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Attack Helicopters

Why not? Aren't the Russians selling alot of their equipment off for real cheap. Canada can even pick up a bunch of tanks too! It makes sense to me. Just buy a label maker and put the english stickers over the russian labels, that'll make for a cheap conversion. ;D I'm guessing politics would get in the way of this. Was it even considered?
 
noreaga808 said:
Why not? Aren't the Russians selling alot of their equipment off for real cheap.
Probably good reason for that...

Canada can even pick up a bunch of tanks too!

We just got out of the tank business...

Just buy a label maker and put the english stickers over the russian labels, that'll make for a cheap conversion.
No comment

Was it even considered?

Probably not - we tend not to buy equipment from former enemies.
 
Good points Zoomie. I just had to put it out there, it would of been interesting to see.
 
It is sad, when I finalized my application paperwork with a recruiter she kept on stressing that my choice for Armoured was "Recce" until I nodded my head in agreement even though I didn't have a preference. At that point it nailed the coffin for me for tanks. Who knows, it may have a comeback. Hopefully we don't have to lose crews to teach a lesson to the CF's.

That "portable" weapons platform show in a post by Inch earlier definitely looked like a good concept. That way the Griffon can be converted easily back to troop transport. It would also make for a cheaper and versatile alternative to buying attack specific helos. It'll also have more of a PC look then a true attack helo which would be a good selling feature to those politicians.

Does anybody know the reason why they closed OCTP or CCEP entry programs?
 
Zoomie said:
Probably not - we tend not to buy equipment from former enemies.

Hey Zoomie I just realized, don't the CF's do business with Germany?

As for your "no comment". Come on, that was gold!... Alright, I guess I'm not as funny in writing as I am in person. :crybaby:

You Flyboys crack me up, cheers!
 
noreaga808 said:
Does anybody know the reason why they closed OCTP or CCEP entry programs?

The CF wants a degreed Officer corps, OCTP and CCEP don't generate degreed Officers. Those programs are only opened when there's a recruiting shortfall for DEOs and ROTPs.

noreaga808 said:
Hey Zoomie I just realized, don't the CF's do business with Germany?

We also do business with the Americans, you should remember from history class that we had a war with them too.
 
Hey Inch

Would you like to fly the SeaCobra? I'll be chatting with the Pm today and recommend (over lunch of course) that he spring for a few...

Seriously though...

During RV 89 I remeber seeing a bunch of Cobras flying around with Canadian markings on them...I believe it was for excercise purposes though.

Slim :cdn: :salute:

P.S. Every time I see that drunken cat of yours I laugh something fierce! ;D
 
Slim said:
Hey Inch

Would you like to fly the SeaCobra? I'll be chatting with the Pm today and recommend (over lunch of course) that he spring for a few...

Slim, I'm surprised the PM would have lunch with you since you're the leading candidate for his job (well, in my books anyway).

P.S. Every time I see that drunken cat of yours I laugh something fierce! ;D

Knowing that, I'll just have to leave it as is, for you buddy.  ;D
 
Inch said:
Slim, I'm surprised the PM would have lunch with you since you're the leading candidate for his job (well, in my books anyway).

The country would be a rather one-sided affair with me driving the boat. The baby-boomers would not be happy, and the...Well you get the idea. :-*

We would have a nice military though.

Knowing that, I'll just have to leave it as is, for you buddy.   ;D
I have to find something equally as drastic! ;D
 
Hey Slim, next time you're dining with the PM you might want to bring this one up.

How about a Griffin with the ERSTA surveillance kit flying in loose formation with a couple of UAV helos armed with 70mm rockets. There are now Guidance Kits for the rockets that turn them into precision weapons (APKWS).  Could that be a politically inoffensive and low cost (both in dollars and potentially in lives) of offsetting the lack of tanks in a lightweight expeditionary force?
 
SAIC Demonstrates Live-Fire from Vigilante VTOL UAV
 
 
(Source: SAIC International; issued March 2, 2005)
 
 
MCLEAN, Va. --- Science Applications International Corporation (SAIC) today announced the successful live-fire of four 2.75" unguided rockets from its Vigilante VTOL UAV (Vertical Takeoff and Landing Unmanned Aerial Vehicle) system during flight testing conducted at the U.S. Army's Yuma Proving Ground. 

