hope you're not just committing a hit and run here.

 

[OldSolduer]

Maybe this topic should be locked.

I personally think that faking PTSD would be very difficult.

 

[the 48th regulator]

Maybe this topic should be locked.

I personally think that faking PTSD would be very difficult.

It will be locked, if it is a post and run.

But I beleive SBD, has a right to explain himself, as this is a good topic to talk about.

dileas

tess

 

[GAP]

You don't need a can of worms when you are trolling....

That said, SBD are you talking about people making false claims (eg: the jerk who raped a young girl and claimed PTSD) or are you taking about people claiming PTSD when in fact the actually do not suffer from it?

 

[Yrys]

How many people out there actually thing members are Faking PTSD/OSI injuries out there?

What I understand from that it's he's asking how many people here think that soldiers claiming
PTSD are faking it . So he want to know how many people are prejudices  (préjugés) against PTSD people...

as in "For one can be judged, or have been judged or be judged in advance, without anyone being there
or having ever been there" or without having the same stress impose on them ...

Just curious! Is it lack of education or what?

So people that take an eyes of "faking" toward PTSD people, are they lacking education about the reality of it,
or something else ?


That is what I understand about his post... and it seems interesting to me...
I don't see any trolling for the moment.

 

[the 48th regulator]

What I understand from that it's he's asking how many people here think that soldiers claiming
PTSD are faking it . So he want to know how many people are prejudices  (préjugés) against PTSD people...

as in "For one can be judged, or have been judged or be judged in advance, without anyone being there
or having ever been there" or without having the same stress impose on them ...

So people that take an eyes of "faking" toward PTSD people, are they lacking education about the reality of it,
or something else ?


That is what I understand about his post... and it seems interesting to me...
I don't see any trolling for the moment.

That is a very good observation.

As I said, I would like this topic to remain unlocked, so that SBD can better explain himlself.

dileas

tess

 

[PMedMoe]

What I understand from that it's he's asking how many people here think that soldiers claiming
PTSD are faking it . So he want to know how many people are prejudices  (préjugés) against PTSD people...

I don't think he wants to know if people are prejudiced against people who have PTSD, I think he's just curious if anyone thinks people may be faking PTSD.

Why would someone fake PTSD?  Who knows?  Medical coverage?  Getting out of another tour?  Beats me.

 

[Blackadder1916]

While SBD's opening post (being somewhat sparse about his reasoning/interest in the subject) could be taken at face value as trying to stir the pot, he may have a personal stake in turning the spoon.

I think that the military has excellent staff on Operations and back at home from my experience. The true problem still lays with the CoC. Not to get into to much detail but i think there is still the black cloud of how to deal with personal on Operations with this problem and from what happend to me and a few other personnal we were treated like outcasts by some of the higher levels of command. I was called in the open so some of my peers and friends heard that i was a plain coward and that i lend other soldiers astay and this from the highest in our Chain so i think education still needs to be worked on. Don't get me wrong there was alot and i mean alot of people who came up to me in KAF and said i had alot of courage for what i did and they couldn't do that. What i am getting at is that yes its getting better, way better but we still need alot of education on this subject and we need to get the soldiers who were in these situations out there talking to soldiers going and coming back.

 

[2 Cdo]

I think it would actually come as a complete surprise if there were no cases of troops faking PTSD. I know of 2 people who were being "coached" as to how to act, what to say etc. I truly feel sympathetic towards those diagnosed with PTSD, what I feel to those trying to milk the system be "faking" a mental illness cannot be printed here.

 

[Yrys]

I think it would actually come as a complete surprise if there were no cases of troops faking PTSD. I know of 2 people who were being "coached" as to how to act, what to say etc. I truly feel sympathetic towards those diagnosed with PTSD, what I feel to those trying to milk the system be "faking" a mental illness cannot be printed here.

"We" can be sure that there is always some people trying to make advantage of the system. But they seem to me
to be a minority, ontoward which people are too much focusing, instead of the people that are having problems...

Into which category do you usually put PTSD people, when you don't know them , 2Cdo ? Faking it, or sick ?
And how do you distinguish the 2 category , on what observations do you make a judgement that they belong
to one rather then the other ?

