Walking the dog???

[SupersonicMax]

I never take it lightly and I always return the compliments.  However, I will not go back and forth a place to be able to actually salute.  I believe that saying "Thank you" is just as good when both hands are full.

Max

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

I'm sorry but in my job, stuff happens last minute sometimes...  In fact, most of the time.  And it's not because of lack of planning...  And btw, I don't have an issue back pack. I have a flight bag.

Max

What he said ... there's a point where function becomes more important than formality (and there are orders about having too much crap stuffed into your pockets).  Doing everything twice in order to keep my right hand free is stupid.

Max, everyones jobs happen practically last minute, with the often chance on chance element of surprise. It should not in anyway be an excuse when it comes to the proper paying and returning of compliments while in uniform. Since you and me brother are junior officers, we will get screwed more often then not, just like previously mentioned with the roaming saluting machines. Yet, we should still return salutes and we should do it with the up most precision and sharpness. No matter what the intent was behind that salute, we, as officers, should never take it lightly. Just my 0.02 rupees.

I think we are drawing a line between paying and returning compliments (which I'm sure we all agree-upon) and walking around with only one useful arm.

 

[orange.paint]

I for one am not an officer.I'm not saluting you,I'm saluting your commission by the queen.Looking like a sack of poo reflects poorly on the CF and your commission IMHO.

I suggest you take a good hard look at the drill manual,obviously it is not enforced on the airforce side.However in the army you keep small things in your pockets and make more than one trip if necessary.

No matter the excuse as "Were quite busy" is kinda lame.As most army guys know we get busy from time to time(in between suntanning and all).Apparently going through training you must have had poor NCO's who didn't enforce dress and discipline.Personally any troop that I train will adhere to it,if he doesn't it reflects poorly on myself,and the organisation that trained him.

Max, everyones jobs happen practically last minute, with the often chance on chance element of surprise. It should not in anyway be an excuse when it comes to the proper paying and returning of compliments while in uniform. Since you and me brother are junior officers, we will get screwed more often then not, just like previously mentioned with the roaming saluting machines. Yet, we should still return salutes and we should do it with the up most precision and sharpness. No matter what the intent was behind that salute, we, as officers, should never take it lightly. Just my 0.02 rupees.

Hummm....army base trained there MEDTech?Seems you have a grasp on it.

...However I really would perfer if you refered to NCM/NCO's as just that and not roaming saluting machines. ;D

"If you look good,everything else just falls into place."


There should be no arguement look in the forsaken drill bible...it's all right there.

 

[armyvern]

I never take it lightly and I always return the compliments.  However, I will not go back and forth a place to be able to actually salute.  I believe that saying "Thank you" is just as good when both hands are full.

Max

Really hope that you remember that when it's you, arms free, who passes your Cpl one morning while both his hands are full, preferably with coffee for me and donuts too.

 

[SupersonicMax]

Librarian, if you knew me, I'm really a laid back person and I will take the compliments anyway they come (Good Day is perfect for me).  If they want donuts and coffee well it's their buisness and I don't see any regulations preventing this. 

There is a way to carry two items in two different hands and still look professionnal.  And I think the excuse "We are quite busy" isn't that lame.  Not that anybody would ask me "Why do you carry stuff in both hands?" anyway...

Max

 

[armyvern]

Supersonic max,

You talking to a girl who has, on many occasion, thrown her full duffle bag atop her rucksack which was on her back in order to make it wherever I was going in one trip...and leave the hands free.

Sorry, but I don't buy the difficulty of carrying a helmet bag (they're pretty small comparably) and another bag simultaneously. The Tac hel guys around these parts seem to be quite capable of slinging their helmet bags and another over their left shoulders (somewhat purselike) and leaving their right hand and arm free. They even manage to negotiate that Timmies cup into the left hand without too much difficulty, and return salutes.

 

[SupersonicMax]

Now try that with 2 pieces of luggages, a flight bag and a Parka  

Max

 

[medaid]

Hummm....army base trained there MEDTech?Seems you have a grasp on it.