Conducted on December 13 and 14, 2004, the rocket firing demonstration represents an aviation first as they were executed while the Vigilante system and its payload was under air-to-air control from a control console installed aboard a UH-1N Huey helicopter flying a loose formation on the Vigilante system. 

Teaming with prime contractor and Vigilante system co-developer Advanced Technologies Incorporated (ATI), SAIC conducted the live-fire rocket tests under the Armed VTOL UAV Testbed Integrator contract for the U.S. Army's Aviation Applied Technology Directorate (AATD), in Fort Eustis, Va. 

AATD's objectives for this program were to use their Vigilante system platform, developed with AATD as a vehicle for demonstrating UAV technologies, to investigate the platform and manned-unmanned teaming issues associated with weapons engagements from Class III UAVs. 

The flight test team, including personnel from the Army's AATD, Yuma Proving Ground, ATI and SAIC, executed the test sequence as planned during the two-week deployment. The first three shots were performed at 30, 35, and 40 knots at a 400-foot altitude while the last firing was at 40 knots at a 250- foot altitude. 

Based on results from the launch, reaction forces were less than those anticipated based on simulation models. The relatively low cost of the program also demonstrates the ability of the Vigilante system to serve as a cost-effective and flexible test platform. This demonstration also enables the team to further explore the collaboration of manned and unmanned systems. 

-ends-
http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?session=dae.4308111.1089903978.QPadasOa9dUAAESlMZk&modele=jdc_34

The Army's Advanced Precision Kill Weapon System (APKWS) is intended to fill the gap between the current unguided 2.75" Hydra-70 Rocket System and the HELLFIRE anti-tank missile. It is anticipated that APKWS will be comprised of a laser sensor and guidance package coupled with the Hydra-70 rocket. It is designed to use the current MK66 rocket motor, M151 10 pound high explosive fragmentation warhead, M423 point detonating fuse, and the M260 or M261 rocket launcher. The MK66 rocket motor and associated component parts (warhead, fuze, etc.) are those that are currently in the inventory, however, the APKWS is designed to be compatible with any 2.75 inch rocket system in the inventory at time of acquisition. The rocket warhead and fuze are integrated with a laser sensor and a highly accurate guidance assembly resulting in a precision guided weapon. The APKWS is programmed with the aircraft's compatible laser code and loaded into the aircraft rocket launcher(s). The APKWS is designed and intended to enhance the existing rocket system and to complement the Hellfire missile system; providing a significantly lower cost per kill against soft to lightly armored point targets. Precision guidance and warhead size of the APKWS will significantly reduce collateral damage. These features will make APKWS the weapon of choice during operations in urban terrain or for aerial fire support missions in close proximity to friendly forces. The APKWS will be employed from attack, armed reconnaissance, or other designated helicopters.

http://www.fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/missile/hydra-70.htm
 
It seems to me that getting something like an attack capable chopper would be best handled by getting a dual role machine. (The public loves to think that we are being smart with "their" money.). If that were the case we could look at something that doubles for troop transport and can mount mini-guns/rockets. Either way I would love to know that I have some air support on hand other than the yanks (who scare me more than the enemy). :bullet: :bullet: :bullet:
 
How about an attack version of the black hawk? I seen a photo of one with 8 x hellfires on it  :)
 
Canadian Sig said:
It seems to me that getting something like an attack capable chopper would be best handled by getting a dual role machine. (The public loves to think that we are being smart with "their" money.).

Too bad the MI-24 Hind E was developed by the other team...Mind you I don't know the reliability and maint. record for the aircraft...But it can carry lots of crunchies and packs a wack of firepower.

Slim
 
If we get the heavy lift from the other side then why not the Hind it is a dual role chopper.  I think the pavelow is outta reach now that it is a meduim lift chopper.
 
A helicopter with attack and lift capabilities?

The ACH-47?

http://www.chinook-helicopter.com/chinook/gunsagogo.html

Since the ACH-47 only saw service in Vietnam, what were the drawbacks that discontinued it's program?
 
Freddy Chef, UH-1B Huey gunships and AH-1 Cobras were relatively new into the theatre anyway, and the US Army was trying to put as much airborne firepower into theatre as possible....thus, "if it flew, it was armed."  Guns-a-go-go's disappeared even before Vietnam was over, as the attack helicopters had really come into their own by that point.  Although that being said, todays MH-47E/G's have a pretty fierce amount of 7.62 and 5.56 minigun bristling off them!

Cheers,
Duey
 
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