- Reaction score
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- Points
- 940
Election 2011
- Thread starter Edward Campbell
- Start date
OldSolduer
Army.ca Relic
- Reaction score
- 16,131
- Points
- 1,260
jwtg said:
then you should be glad my Cat in the Hat Party was not elected......
- Reaction score
- 0
- Points
- 210
Redeye said:
You have a reference for this? The Parliament of Canada website shows Mulroney with a very slim majority (50.03%) of the popular vote in 1984.
Electoral Results by Party for 33rd General Election.
DBA said:
The source I had referred to was http://www.sfu.ca/~aheard/elections/1867-2004.html , which rounds the % to a tenth of a percent, as opposed to a hundredth of a percent. If you were to round to the 10th, it is 50.0% which would not be a majority. The raw figure, however is 50.03455730667691153544652080479 %.
I guess I stand corrected- there indeed has been a more recent government by majority of the popular vote, however slim the margin.
Canada’s new electoral divide: It’s about the money
PATRICK BRETHOUR VANCOUVER— From Wednesday's Globe and Mail
Published Tuesday, May. 03, 2011
Article Link
The newly drawn electoral map is split, but the cleavage is not left versus right, nor is it Quebec versus the rest of Canada.
The true divide, the new reality of Canadian politics, is between the economic heartlands that the Conservatives now dominate throughout the country and the economic hinterlands won by the NDP.
The energy powerhouses of Alberta and the B.C. Interior are Conservative, while B.C.’s struggling north coast is solidly NDP. The suburbs and thriving technology centres of Ontario are deep blue territory, but the north of the province is orange. Quebec’s rural areas are largely held by New Democrats, but the entrepreneurial hub of the Beauce remains a Tory bastion.
With Canada still shaking off the effects of the recession, the Conservatives were clearly looking to herd economically worried voters into their column at the start of the campaign. The party was aiming not just at the haves, looking to safeguard their affluence, but at the just-hads, aching to reclaim their recently lost prosperity.
That message resonated strongly in Southern Ontario, where the manufacturing industries are still reeling and voters are no mood to take risks. “In Southwestern Ontario, they are not screwing around with the economy,” said Greg Lyle, managing director at Innovative Research Group. (Although the NDP also benefited in a more limited way from those same worries, maintaining its traditional strength in Windsor and Hamilton.)
Then came the unexpected surge of the NDP, and Conservative Leader Stephen Harper’s eleventh-hour appeal to Liberal voters with economically conservative leanings, often called blue Liberals. “Let me speak very clearly to traditional Liberal voters: I know many of you do not want NDP policies. That you do not want NDP tax hikes,” Mr. Harper said on Sunday.
The message: Only we can protect your prosperity.
The result is that the Conservatives were able to achieve in 2011 what eluded them in 2008, a coalition of economically conservative-minded voters who cast their ballots based on pocketbook issues rather than concerns over cultural issues, including the Tories’ supposed leanings toward social conservatism.
Those blue Liberals were the missing element in the Conservative coalition. In the 1990s, they were the foundation of the successive Liberal sweeps of Ontario. So long as they remained with the Liberals, Mr. Harper would be shut out of the urban heart of most big Canadian cities.
But the rise of the NDP, which siphoned off progressive-minded Liberals, clearly spooked a sizable number of blue Liberals, causing them to bolt to Mr. Harper in the last weekend of campaigning, said Nik Nanos, president and chief executive officer of Nanos Research.
It was clear at the start of the campaign that there were a large number of Liberals who would be prone to bolting: Nearly a quarter of committed Liberals (largely older men) ranked Mr. Harper, rather than Michael Ignatieff, as the most competent federal leader. Mr. Nanos said that figure is a clear proxy for the extent of the blue Liberal vote.
More on link
PATRICK BRETHOUR VANCOUVER— From Wednesday's Globe and Mail
Published Tuesday, May. 03, 2011
Article Link
The newly drawn electoral map is split, but the cleavage is not left versus right, nor is it Quebec versus the rest of Canada.
The true divide, the new reality of Canadian politics, is between the economic heartlands that the Conservatives now dominate throughout the country and the economic hinterlands won by the NDP.
The energy powerhouses of Alberta and the B.C. Interior are Conservative, while B.C.’s struggling north coast is solidly NDP. The suburbs and thriving technology centres of Ontario are deep blue territory, but the north of the province is orange. Quebec’s rural areas are largely held by New Democrats, but the entrepreneurial hub of the Beauce remains a Tory bastion.
With Canada still shaking off the effects of the recession, the Conservatives were clearly looking to herd economically worried voters into their column at the start of the campaign. The party was aiming not just at the haves, looking to safeguard their affluence, but at the just-hads, aching to reclaim their recently lost prosperity.
