Artillery Officer Merged Thread
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Correct, what I said pertains to reservists only. I have no idea what the wait time if any is to get Arty O MOC training in the regs.
Good luck.
Good luck.
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I can comment on Reg Force training time as I'm currently in the process. I finished my BMOQ in April and am probably going on CAP at the end of September. If all goes well, we have been told to expect to be done DP 1.1 and 1.2 late next summer but it could be as late as next December depending on how the courses line up.
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I've been searching around looking for information about Artillery Officer career progression. I have found a bit of information here and there but I am looking for something more comprehensive.
My questions pertain to what happens after CAP.
1. How long is phase 3 and phase 4 training?
2. Up to date version of what each phase comprises?
3. At what point does one do FOO training? What happens after FOO training?
4. What is life like as a new reg force artillery officer fresh off of MOC training?
a) daily routine?
b) duties and responsibilities in garrion and the field?
c) Approx how much time is spent in the field per year?
5. What is the dynamic between new officers in the unit and the Capts and more senior officers?
Thanks in advance for the help!
My questions pertain to what happens after CAP.
1. How long is phase 3 and phase 4 training?
2. Up to date version of what each phase comprises?
3. At what point does one do FOO training? What happens after FOO training?
4. What is life like as a new reg force artillery officer fresh off of MOC training?
a) daily routine?
b) duties and responsibilities in garrion and the field?
c) Approx how much time is spent in the field per year?
5. What is the dynamic between new officers in the unit and the Capts and more senior officers?
Thanks in advance for the help!
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I know this is an old topic but does anyone have any information on this??
In my experience:
1. How long is phase 3 and phase 4 training?
3-ish months each
2. Up to date version of what each phase comprises?
Don't know. They have been known to change. When I did it, Ph 3 (DP 1.1) was almost all recce and Ph 4 (DP 1.2) was command post, Safety, and more recce). But things might be different now.
3. At what point does one do FOO training? What happens after FOO training?
It depends. I'm sure all regiments want their junior officers to get as much gunline experience as possible before moving on to the OPs, but sometimes one doesn't get that chance. Now that deployments have settled down, pers usually have been around for a couple years before the course - but not always as a TC/TL/CPO/GPO. After you do your course, you become a FOO. Regiments were changed last year with the creation of an OP Battery for each and FOO parties are tasked out to gun btys or inf coys when req.
4. What is life like as a new reg force artillery officer fresh off of MOC training?
There may be differences btwn regts, but generally when you're in garrison, it's PT fol by whatever the day holds, whether it be actual training or paperwork. Junior officers act as course officers throughout the year - you may be loaded onto various short courses yourself, given tasks to complete (organize events, conduct investigations, help plan exercises), and manage your troops with the help of your TSM. In the field, depending on your position, you'll be finding gun positions, running the command post, or ensuring the rounds are going to land where the FOO thinks they should. Regiments are getting back into longer regimental exercises now that Afghanistan is basically done, but you'll be lucky if you're out for three months total. That's not a lot, all things considered.
5. What is the dynamic between new officers in the unit and the Capts and more senior officers?
The dynamic is whatever you wish it to be based on your ability to not be an idiot. For the most part, all officers captain and below work on a first-name basis (although some may wish that not to be the case). If you're the new guy, just remember that, for the first while, everyone knows more than you. You can learn something from everyone (even if it's to ensure you don't pattern yourself after them).
Ralph
1. How long is phase 3 and phase 4 training?
3-ish months each
2. Up to date version of what each phase comprises?
Don't know. They have been known to change. When I did it, Ph 3 (DP 1.1) was almost all recce and Ph 4 (DP 1.2) was command post, Safety, and more recce). But things might be different now.
3. At what point does one do FOO training? What happens after FOO training?
It depends. I'm sure all regiments want their junior officers to get as much gunline experience as possible before moving on to the OPs, but sometimes one doesn't get that chance. Now that deployments have settled down, pers usually have been around for a couple years before the course - but not always as a TC/TL/CPO/GPO. After you do your course, you become a FOO. Regiments were changed last year with the creation of an OP Battery for each and FOO parties are tasked out to gun btys or inf coys when req.
4. What is life like as a new reg force artillery officer fresh off of MOC training?
There may be differences btwn regts, but generally when you're in garrison, it's PT fol by whatever the day holds, whether it be actual training or paperwork. Junior officers act as course officers throughout the year - you may be loaded onto various short courses yourself, given tasks to complete (organize events, conduct investigations, help plan exercises), and manage your troops with the help of your TSM. In the field, depending on your position, you'll be finding gun positions, running the command post, or ensuring the rounds are going to land where the FOO thinks they should. Regiments are getting back into longer regimental exercises now that Afghanistan is basically done, but you'll be lucky if you're out for three months total. That's not a lot, all things considered.