 

[3rd Herd]

National Defence and Canadian Forces Ombudsmen Special Report
Systemic treatment of CF members with PTSD
Complainant: Christian McEachern
http://www.ombudsman.forces.gc.ca/rep-rap/sr-rs/pts-ssp/rep-rap-02-eng.asp


"Because PTSD is not a affliction that can be measured it is difficult to determine who is a malingerer and who legitimately suffers from the disorder. There are legitimate psychological and mental impairments for collecting disability." (March 24th, 2008 by Richard Brassaw http://www.disabilityhappens.com/how-where-to-report-va-abuse-and-fraud.html )

" Experts say the sharp increase does not begin to factor in the potential impact of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, because the increase is largely the result of Vietnam War vets seeking treatment decades after their combat experiences. Facing a budget crunch, experts within and outside the Veterans Affairs Department are raising concerns about fraudulent claims, wondering whether the structure of government benefits discourages healing, and even questioning the utility and objectivity of the diagnosis itself." Further,  ""My concern about the policies is that they create perverse incentives to stay ill. It is very tough to get better when you are trying to demonstrate how ill you are." Continuing, "The concern by Frueh and Satel about overdiagnosis and fraud - what researchers call "false positives" - has drawn the ire of veterans groups and many other mental health experts....... A far bigger problem is the many veterans who seek help but do not get it or who never seek help, a number of experts said. Studies have shown that large numbers of veterans with PTSD never seek treatment, possibly because of the stigma surrounding mental illness..... "There are periodic false positives, but there are also a lot of false negatives out there," said Terence M. Keane, one of the nation's best-known PTSD researchers, who cited a 1988 study on the numbers of veterans who do not get treatment. "Less than one-fourth of people with combat-related PTSD have used VA-related services.....What they are trying to do is figure out a way not to diagnose vets with PTSD," said Steve Robinson, executive director of the National Gulf War Resource Center, a veterans advocacy group. "It's like telling a patient with cancer, 'if we tell you, you don't have cancer, then you won't suffer from cancer.' " (A Political Debate on Stress Disorder By Shankar Vedantam The Washington Post  27 December 2005) http://www.blackherbals.com/a_political_debate_on_stress_dis.htm

 

[Eye In The Sky]

I think it would actually come as a complete surprise if there were no cases of troops faking PTSD. I know of 2 people who were being "coached" as to how to act, what to say etc. I truly feel sympathetic towards those diagnosed with PTSD, what I feel to those trying to milk the system be "faking" a mental illness cannot be printed here.

On the flip side, and maybe completely off topic for this thread, I wondered when I read your post "and how many people that have PTSD are faking they don't, so they aren't labelled, past over for career progression, kept off the next tour or shunned and "silently suffer on the inside but with smiles on their faces in the Coy/Sqn/Bty lines"..or whatever their unit lines may be.

 

[RHFC_piper]

To be quite honest, there are some days when I think maybe I'm one of "those guys" who is "milking the system" for whatever (money/sympathy/etc)... and I feel that, maybe I don't really have a problem...  There are days I think the diagnosis for "anxiety disorder" is just a result of my being melodramatic...  But then I have days where I'm just angry for no reasons, where I think the way to solve my problems involves destroying everything within arms reach, and days where I'm just overly emotional for no reason... Followed by nights where I sleep for 10 minutes every half hour.  There are more of these days than the good days.  I know something's not right.
Not to mention; because of this issue, I have to make regular trips to the OSI clinic, have to take pills daily (I hate meds... even Tylenol) and I'll probably never deploy again... why would someone fake this hell?

But, I believe, for every soldier 'faking' PTSD or any OSI there has got to be a least 10 suffering with the symptoms and going with out help.  If the general populous of the CF judges members with OSI's by the few who are 'faking it' than those who go undiagnosed and unaided will only suffer more.  
Since, as stated in many documents (and posts), PTSD is not a affliction that can be measured and just about anyone who has been involved in a stressful situation could be affected, or could fake the effects, it is more so up to the rest of the CF to take all claims at face value to maintain the level of care for, and reduce the amount of prejudice against, the members who are actually affected.  The determination of who is 'faking it' or not should be left to those who are professionally responsible for that diagnosis (aka. everyone who is not a psychiatric care giver should just stay in their lanes.)