That message resonated strongly in Southern Ontario, where the manufacturing industries are still reeling and voters are no mood to take risks. “In Southwestern Ontario, they are not screwing around with the economy,” said Greg Lyle, managing director at Innovative Research Group. (Although the NDP also benefited in a more limited way from those same worries, maintaining its traditional strength in Windsor and Hamilton.)
Then came the unexpected surge of the NDP, and Conservative Leader Stephen Harper’s eleventh-hour appeal to Liberal voters with economically conservative leanings, often called blue Liberals. “Let me speak very clearly to traditional Liberal voters: I know many of you do not want NDP policies. That you do not want NDP tax hikes,” Mr. Harper said on Sunday.
The message: Only we can protect your prosperity.
The result is that the Conservatives were able to achieve in 2011 what eluded them in 2008, a coalition of economically conservative-minded voters who cast their ballots based on pocketbook issues rather than concerns over cultural issues, including the Tories’ supposed leanings toward social conservatism.
Those blue Liberals were the missing element in the Conservative coalition. In the 1990s, they were the foundation of the successive Liberal sweeps of Ontario. So long as they remained with the Liberals, Mr. Harper would be shut out of the urban heart of most big Canadian cities.
But the rise of the NDP, which siphoned off progressive-minded Liberals, clearly spooked a sizable number of blue Liberals, causing them to bolt to Mr. Harper in the last weekend of campaigning, said Nik Nanos, president and chief executive officer of Nanos Research.
It was clear at the start of the campaign that there were a large number of Liberals who would be prone to bolting: Nearly a quarter of committed Liberals (largely older men) ranked Mr. Harper, rather than Michael Ignatieff, as the most competent federal leader. Mr. Nanos said that figure is a clear proxy for the extent of the blue Liberal vote.
More on link
Ousted MPs will take home millions in severance
By Carmen Chai, Postmedia News May 3, 2011
Article Link
They may not return to Parliament Hill to serve Canadians, but some 100 MPs who are leaving Ottawa will still receive millions in severance pay from taxpayers.
Within the next year, defeated or retiring MPs will collect $4.9 million in pension payments, according to calculations by the Canadian Taxpayers Federation released Tuesday.
Derek Fildebrandt, national research chair of the non-profit group, crunched the numbers to find that about 17 former MPs are slated to receive more than $100,000 a year in pension income.
They include Liberal Peter Milliken, former Speaker of the House, who walks away from politics with $147,000 a year, and former Veteran Affairs minister Jean-Pierre Blackburn, who lost in his Quebec riding but can turn to $106,000 a year to cheer him up.
"While many MPs went down to defeat last night, most are still big winners," Fildebrandt said. "Even though losing an election can be hard, MPs should find a nice soft landing with their 'golden parachute.'"
For example, former Bloc Quebecois leader Gilles Duceppe, who resigned after his party was obliterated by the NDP, leaves Ottawa with $141,000 a year, Fildebrandt estimated.
MPs are paid a base salary of $157,000 a year, while cabinet ministers get 50 per cent more for their additional duties. Defeated or retiring MPs are eligible to collect a full pension at age 55 if they have served at least six years in the House of Commons. For every $1 an MP contributes, taxpayers are required to pay $4 under the current federal pension plan, Fildebrandt explained.
Liberal MP Todd Russell was just a month shy of qualifying for his pension after he was elected in a May 2005 by election.
"By keeping (Russell) out of Parliament, the voters of Labrador saved Canadian taxpayers almost $600,000 in pension payouts," Fildebrandt noted.
Instead, such MPs as Russell who didn't make the six-year mark will walk away with a lump-sum payment of half of what they earned.
Michael Ignatieff, who stepped down as Liberal leader a day after the party hit a historic low, also didn't sit in Ottawa for six years; it's unclear what his next move will be but he'll have $116,624 to help him out. Ignatieff earned a leader salary on top of his MP pay, which is why he takes home a larger lump sum payment.
Fildebrandt said that once MPs leave their duties, they are returned the contributions they made.
He said that about two dozen former MPs will hit $3 million in pension payments by the time they turn 80, with former Transport Minister Chuck Strahl and longtime Liberal Keith Martin topping the list.
More on link
By Carmen Chai, Postmedia News May 3, 2011
Article Link
They may not return to Parliament Hill to serve Canadians, but some 100 MPs who are leaving Ottawa will still receive millions in severance pay from taxpayers.
Within the next year, defeated or retiring MPs will collect $4.9 million in pension payments, according to calculations by the Canadian Taxpayers Federation released Tuesday.
Derek Fildebrandt, national research chair of the non-profit group, crunched the numbers to find that about 17 former MPs are slated to receive more than $100,000 a year in pension income.