...However I really would perfer if you refered to NCM/NCO's as just that and not roaming saluting machines. ;D

No no no I didn't mean that NCM/NCOs are roaming saluting machines I was referring to the troops that ROAM around in search of officers with both arms tied up ;D. I was an NCM once, and I know how much it'd piss me off when I salute an officer, and they didn't have the common decency to you know, at least say 'thank you' or something.

Come on! we all used to do it! 'Damn officers, thinks they're blah blah blah blah blah' 

 

[I_am_John_Galt]

I for one am not an officer.I'm not saluting you,I'm saluting your commission by the queen.Looking like a sack of poo reflects poorly on the CF and your commission IMHO.

What does this have to do with anything?

I suggest you take a good hard look at the drill manual,obviously it is not enforced on the airforce side.However in the army you keep small things in your pockets and make more than one trip if necessary. ... There should be no arguement look in the forsaken drill bible...it's all right there.

Great idea!

http://142.59.159.170/pams/cfp201_b.pdf
CFP201 Chapter 2: SQUAD DRILL AT THE HALT WITHOUT ARMS

CARRYING OF ARTICLES
19.  If any one article is carried, such as a briefcase, umbrella or raincoat, it shall be carried in the left hand. If an article is carried when marching, the left arm is not swung.

20.  Articles shall be carried in the manner illustrated in Figure 2-5.

Fig. 2-5 illustrates items carried both with a straight arm and elbow bent 90 degrees, one item in left hand and two items, one in each hand.

SALUTING, AT THE HALT, WITHOUT ARMS
36.  The salute is given with the right hand. When physical incapacity or carrying of articles makes a salute with the right hand impracticable, compliments will be paid by turning the head and eyes to the left or right or standing to attention, as appropriate (see also Chapter 1, Section 2).

Advantage: AirForce Jr. Officers

 

[armyvern]

Now try that with 2 pieces of luggages, a flight bag and a Parka  

Max

Make two trips. Plain and simple. The traffic techs are already taking it out to the plane for you. If you've got two pieces of luggage, the flight bag and a parka, you knew about the trip well enough in advance to pack. No excuses for not therefore having enough time to show up and take two trips into the hangar. North of 60 for a SAR flight?? Most likely you wouldn't have known in advance, but then you wouldn't have two pieces of luggage either.  

 

[SupersonicMax]

I never pack the parka, I need it in the plane closet.  The flight bag, I need it for my job.  I usually bring my stuff for the trips right before we go (I leave it in the car since there isn't much space for this where I work)  And sometimes, we are delayed and delayed and suddenly, the aircraft comes up serviceable and here we go.  So it has to be quick enough...  So I will not make 2 trips! 

And no, traffic techs don't unload my baggages for me, I usually do it for myself and for the others most of the time, just because I'm nice   I'm not that lazy...

Max

 

[orange.paint]

Interesting.Guess Ill carry around a ******* umbrella and a raincoat so I don't have to salute anymore.

When I enrolled it was pounded into our feeble minds to not carry anything in your right hand.Don't carry anything if can fit into a pocket or in a backpack.

I seen a SSM lose it on troops carrying their keys in their hand on their way to the parking lot.

If you want to know who RCAC_011 is tomorrow go to J-7 and look for the bald guy with the umbrella and a ******* raincoat.

Guess everything I've learned was a lie.

 

[SupersonicMax]

Interesting.Guess Ill carry around a ******* umbrella and a raincoat so I don't have to salute anymore.

When I enrolled it was pounded into our feeble minds to not carry anything in your right hand.Don't carry anything if can fit into a pocket or in a backpack.

I seen a SSM lose it on troops carrying their keys in their hand on their way to the parking lot.

If you want to know who RCAC_011 is tomorrow go to J-7 and look for the bald guy with the umbrella and a ******* raincoat.

Guess everything I've learned was a lie.

Again, I guess this is a mentality thing, which is, I believe, closely related to the element you work in.  I guess the Air Force has other matters to take care of during the day than spotting people going to their car with their keys in hand  : 

 

[armyvern]

I never pack the parka, I need it in the plane closet.  The flight bag, I need it for my job.  I usually bring my stuff for the trips right before we go (I leave it in the car since there isn't much space for this where I work)  And sometimes, we are delayed and delayed and suddenly, the aircraft comes up serviceable and here we go.  So it has to be quick enough...  So I will not make 2 trips! 

