Whither the Royal Canadian Legion? Or RCL Withers?

[my72jeep]

They should do an audit of actual numbers in each legion. Let's not count CIC as soldiers or cadets with 3 years in. Lets then see just how much of the legions branches have less than 60% Sailors, soldiers, airmen, RCMP and Goast guard (allied forces included of course). Any with less that 60% close the doors.




.

Please explain, 50% of CIC are ex Sailors, soldiers, airmen why not count them?

 

[dogger1936]

Please explain, 50% of CIC are ex Sailors, soldiers, airmen why not count them?

By all means count that 50% as they fit the mold. The other 50% don't. They are a youth organisation to produce better citizens. I think part of the problem is we have become too "welcoming" to all. I know I have ab out as much in common with career CIC officers as I would a boy scout leader.

Another thing...get rid of the "ladies aux." How 1950's.

 

[my72jeep]

most Legions are kept solvent only by donations from the Ladies ex.

 

[Michael OLeary]

RCL Membership Statistical Reports

Membership by Military Service (2010) - http://www.legion.ca/_PDF/MembershipStats/2010Military_Stats_e.pdf - Note that even in 2010, the RCL continues to segregate the "Militia" from the "Navy, Army, Air Force and CF." Even so, and including RCMP, "others" and "Unknown", the membership with service was about 108K.

Compare that to a membership number of 340K (2011) - http://www.legion.ca/_PDF/MembershipStats/pdmembershipsummary.pdf

So, based on those two figures, only about 30 % of RCL members have previously served by their accounting.

 

[my72jeep]

. I know I have ab out as much in common with career CIC officers as I would a boy scout leader.

Hell I know we have way to many Walt's in out ranks but to paint us all with the same brush is wrong. I bet you have as much in common with 80% of the CF as you have with Joe Blow at the mall.

 

[dogger1936]

RCL Membership Statistical Reports

Membership by Military Service (2010) - http://www.legion.ca/_PDF/MembershipStats/2010Military_Stats_e.pdf - Note that even in 2010, the RCL continues to segregate the "Militia" from the "Navy, Army, Air Force and CF." Even so, and including RCMP, "others" and "Unknown", the membership with service was about 108K.

Compare that to a membership number of 340K (2011) - http://www.legion.ca/_PDF/MembershipStats/pdmembershipsummary.pdf

So, based on those two figures, only about 30 % of RCL members have previously served by their accounting.

Very interesting Micheal; thanks for this. I believe this illustrates the problem. Their division between militia and regular force angers me as well. Last time I checked we had these "militia" fighting and dying right beside their regular force brothers and sisters. Yet another outdated ideal from the RCL.

Hell I know we have way to many Walt's in out ranks but to paint us all with the same brush is wrong. I bet you have as much in common with 80% of the CF as you have with Joe Blow at the mall.

Fact is these places were designed by war vets for war vets. Navy Army Airforce. If your an ex service member who has joined the CIC to give back to the community; by all means come on in. If your a 30 yr old ex cadet with 12 years service in a youth program...No. You don't belong there. If your a civilian who had a great uncle serve once. You don't belong there. If your some random civi who likes having cheap drinks...you don't belong there. I know during my grandfathers generation you would have been laughed out of the legion as part of the cadet program with no other service.

Time to get back to what the legion was all about. An inclusive club looking out for our serving brothers and sisters best interest.

 

[dapaterson]

So, based on those two figures, only about 30 % of RCL members have previously served by their accounting.

They've served by their accounting?  Man, that's a lot of pay clerks and finance officers at the Legion!

 

[q_1966]

Very interesting Micheal; thanks for this. I believe this illustrates the problem. Their division between militia and regular force angers me as well. Last time I checked we had these "militia" fighting and dying right beside their regular force brothers and sisters. Yet another outdated ideal from the RCL.

Fact is these places were designed by war vets for war vets. Navy Army Airforce. If your an ex service member who has joined the CIC to give back to the community; by all means come on in. If your a 30 yr old ex cadet with 12 years service in a youth program...No. You don't belong there. If your a civilian who had a great uncle serve once. You don't belong there. If your some random civi who likes having cheap drinks...you don't belong there. I know during my grandfathers generation you would have been laughed out of the legion as part of the cadet program with no other service.

Time to get back to what the legion was all about. An inclusive club looking out for our serving brothers and sisters best interest.

My friend was in Cadets, a CI and later CIC but was not eligible for military service due to medical restrictions, it is still honourable to be contributing to society in other ways. so she joined the RCL Ladies Auxiliary and wears the her legion uniform with pride, unlike most of us (myself included) who don't even show up to vote, only pay dues and drop in for a drink during Remembrance Day and maybe another 3 days in the year (I am making a concientious effort to become more involved, when work doesnt get in the way)
It is up to us to get involved, although I'm not crazy about meat draws and bingo.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

Not to hi-jack but I just learned from my father that Branch 154 (Ogden) in Calgary will be closing due to bankruptcy this month.

This is the third building for this legion, the second being built from the Shepard BCATP WO's and Sgt's mess. In the late 70's early 80's the current location was built. It boasts 2 banquet halls, a members canteen, a public lounge, and an 8 sheet curling rink on the second floor.  This facility has been mortgaged and paid off twice and they can now no longer afford the mortgage. As I really only have the chance to enter the facility about 3 times a year when I visit home I notice a large amount of bloody expensive security systems (uneccessary in my mind), televisions that didnt need replacing and others.  The branch membership would love to see a forensic audit but cannot afford it. Dominion Command replaced the Exec last summer. 

