Logistic Vehicle Modernization Project - Replacing everything from LUVW to SHLVW

[OldSolduer]

Dear Troops,

Careful what you ask for.  You complained loud and long about things like boots, tacvests, mukluks etc, and so we spent all of our energy trying to satisfy your needs and desires.  Sadly, we had no capacity left to focus on important things like trucks.

Signed,

DND

I have to agree with this.

Sometimes,as much as this pains me to say, we pay too much attention to "want" and not enough to "need".

 

[Kirkhill]

Jim, I don't like the differentiation between "want" and "need".

Too many budget cycles and too many fights with accountants trying to justify a purchase on the basis of a "need" only to have the idiot with the cash to tell me or my customer it can't be afforded.  They spin their efforts at "due dilligence", blissfully ignorant of the nature of the operations they are reviewing,  and demand the trimming of your "wish list" into "wants" and "needs".  They then immediately eliminate the "wants" and hack the "needs" with a dull axe.

I would sooner they just left the wish list intact, told us how much money they are going to let us have for the year and then bugger off back to their lairs to play with their latest electronic gizmos* until the next tax year comes around.  Let the operators manage their budgets.

*It is a particular bugbear of mine that the one department that never seems to lack for "toys" is the accounting department.  When mastodons were crushing ice (I'm not quite as old as some round here) and laptops were new inventions, the first department so equipped in the company for which I worked, was the upper echelons of the accountants who showed up at their desk every morning at 9:15 precisely.  Not those of us in the field force serving clients from Florida to Alaska and fielding calls at 2 O'Clock in the morning.

PS - It must be infectious.  I must apologize.  I have noted a recent tendency for the tone of my posts to become ever more sarcastic and pointed and negative.  It is either February or the civvy version of Cafard.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Kirkhill
You are bang on, the "necessary sacrifices" are to be borne by the doers and not the planners(who see their function as critical). Sadly the places that should be cut have enough time, information sources and resources to insulate themselves from the cuts which end up fostering themselves on the people to busy doing their job to notice the reduction vibes coming their way. It's not just a DND issue either. I suspect DND and NDHQ could happily function without any actual combat forces at their disposal.

 

[The Bread Guy]

.... the "necessary sacrifices" are to be borne by the doers and not the planners ....

And in most systems, it's the planners, not the doers, who plan the changes .... 

I suspect DND and NDHQ could happily function without any actual combat forces at their disposal.

Hate to sound like a broken record, but there's a "Yes, Minister" episode on that - a hospital where 1)  there are no patients, 2)  public servants within said it's actually easier to run the place without patients, and 3) a union threatens a general strike at word the government is looking at closing the hospital.

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

You forgot to mention that in the episode, the empty hospital won the Florence Nightingale Award for most hygienic hospital .

 

[Fishbone Jones]

From the sounds of today's budget, this thread has just become an academic exercise.

Best get out the paint and tire black. It sounds like you won't be getting anything new for a long time yet.

 

[PPCLI Guy]

The trucks were profiled for 2021 / 2022. so no immediate impact

 

[Old EO Tech]

The trucks were profiled for 2021 / 2022. so no immediate impact

Yes I'm hoping this is nothing more than some smoke and mirrors, the LVM project is not delivering the LSVW and HLVW replacement until the 2023 timeframe, but I do hope that the MSVS SMP or the ERC Recovery Project are not delayed by this funding shift.  It's bad enough that we are parking half our B fleet, delays to these projects will really effect the CA's ability to deploy at all anywhere.

 

[MilEME09]

Well according to CDR, a winner for the MSVS SMP project wont be announced till fall 2016 with delivery in 2017. which falls in the moving $3.1 billion off till 2016/17 meaning i think that project is safe, that said i havent heard a bloody thing on the ERC recovery project.

 

[Armynewsguy]

Well according to CDR, a winner for the MSVS SMP project wont be announced till fall 2016 with delivery in 2017. which falls in the moving $3.1 billion off till 2016/17 meaning i think that project is safe, that said I haven't heard a bloody thing on the ERC recovery project.

MilEME09, if you have access or knows someone that has access to the CID, look up the ERC project and call the PD or D/PD of that project. I am sure that one of these fine folks  :nod: will be able to fill you in on the project and where it stands at the moment. But, as a bit of a spoiler the project is still high on the list of new acquisitions for the Army Commander and is finally gathering some speed.

The interterm recovery solution (fifth wheel towing recovery device (Tru-Hitch)) will start to be fielded and trained on next month, with Pet being the first base to receive the kit.

For others speculating on the fate of projects or where they are at now, I offer the same advice simply give the appropriate person in DLR a call and they will be happy to fill you in on where the project is at. For any truck related questions DLR 6 is the section to contact, find out from the CID who  the PD or deputy is and give them a call and yes all projects are regularly updated on the CID.

For any of you who have some great ideas on wheeled recovery, I urge to call the D/PD ERC and talk to him and pass on your ideas. Who knows, maybe you have the solution ERC is looking for.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

MilEME09, if you have access or knows someone that has access to the CID, look up the ERC project and call the PD or D/PD of that project. I am sure that one of these fine folks  :nod: will be able to fill you in on the project and where it stands at the moment. But, as a bit of a spoiler the project is still high on the list of new acquisitions for the Army Commander and is finally gathering some speed.

