Justin Trudeau hints at boosting Canada’s military spending

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[dapaterson]

MMTs speak the same language as PGs.

Other occs, not always as much.

The process that brought me (a Log O) into the PS also brought a MARS O in.

 

[Good2Golf]

Its extremely easy to transfer from a military Eng position to an Eng 4 position. The experience translates quite well. I don't know for other types of positions.

Clear equivalencies in the technical classifications are pretty solid, I agree.

My experience on both sides of the equation is that many military personnel fail to adequately communicate their skills when applying for PS positions. Jargon, unclear abbreviations... writing in clear, simple declarative English is apparently a lost skill

…but if someone, for instance had two ADMs provided advice and also reviewed the application to the EX-02 position before submission and said the PS’d equivalencies of the past Mil service were well-written and aligned very well with the advertised position, then received a single comm point of ‘thank you for your application’ and nothing else, then find out from a future neighbour (an EX-01 actually working for the previously advertised EX-02 position) that the DG for whom the ExDir position would work was glad that they were able to internally promote one of their team after they received “two other applications to cover us off for policy…” Years later, my neighbour can’t stop telling me how he hates the guy they slid up into the position as well as the DG, and I thank my lucky stars that I didn’t get the job, and moved on to private industry.

 

[tomydoom]

That's not true. I saw one once, while I was still a reservist.

I saw one once in the drill shed in Ipperwash. It still had the new APC smell.

 

[Navy_Pete]

My experience on both sides of the equation is that many military personnel fail to adequately communicate their skills when applying for PS positions. Jargon, unclear abbreviations... writing in clear, simple declarative English is apparently a lost skill

The application process is a bit strange as well; you really need to directly use the 'mandatory requirements' and just explain how they are met to make sure you get through the electronic screening the GoC has.

There was an Eng 4 pool about 5 years ago with hundreds of applicants, and apparently that screened a lot of people out so they had to manually review a lot of the CVs.

It's almost like replying to an RFP; easiest way is to have a small table, but looks really strange.

 

[Remius]

The application process is a bit strange as well; you really need to directly use the 'mandatory requirements' and just explain how they are met to make sure you get through the electronic screening the GoC has.

There was an Eng 4 pool about 5 years ago with hundreds of applicants, and apparently that screened a lot of people out so they had to manually review a lot of the CVs.

It's almost like replying to an RFP; easiest way is to have a small table, but looks really strange.

It’s more about processes and how you work and less about results at that stage.

I know someone that was screened out for stating he used MS suite (outlook, word, excel) on a daily basis when they specifically asked for dates and to demonstrate how and when he used it.

Military types tend to write like their MPRRs as opposed to what is required in PS competitions.

 

[Weinie]

Clear equivalencies in the technical classifications are pretty solid, I agree.


…but if someone, for instance had two ADMs provided advice and also reviewed the application to the EX-02 position before submission and said the PS’d equivalencies of the past Mil service were well-written and aligned very well with the advertised position, then received a single comm point of ‘thank you for your application’ and nothing else, then find out from a future neighbour (an EX-01 actually working for the previously advertised EX-02 position) that the DG for whom the ExDir position would work was glad that they were able to internally promote one of their team after they received “two other applications to cover us off for policy…” Years later, my neighbour can’t stop telling me how he hates the guy they slid up into the position as well as the DG, and I thank my lucky stars that I didn’t get the job, and moved on to private industry.

Had a similar experience about 10 years ago. Screened in,and then wrote the exam. Was told that my submission and exam results were head and shoulders above anyone else’s. Went to the interview, and thought I nailed it. Received an e-mail about a month later stating that “I had failed to demonstrate the requisite experience and comprehension” to be considered for the job. I was at first gobsmacked, and then furious. It was later explained to me that the competition was a sham, only conducted to meet the PS criteria, and that the outcome was pre-ordained to move up a favourite. The successful candidate is now a lousy, and detested EX-02, thankfully no longer with DND.

 

[Good2Golf]

Had a similar experience about 10 years ago. Screened in,and then wrote the exam. Was told that my submission and exam results were head and shoulders above anyone else’s. Went to the interview, and thought I nailed it. Received an e-mail about a month later stating that “I had failed to demonstrate the requisite experience and comprehension” to be considered for the job. I was at first gobsmacked, and then furious. It was later explained to me that the competition was a sham, only conducted to meet the PS criteria, and that the outcome was pre-ordained to move up a favourite. The successful candidate is now a lousy, and detested EX-02, thankfully no longer with DND.