They include Liberal Peter Milliken, former Speaker of the House, who walks away from politics with $147,000 a year, and former Veteran Affairs minister Jean-Pierre Blackburn, who lost in his Quebec riding but can turn to $106,000 a year to cheer him up.
"While many MPs went down to defeat last night, most are still big winners," Fildebrandt said. "Even though losing an election can be hard, MPs should find a nice soft landing with their 'golden parachute.'"
For example, former Bloc Quebecois leader Gilles Duceppe, who resigned after his party was obliterated by the NDP, leaves Ottawa with $141,000 a year, Fildebrandt estimated.
MPs are paid a base salary of $157,000 a year, while cabinet ministers get 50 per cent more for their additional duties. Defeated or retiring MPs are eligible to collect a full pension at age 55 if they have served at least six years in the House of Commons. For every $1 an MP contributes, taxpayers are required to pay $4 under the current federal pension plan, Fildebrandt explained.
Liberal MP Todd Russell was just a month shy of qualifying for his pension after he was elected in a May 2005 by election.
"By keeping (Russell) out of Parliament, the voters of Labrador saved Canadian taxpayers almost $600,000 in pension payouts," Fildebrandt noted.
Instead, such MPs as Russell who didn't make the six-year mark will walk away with a lump-sum payment of half of what they earned.
Michael Ignatieff, who stepped down as Liberal leader a day after the party hit a historic low, also didn't sit in Ottawa for six years; it's unclear what his next move will be but he'll have $116,624 to help him out. Ignatieff earned a leader salary on top of his MP pay, which is why he takes home a larger lump sum payment.
Fildebrandt said that once MPs leave their duties, they are returned the contributions they made.
He said that about two dozen former MPs will hit $3 million in pension payments by the time they turn 80, with former Transport Minister Chuck Strahl and longtime Liberal Keith Martin topping the list.
More on link
- Reaction score
- 10,612
- Points
- 1,260
While I understand the need for an attractive pension/remuneration package for MPs to draw the best Canadians away from their private ventures, the gold-plated nature of it has me shaking my head. Yes, you need to be conpensated for giving up your legal practice (which is always waiting for you if you don't opt for that big-time consulting job), but the fact that a few terms in the House gives you twice the pension of someone who's served 30+ years in the military smells funny.
As for the article on have/have-not breakdown, very interesting; I never looked at it that way. I think this can be lumped in with Edward's Old/New Canada theory in explaining the political landscape of our country.
As for the article on have/have-not breakdown, very interesting; I never looked at it that way. I think this can be lumped in with Edward's Old/New Canada theory in explaining the political landscape of our country.
- Reaction score
- 28,704
- Points
- 1,090
Infanteer said:
"Gold plated pensions" applies equally to the military - if you're under older terms of service, you can retire at age 37 with 40% of your best five years as a pension for life. (If you join today, you'll be an old, old man of 42 and get 50% instead). The government contributes roughly $2.25 for ever dollar a CF member contributes.
The other issue for MPs is that usually they are elected during key working years (late 30s-ealy 50s); taking that time out of any career and you impact your post-MP earnings, since you've been out of your field for that time.
And, for a little comparison, MP at $157K per year is the equivalent of a newly promoted BGen's pay.
I think a BGen has done a little more than this guy to earn it.dapaterson said:
http://www.sherbrookerecord.com/content/view/619048/1/
EDIT: If you don't feel like checking the link, it's an article about the Sherbrooke MP who is 19 years old.
- Reaction score
- 6,145
- Points
- 1,260
I disagree. This fellow, against all odds, stood up for a party and was elected. That's more than I have ever done and more than all but a small handful of generals have ever risked.
Politics is an honourable calling, even for those who are offered up by cynical party 'professionals' as sacrificial lambs. I am happy for all the winners - perhaps especially these youngsters and other assorted 'sacrificial lambs.' If we want more military people in politics all they need to do is join a party and offer themselves to their fellow party members as potential candidates. Some, a few, military folks do that; most do not.
Politics is an honourable calling, even for those who are offered up by cynical party 'professionals' as sacrificial lambs. I am happy for all the winners - perhaps especially these youngsters and other assorted 'sacrificial lambs.' If we want more military people in politics all they need to do is join a party and offer themselves to their fellow party members as potential candidates. Some, a few, military folks do that; most do not.
- Reaction score
- 10,612
- Points
- 1,260
E.R. Campbell said:
He put his name on a paper and won because people in the riding liked Jack Layton. That being said, I agree with you that the new blood, whether they be karate instructors, IBM plant managers or university students are definately a refreshing turn from the blue-bloods we usually see around. Don't know what impact they'll have aside from warming a seat though.