5. What is the dynamic between new officers in the unit and the Capts and more senior officers?
The dynamic is whatever you wish it to be based on your ability to not be an idiot. For the most part, all officers captain and below work on a first-name basis (although some may wish that not to be the case). If you're the new guy, just remember that, for the first while, everyone knows more than you. You can learn something from everyone (even if it's to ensure you don't pattern yourself after them).
Ralph
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Awesome. Thanks for the info 
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I know this reply is a bit late but I thought I would add:
Dp 1.1 is three months long. It now similar to the old Reserve Artillery officer program, in that it covers recce, CPO, GPO, and RSO duties. Reservist do this course with their Reg force peers. There is no real time on the Guns.
DP 1.2 is more survey, special procedures, quick actions etc. Reservists do not get this course unless they are lucky or going overseas. The course is 3 months long.
Dp 1.1 is three months long. It now similar to the old Reserve Artillery officer program, in that it covers recce, CPO, GPO, and RSO duties. Reservist do this course with their Reg force peers. There is no real time on the Guns.
DP 1.2 is more survey, special procedures, quick actions etc. Reservists do not get this course unless they are lucky or going overseas. The course is 3 months long.
Can you expand a little more on the DP1.1 course, Cardstonkid? Is it ran in Mods, timelines etc. The Technoviking has previously explained the IOPD1.1 course very well in an earlier post and I am looking for an Artillery version of his post.
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
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I did the course in 2009. I understand it has not changed much since then.
The course is a high stress, fast learning environment. The stress comes from some "cock" but mostly from the massive workload.
The course is done in mods. Each mod is two weeks long. It is designed this way so that a reservist can come and get a qualification and then leave. That being said, if my memory serves me well, each mod does not necessarily give you a qualification. I am not sure how the mods are organized now, but when I did the course it progressed from Recce O to GPO and Safety Officer, with all the positions in between.
So for example,
The first mod is recce. Here the candidate will become qualified on the T-16 and GLYPS survey equipment, learn to use the CP & FC board, conduct a recce as a recce TSM, Tech, and Recce O.
The Command Post Officer is another mod, but to do this a candidate must qualify as a CP Tech. This means passing the Manual Artillery Plotting System (MAPS) and the IFCCS (Indirect Fire Control Computer System). Each candidate will act as a Tech supervisor, Arty Sigs, then CPO while in the box being evaluated.
I will try to find the complete breakdown of the mods as they are taught, or at the very least how they were taught in 2009. I do know that MAPs and IFCCS was taught over a two week period. One week for each. (The reserve CP tech course is 4 weeks long, so this gives you an idea of how much is packed into two weeks.) The duties of a CPO are separate mod but I am not sure how it is divided out, since during the course it seemed like a progression of learning rather than a fixed start and end date.
I do know that if a person failed the recce mod in week two they could go through the counseling process to retake the tests and complete the qualification if they were staying on beyond the first two weeks of the course. However if the reservist fails this mod and they cannot stay longer to complete the re-testing process then they had to come back and retake the course from the beginning at another time.
For the reg force candidates the course is not really modular. They cannot pass everything but Recce and then come back a do that two week mod over again. They must complete the course in its entirety in order to progress, even if they had passed all but one of the mods.
I will see if I can find all of the mods and I will post it here as soon as I can.
The course is a high stress, fast learning environment. The stress comes from some "cock" but mostly from the massive workload.
The course is done in mods. Each mod is two weeks long. It is designed this way so that a reservist can come and get a qualification and then leave. That being said, if my memory serves me well, each mod does not necessarily give you a qualification. I am not sure how the mods are organized now, but when I did the course it progressed from Recce O to GPO and Safety Officer, with all the positions in between.
So for example,
The first mod is recce. Here the candidate will become qualified on the T-16 and GLYPS survey equipment, learn to use the CP & FC board, conduct a recce as a recce TSM, Tech, and Recce O.
The Command Post Officer is another mod, but to do this a candidate must qualify as a CP Tech. This means passing the Manual Artillery Plotting System (MAPS) and the IFCCS (Indirect Fire Control Computer System). Each candidate will act as a Tech supervisor, Arty Sigs, then CPO while in the box being evaluated.
I will try to find the complete breakdown of the mods as they are taught, or at the very least how they were taught in 2009. I do know that MAPs and IFCCS was taught over a two week period. One week for each. (The reserve CP tech course is 4 weeks long, so this gives you an idea of how much is packed into two weeks.) The duties of a CPO are separate mod but I am not sure how it is divided out, since during the course it seemed like a progression of learning rather than a fixed start and end date.
I do know that if a person failed the recce mod in week two they could go through the counseling process to retake the tests and complete the qualification if they were staying on beyond the first two weeks of the course. However if the reservist fails this mod and they cannot stay longer to complete the re-testing process then they had to come back and retake the course from the beginning at another time.
For the reg force candidates the course is not really modular. They cannot pass everything but Recce and then come back a do that two week mod over again. They must complete the course in its entirety in order to progress, even if they had passed all but one of the mods.
I will see if I can find all of the mods and I will post it here as soon as I can.