Yup. We’re not the only ones I know that’s happened to, Weinie. I look at it as a sign that a senior minion life in the PS wasn’t for me. Happier, had great experiences in “the real world” and now doing some exciting entrepreneurial stuff that I wouldn’t have even considered as an EX-02 drone trying to ‘Fleet
Up’ to DG…

 

[Weinie]

Yup. We’re not the only ones I know that’s happened to, Weinie. I look at it as a sign that a senior minion life in the PS wasn’t for me. Happier, had great experiences in “the real world” and now doing some exciting entrepreneurial stuff that I wouldn’t have even considered as an EX-02 drone trying to ‘Fleet
Up’ to DG…

G2G,

In hindsight you are right, and I have come to accept that this was not the best career path for me. But it was my first (and last) exposure to the shyte that passes for a credible PS HR system. I now look at every appointment with a somewhat jaundiced eye. Just look at my (soon to be former) Branch.

 

[OldSolduer]

Yup. We’re not the only ones I know that’s happened to, Weinie. I look at it as a sign that a senior minion life in the PS wasn’t for me. Happier, had great experiences in “the real world” and now doing some exciting entrepreneurial stuff that I wouldn’t have even considered as an EX-02 drone trying to ‘Fleet
Up’ to DG…

Yup happens here too. Nepotism is rampant.

 

[Remius]

I can’t speak to the EX level. But the competitions I’ve helped run were all transparent and on the up and up. I have seen some though that were definitely and obviously sketchy.

 

[Weinie]

Yup happens here too. Nepotism is normal.

FTFY

---

 

[Halifax Tar]

Yup happens here too. Nepotism is rampant.

I've worked in some units where last names proliferate staff rosters pretty heavy.

And no I was never part of a Welsh unit lol.

 

[Weinie]

I've worked in some units where last names proliferate staff rosters pretty heavy.

And no I was never part of a Welsh unit lol.

Because you didn’t have extra fingers or toes.

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Yup. We’re not the only ones I know that’s happened to, Weinie. I look at it as a sign that a senior minion life in the PS wasn’t for me. Happier, had great experiences in “the real world” and now doing some exciting entrepreneurial stuff that I wouldn’t have even considered as an EX-02 drone trying to ‘Fleet
Up’ to DG…

G2G,

In hindsight you are right, and I have come to accept that this was not the best career path for me. But it was my first (and last) exposure to the shyte that passes for a credible PS HR system. I now look at every appointment with a somewhat jaundiced eye. Just look at my (soon to be former) Branch.

I've come to the realization that Public Service/Government is no longer for me. It's not what I want in life and I have other ambitions.

Perhaps 20-25 years from now, I might be drawn back to Politics after something #triggers me enough but I've got other plans in the mean time.

 

[SupersonicMax]

Weinie, G2G,

Not sure why they’d go to length for an internal advertised staffing process (and waste many people’s time) when it is entirely possible and acceptable to go the internal unadvertised route?

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

Weinie, G2G,

Not sure why they’d go to length for an internal advertised staffing process (and waste many people’s time) when it is entirely possible and acceptable to go the internal unadvertised route?

Government and wasting time?

Never seen that before

 

[Good2Golf]

Weinie, G2G,

Not sure why they’d go to length for an internal advertised staffing process (and waste many people’s time) when it is entirely possible and acceptable to go the internal unadvertised route?

It is not, if the individual they want to promote internally into the new position hasn’t worked at the new position’s classification level previously. If there isn’t an internally-qualified transfer (in this case laterally from another EX-02 to this one), they have to compete it internally, and by policy, to include CAF members in that internal competition before going to a truly external competitive recruitment.

 

[Remius]

It is not, if the individual they want to promote internally into the new position hasn’t worked at the new position’s classification level previously. If there isn’t an internally-qualified transfer (in this case laterally from another EX-02 to this one), they have to compete it internally, and by policy, to include CAF members in that internal competition before going to a truly external competitive recruitment.

For a few years now, there is a lot more flexibility when it comes to non ads. Some people merely have to qualify in another pool (and not be at level at the time) and can be appointed without a competition as an example. So someone might apply for a pool. Qualify, not necessarily get picked up but another manager could just appoint them from that pool with no competition. It’s annoying because you create a process, put in the work and people apply knowing damn well they will be picked up by someone else in a non ad appointment. The solution is to restrict the pool. I know we’ve started doing that.

At the end of the day, if someone wants a specific person they can make it happen.

 

[GK .Dundas]

Yup happens here too. Nepotism is rampant.

Two words Canada Customs.
To be fair it may have changed in the last 15 years.

 

[Good2Golf]

Two words Canada Customs.
To be fair it may have changed in the last 15 years.

Ahhhhh, CBSA….


(It wasn’t ‘changed’ as recently as 6 years, 2 months and 12 days ago… )