I'll draw a line between a "statesman" and a "politician". I don't think being fortunate enough to run for the right party should guarantee him a pension of about $56,000 in 6 years that takes most hard-working Canadians an entire career to earn. A respectable salary - yes? The 77,000-ish in serverance is probably also justified for their services to the country. But a remain skeptical that a large majority of the MPs and Senators who draw a very nice pension ever made the impact they should have to deserve it.
- Reaction score
- 28,704
- Points
- 1,090
Infanteer said:
Well, if it's that easy you can do it yourself. But if you're unwilling to take that risk, it's hardly fitting to denigrate those who do.
And how do we measure "impact" for pension entitlements? Do we expand that to other occupations such as the military? Many MPs may get little face time in Parliament but provide their constituents with a link to government services, and smooth their interactions with the bureaucracy - how do we measure that?
Oldgateboatdriver
Army.ca Veteran
- Reaction score
- 2,426
- Points
- 1,010
I agree with E.R.C. Politics is an honourable calling and these young, inexperienced MP's have had the guts, in a time of great scepticism concerning politicians, to put their nome on a ballot, which is more than most of us ever dare do.
This said, the trick is not to get elected, its to get elected a second time, and a third, etc. And here the learning curve is steep. They will be taught by more experienced hands but in the end, will only succeed if they put in the arduous (yes!) and often time tedious and demanding hours away from family and friends while busy at the great unseen tasks of an MP: constant attendance in the riding at tons of events whether they relate to your politics or not: from the burial of Joey's little dog, to the church annual pic-nic and on to the (seventh!) re-dedication of the local arena because it was repainted during the summer at a cost of $50,000 (for which the candidate supplied $2500 from some subsidy program he managed to help secure). etc. Then on top of your work in Ottawa, you have to attend at all the party functions, from policy conventions every three or four months, to all your regional fundraisers, to your local constituency party meetings, etc.
It is not an easy job.
If they work hard, most time at the detriment of their personal and family life, they may, one day get to be the one whose idea is agreed on by most in Parliament to modify an upcoming or existing law and make it better for the citizens of this country, and will be able to say later in life: I did that, that was my idea, this one little change that made things a bit better for all. And they will think it a worthwhile life.
This said, the trick is not to get elected, its to get elected a second time, and a third, etc. And here the learning curve is steep. They will be taught by more experienced hands but in the end, will only succeed if they put in the arduous (yes!) and often time tedious and demanding hours away from family and friends while busy at the great unseen tasks of an MP: constant attendance in the riding at tons of events whether they relate to your politics or not: from the burial of Joey's little dog, to the church annual pic-nic and on to the (seventh!) re-dedication of the local arena because it was repainted during the summer at a cost of $50,000 (for which the candidate supplied $2500 from some subsidy program he managed to help secure). etc. Then on top of your work in Ottawa, you have to attend at all the party functions, from policy conventions every three or four months, to all your regional fundraisers, to your local constituency party meetings, etc.
It is not an easy job.
If they work hard, most time at the detriment of their personal and family life, they may, one day get to be the one whose idea is agreed on by most in Parliament to modify an upcoming or existing law and make it better for the citizens of this country, and will be able to say later in life: I did that, that was my idea, this one little change that made things a bit better for all. And they will think it a worthwhile life.
I support both ERC and Pusser. Our MP works very hard for all his constituents, regardless of their political leanings. In fact he went to bat for the gentleman who was his Liberal opponent in the 2004 and 2006 elections and was able to resolve some issues that preserved several jobs in the process. I believe he also did the same for one of his NDP challengers, or at least for the firm that employed him. Gord jokes that he would attend the opening of an envelope if invited, and he does do a lot of travelling in our riding, which is not small. For anyone with access to a map, or who knows Eastern Ontario geography, it stretches from Kemptville on the northeast corner west to Westport, then south to Gananoque and then east along the St Lawrence to Cardinal. On top of his constituency work, he sits on a couple of committees and chairs a caucus committee. It is a gruelling work load and his personal life has taken a couple of hits because of it.
- Reaction score
- 1,521
- Points
- 1,040
I cannot hide my contempt for these neophytes, and I think it's a disgrace to the democratic system that a party would even put a placeholder into a riding, all the while extolling their virtues. We need leaders in our governments (at all levels), not some hippy university student who said "Yeah, sure, whatever, dude" between bong hits when the local commisar offered up his or her name. Total and utter contempt.
Why haven't I run? I am forbidden as a military member to run for office. Why don't I get out and run? Because I do my job for democracy by doing whatever it is I can to defend it.
[/rant]
Why haven't I run? I am forbidden as a military member to run for office. Why don't I get out and run? Because I do my job for democracy by doing whatever it is I can to defend it.
[/rant]
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