The interterm recovery solution (fifth wheel towing recovery device (Tru-Hitch)) will start to be fielded and trained on next month, with Pet being the first base to receive the kit.

For others speculating on the fate of projects or where they are at now, I offer the same advice simply give the appropriate person in DLR a call and they will be happy to fill you in on where the project is at. For any truck related questions DLR 6 is the section to contact, find out from the CID who  the PD or deputy is and give them a call and yes all projects are regularly updated on the CID.

For any of you who have some great ideas on wheeled recovery, I urge to call the D/PD ERC and talk to him and pass on your ideas. Who knows, maybe you have the solution ERC is looking for.

People expect the acquisitions to be stymied.

I don't think many are under the delusion that all those project offices and teams will be closed down, as a result, though.

The equipment may not be forthcoming, but those $10 million sacred stove pipe empires will remain.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

The interterm recovery solution (fifth wheel towing recovery device (Tru-Hitch)) will start to be fielded and trained on next month, with Pet being the first base to receive the kit.

F
For any of you who have some great ideas on wheeled recovery, I urge to call the D/PD ERC and talk to him and pass on your ideas. Who knows, maybe you have the solution ERC is looking for.

Is this a sort of MILCOT wrecker?

I note there is a wrecker option on the Sterling chassis  http://www.americanwreckersales.com/equipment/vulcan/v60-v60b-v70.html

 

[Old EO Tech]

MilEME09, if you have access or knows someone that has access to the CID, look up the ERC project and call the PD or D/PD of that project. I am sure that one of these fine folks  :nod: will be able to fill you in on the project and where it stands at the moment. But, as a bit of a spoiler the project is still high on the list of new acquisitions for the Army Commander and is finally gathering some speed.

The interterm recovery solution (fifth wheel towing recovery device (Tru-Hitch)) will start to be fielded and trained on next month, with Pet being the first base to receive the kit.

For others speculating on the fate of projects or where they are at now, I offer the same advice simply give the appropriate person in DLR a call and they will be happy to fill you in on where the project is at. For any truck related questions DLR 6 is the section to contact, find out from the CID who  the PD or deputy is and give them a call and yes all projects are regularly updated on the CID.

For any of you who have some great ideas on wheeled recovery, I urge to call the D/PD ERC and talk to him and pass on your ideas. Who knows, maybe you have the solution ERC is looking for.

I don't think there is any lack of knowledge/expertise of what is required for new recovery vehicles in the ERC project, I'm sure the issues in moving forward were financial and political.  Three years ago I saw a presentation that stated the ERC was the Army Comd number one priority for new projects, and yet we are only now moving forward with it.

I'm sure there are a few contenders for a new Wrecker platform, but in my opinion there is only one platform that makes sense for LAV recovery and that is the LAV(stryker) MRV, it would have common logistics with the LAV 6.0 platform we are already getting and has the specs to take over for the Bison MRV that we have been limping along with now.

http://www.gdls.com/index.php/products/stryker-family/stryker-mrv

My only question is why the LAVUP project was not given the mandate to buy these, the ERC should have only been left to find a new Wrecker.....

 

[daftandbarmy]

Is this a sort of MILCOT wrecker?

My unit is a pretty good Milcot wrecker, based on the number of prangs we've had in the past few months  ;D

 

[Old EO Tech]

Is this a sort of MILCOT wrecker?

I note there is a wrecker option on the Sterling chassis  http://www.americanwreckersales.com/equipment/vulcan/v60-v60b-v70.html

The problem with Civy heavy duty wreckers is that they don't go offroad very well, there suspension is to low to the ground.  Even the AHSVS Wrecker which is a beast had this issue on occasion.

The Oshkosh wrecker has my vote, I'm sure we can get some regional industrial kick backs to have parts for a Canadian version made in *insert political region of choice here* and still get a wrecker that will do the job for us for the next 30 years or so.

http://oshkoshdefense.com/variants/mkr15-wrecker/

 

[Colin Parkinson]

In a perfect world, you could have a tactical wrecker and Milcot wrecker to cover the road work. that would reduce the load on the tactical wreckers and save them for the stuff they do best.

 

[OldSolduer]

In a perfect world, you could have a tactical wrecker and Milcot wrecker to cover the road work. that would reduce the load on the tactical wreckers and save them for the stuff they do best.

why not contract out MILCOT wrecker rather than purchasing and maintaining them?

 

[MilEME09]

why not contract out MILCOT wrecker rather than purchasing and maintaining them?

We've been forced to do that where i am because our Wrecker is always down, so we call city wide towing, only down side is if we break down on a Saturday they dont send their Heavy Wrecker till monday

 

[dapaterson]

why not contract out MILCOT wrecker rather than purchasing and maintaining them?

Because we need soldiers to maintain recovery skills.

National recovery is already contracted out; are you proposing we contract out most field recovery as well?

 

[Colin Parkinson]

A question for our engineer and support service types. Do you guys (in addition to military courses) get sent on civilian driving courses for Class 1 and Semi trailer trucks for the support services and Heavy machinery courses for the Engineers? 

Are any of the military courses for the above recognized  in the civilian world?

Just wondering if the more specialized equipment can be leased/rented for field exercises