This folks is a shame, truly a shame. Hell the curling rink could sustain the place all year.  It just saddens me to see this particular icon die off after its inception by during the days of War Production at the Ogden CPR yards

 

[q_1966]

Curling rink, I'm impressed, sad that it is closing

 

[Zartan]

So that's what they were hiding there! That legion is bloody huge. Now I can imagine why they can't afford the place. Of course, like you said, opening up the curling rink could have sufficed. I wouldn't doubt it. However, that was also the least "open" looking legion I've ever been by. Others have signs to welcome people in... others also have windows

 

[q_1966]

I imagine most of bldg's have been built between the 40s and 60s, built huge to support its members now dwindling away every year, expensive maintenance and heating costs that are through the roof.
Sadly Salmon Arm got rid of theirs for reasons above, it had a lovely commercial kitchen and banquet hall up stairs; that as a kid, the cadet corps would hold the annual mess dinner from, but because they switched to a one story design (kitchen was poorly set up, had all residential appliances/counter tops/half the space) and no banquet hall, meaning the bar wasn't separate, so no minors meaning here we are doing the annual mess dinner in a church basement, the people were all probably very nice but it wasn't the same.

 

[Disenchantedsailor]

The key thing about the Ogden legion is the land was donated and until the building was recently re-mortgaged, it had been paid off twice. The signage could be better, agreed.  better advertising could also help. The interior paint in the canteen, while in keeping with legion colours is painfull (although that can be fixed with a paint brush). But all in all it is a great facility,  I remember years ago (close to fifteen) various organizations would rent out the halls for conferences and engage the kitchen to cater.

 

[maniac]

Fellow Veterans

I hear a lot of talk of how the RC Legion has not stepped up to advocate like it used to.  I'm not defending the organization because there is certainly some truth to that depending on where you go.  Some branches has turned into glorified bars with creative ways in spending their poppy funds. 

I'm proposing rather than complaining about the RC Legion and what it does,  join it and force change from your location.  That is what we did as we had our own group and we joined in mass and took over the executive based on ordinary membership verses their inability to vote.  You don't have to quit any advocate group you maybe a part of,  just use the RC Legion as an extension of your advocacy.

There is no disputing the fact that the RC Legion does have a recognized voice based on it's work with WW vets,  that will not change.  I'm just saying,  knocking them for not doing something is partly our fault for not joining it and forcing our voice from their perspective.  We should have become the RC Legion perspective and voice by now.

I welcome any constructive opinion on the topic.

 

[dogger1936]

Constructive opinions on the RCL is not welcomed; regardless of how great a discussion can form from it.

You have two choices.

Start your own Veterans Association and fight the Government, or;

Join the RCL and fight to establish a true Veteran's presence within the org, instead of letting it be taken over by a bunch of civvies.

And fight the Government.

Either way, you can quite bitching here, feeling and acting like a downtrodden weenie,

and get off your *** an do something besides ranting at people here that actually have you're best interests at heart.

I'd hate to lock a Veteran's thread, but if you don't get your head out of your ***, I will.

Milnet.ca Staff

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I'm proposing rather than complaining about the RC Legion and what it does,  join it and force change from your location.  That is what we did as we had our own group and we joined in mass and took over the executive based on ordinary membership verses their inability to vote.  You don't have to quit any advocate group you maybe a part of,  just use the RC Legion as an extension of your advocacy.

Constructive opinions on the RCL is not welcomed; regardless of how great a discussion can form from it.

Smell the difference lad?? 

 

[57Chevy]

Does anyone out there have an idea of how to go about opening up a Legion ?
Thanks.

 

[dogger1936]

Smell the difference lad??

I smell the difference of opinions yes. As I said anything negatively reflecting on the legion isn't welcomed. Just informing the member he wouldn't get any info from the opposite side.

Legion down 50,000 members in the past year. Carry on.

 

[Scott]

I smell the difference of opinions yes. As I said anything negatively reflecting on the legion isn't welcomed. Just informing the member he wouldn't get any info from the opposite side.

Legion down 50,000 members in the past year. Carry on.

No. You said constructive opinions are not welcomed, there's a difference between constructive and negative.

There are a litany of reasons the Legion numbers could be down and I would guess many of those reasons would hold the same as those for Lion's Clubs, Kinsmen, etc. But it seems you'd rather toss out that rather empty sounding number so as to evoke thoughts that it is entirely due to the Legion itself. I pay my dues but it's rather useless of me to because I visit only occasionally. But I support them still because I do not want to see the doors shut due to a lack of membership.

I have seen the changes in my local since becoming a member almost 16 years ago. I see the difference in how serving members and veterans alike are treated, I see the politics. Rather than pissing and moaning about it I also put forth positive views on them, like some of the support I have seen drummed up in the way of care packages for troops in Afghanistan (Heck, maybe YOU were a recipient of one such package, I know 2RCR sent a very nice letter of thanks to a local merchant whose involvement was shepherded by our members) and support for MFRC nights at local hockey games with troops in attendance, among other things too varied to mention.

When I discuss the aspects I see that require, IMO, improvement I also put forth the things that are working well. I've seen SFA of that from some here.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Constructive opinions on the RCL is not welcomed; regardless of how great a discussion can form from it.

I smell the difference of opinions yes. As I said anything negatively reflecting on the legion isn't welcomed. Just informing the member he wouldn't get any info from the opposite side.

Legion down 50,000 members in the past year. Carry on.

Wrong. You just don't read enough, or read selectively searching for your own position.

There is a lot of dissenting opinion on what the Legion is about or how they go about it. Those posters also try, mostly, to offer solutions.

The difference between them and you though, is that while those opinions offer a modicum of solution, yours just come across as bleatings of a whiny bitch, offering none.

Rather than join and try affect change, you'd rather the self cathartic route of endlessly slagging what you won't educate and involve yourself in.

Carry on.