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Hello,
I have a couple of similar questions, if someone can please shed some light on these -
1. During Phase IV - does one get an opportunity to chose between becoming a Field Artillery Officer or an AD Officer? Or is there some sort of a selection done to determine suitability for either trades? (The recruiting website is not very clear about this - http://www.forces.ca/en/job/artilleryofficer-17#education-2).
2. Can Field Artillery Officers find themselves posted in an AD Regiment and vice-versa?
Thanks,
AGB.
I have a couple of similar questions, if someone can please shed some light on these -
1. During Phase IV - does one get an opportunity to chose between becoming a Field Artillery Officer or an AD Officer? Or is there some sort of a selection done to determine suitability for either trades? (The recruiting website is not very clear about this - http://www.forces.ca/en/job/artilleryofficer-17#education-2).
2. Can Field Artillery Officers find themselves posted in an AD Regiment and vice-versa?
Thanks,
AGB.
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All arty officers do the field training first. Then after DP1.2 you are assigned to Air Defense, SDA, etc.
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All artillery officers are trained as field artillery officers. After DP1.2 some are selected for additional training and are employed in STA (Surveillance and Target Acquisition) or Air Defence. The likelihood of actually getting an AD course these days seems to be quite slim. My peers that were posted to 4AD as long ago as Aug 2010 still do not have their AD Troop Commander course and are not expecting to get it anytime soon if at all. As 4AD is lacking an AD capability at this time, it is not possible to run a AD TC course. Everyone I know that has gone to 4AD in the last 18 months or so has been sent on the STA TC course instead. I am not privy to what the plans for career progression are in the mid to long term however so all of this is subject to change.
There are examples of officers who are initially employed in an AD role that find themselves back in a field regiment although this is not common. STA qualified officers could conceivably serve at any of the Regiments.
The artillery is in a period of transformation these days though so do not get too wrapped around the axle about where you will serve with what qualifications. Depending on what rumours you believe, the above may be true 2 years from now or the career progression of officers may look dramatically different.
There are examples of officers who are initially employed in an AD role that find themselves back in a field regiment although this is not common. STA qualified officers could conceivably serve at any of the Regiments.
The artillery is in a period of transformation these days though so do not get too wrapped around the axle about where you will serve with what qualifications. Depending on what rumours you believe, the above may be true 2 years from now or the career progression of officers may look dramatically different.
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Cardtonkid and jeffb,
Thank you for the replies. I really hope that there are Direct Entry openings in Artillery next fiscal...
Cheers,
ABG.
Thank you for the replies. I really hope that there are Direct Entry openings in Artillery next fiscal...
Cheers,
ABG.
I have a question regarding the job(s) of artillery officers.
I heard that many officers become Forward Observational Officers after 2-4 years as a regular field officer. Do you have a choice later on as to what type of job (as an officer) you want to do or do the forces tell you 'you will now become a forward observational officer'?
Do artillery officers sometimes fight as infantry like artillery soldiers? What job options are there for artillery officers (other than going into air defence STA)?
- army1
I heard that many officers become Forward Observational Officers after 2-4 years as a regular field officer. Do you have a choice later on as to what type of job (as an officer) you want to do or do the forces tell you 'you will now become a forward observational officer'?
Do artillery officers sometimes fight as infantry like artillery soldiers? What job options are there for artillery officers (other than going into air defence STA)?
- army1
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With the current plan all Artillery officers will do a FOO course, but not all will be employed as FOOs. 2-4 years is about correct, but I believe we are a little back logged so the wait may be closer to 4 or even longer; potential and performance can make that number fluctuate.
After getting the course,and being employed as a FOO, you will only be there for a couple years; potentially 3-4 depending in situation. Normally after a couple of years as a FOO, maybe a FAC crse, a FOO moves onto a command staff job, or tech staff, or maybe 2 i/c (BK) of a battery. After these you could be promoted to Maj and after that, there are too many branches to cover.
FOOs also fight as Infantry soldiers. In order to bring fire down on the enemy you must be in a postion of observation. That tends to be right along side of the Infantry.
After getting the course,and being employed as a FOO, you will only be there for a couple years; potentially 3-4 depending in situation. Normally after a couple of years as a FOO, maybe a FAC crse, a FOO moves onto a command staff job, or tech staff, or maybe 2 i/c (BK) of a battery. After these you could be promoted to Maj and after that, there are too many branches to cover.
FOOs also fight as Infantry soldiers. In order to bring fire down on the enemy you must be in a postion of observation. That tends to be right along side of the Infantry.
GnyHwy said:
GnyHwy,
I would be careful with your liberal use of the terms 'normally' and 'would be promoted', from personal experience in the Artillery there isn't a norm despite what the DP charts indicate and not all those who do a "command staff job, or tech staff, or maybe 2 i/c (BK) of a battery" will be promoted so you might say 'could be promoted'.
army1,
As for whether or not you can choose your jobs such as being employed as a FOO, your opinion may be sought but disinterest in your chain of command's plan for you is seldom rewarded.
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