And no, traffic techs don't unload my baggages for me, I usually do it for myself and for the others most of the time, just because I'm nice   I'm not that lazy...

Max

I never told you to pack the parka. I was a SAR spotter in Trenton, did my tour of Alert too, I know what it's like to live with the parka handy. I also know what it's like to keep the fly away kit...in the workplace vice the trunk.

I didn't say the tfc techs unloaded your bags for you either. They take them from the hangar, across the flight line and onto the plane though. The hardest part is actually getting them into the hangar. And really, it's not as difficult as you seem to be making it. I've seen it done daily in Trenton. Of course that takes more than one trip, but others seem able to do it quite easily that way.

It also has nothing to do with mentality. Some people have it, some don't. Glad the pilots in Trenton seemed to have mastered the art of carrying more than one bag at a time and are still capable of returning that salute. Are you telling me that's a fading artform now??

 

[SupersonicMax]

My way of returning the salute when hands full is by saying thanks.  And by the books, it seems to be okay.

And I do bring my own luggage to the plane and back.  We are a self sufficient unit

Max

 

[orange.paint]

If I can carry a ruck on my back a barrack box in my left hand...
Mentality...you mean looking professional right?
For some reason I'm getting an image of a bunch of guys walking down the corridor of junior high with books piled up to their nose.

 

[SupersonicMax]

If I can carry a ruck on my back a barrack box in my left hand...
Mentality...you mean looking professional right?
For some reason I'm getting an image of a bunch of guys walking down the corridor of junior high with books piled up to their nose.

Maybe your image is wrong.  In the end, I always ask myself :  If CBC or CTV sees me right now, will I look like an idiot.  And I think it comes right down to it :  Using common sense. 

I don't think carrying my 2 pieces of luggage, one in each hand, with the flight bag and the parka on top of one will make me look like an idiot...

Max

 

[Gramps]

I didn't say the tfc techs unloaded your bags for you either. They take them from the hangar, across the flight line and onto the plane though.

As a matter of fact we do not take crew baggage, they are on their own there. I had a bad experience once with a young Nav 2Lt who tried to blame me for him forgetting his NAV Bag in the OPs room in Thule. He lost the argument and I lost all respect for him for trying that crap. Now because of that and other incidents similar to it (usually with new, young OJT aircrew but not always) I will not go near crew baggage unless it is a favour usually done for the loadmaster or the A/C if they ask for a little help.
Of course just because you have to carry your own kit like the rest of us is no excuse for being slack and idle either. I too have had the rucksack, duffel bag and barrack box to carry all at once as well and always find my saluting hand free.

 

[armyvern]

As a matter of fact we do not take crew baggage, they are on their own there. I had a bad experience once with a young Nav 2Lt who tried to blame me for him forgetting his NAV Bag in the OPs room in Thule. He lost the argument and I lost all respect for him for teying that crap. Now because of that and other incidents similar to it (usually with new, young OJT aircrew but not always) I will not go near crew baggage unless it is a favour usually done for the loadmaster or the A/C if they ask for a little help.
Of course just because you have to carry your own kit like the rest of us is no excuse for being slack and idle either. I too have had the rucksack, duffel bag and barrack box to carry all at once as well and always find my saluting hand free.

Thanks for the update gramps. Nice to hear they are carting their own kit now. It's amazing what some of us can do to manage to keep that right hand free. I call it initiative. Now, I'm out of this thread. I hate excuses.

 

[medicineman]

If I'm feeling reasonably considerate (which I generally am in my now mellower years), I usually give the poor person concerned with their hands full an eyes left or right to acknowledge they may have some problems using their hands - usually does the trick.

As for favorite transgressions to date, we (us Sgt's on our 6B here) witnessed a WO giving drill to a bunch of baby nursing officers on the school parade square without headress on - a little bug was put in his OC's ear, who called his CSM at home on a day off...well I think you can guess the rest.

We aren't immune to it either.

MM