Verification of Former Service (VFS) [Merged]

[NJL]

I've changed my sleep pattern  to match the BMQ schedule (getting up at 5 bed by 11), I'm also trainng differently to better match the BMQ course (more early moring running)... currently I'm training/ getting ready for BMQ not for 5 years from now that's what BMQ/QL's,etc help teach/train

To say that "BMQ is easier than day-day military life" is a general statement... what do you mean by easier? what's easy can depend on the person, some find BMQ hard some don't....Plus There are many different types of jobs in the CF ... being a chef is alot different than being a pilot or a armoured soldier.. in that day-day life in the CF is diferent for many depending on job/posting/ duties

 

[aesop081]

I've changed my sleep pattern  to match the BMQ schedule (getting up at 5 bed by 11), I'm also trainng differently to better match the BMQ course (more early moring running)... currently I'm training/ getting ready for BMQ not for 5 years from now that's what BMQ/QL's,etc help teach/train

To say that "BMQ is easier than day-day military life" is a general statement... what do you mean by easier? There are many different types of jobs in the CF ... being a chef is alot different than being a pilot or a armored soldier.

It doesnt matter what trade you are.  On BMQ you are coddled. They tell you when to go to bed, they tell you when to wake up.  You get 3 meals a day...you get a hot shower and a warm bed. And with all that you still VRed......What are you going to do when you are tired, wet, dirty , hungry and unde fire.......do you realy think that BMQ was harder than all that ?

You going to be a chef you say ? have you considered that cooks live in the field under the same conditions ? They work long hours too.  They even get sea sick on board ships to add to their misery. And watch out if the crew is mad because you cook crap !!!

On BMQ you only have very simple things to do and someone always tells you what it is.  After BMQ you have to think.....even if you only had 30 minutes of sleep and sometimes those decisions you have to make will be life or death ones.......

 

[aesop081]

Dont make the misstake of thinking that your post-BMQ career is going to be 9-5..........

 

[Pte_Martin]

I think he understands, it's up to him to change and pass the courses or to VR again, Keep us updated and good luck

 

[NJL]

I'm actually gonna be a RMS Clerk not a chef I was just using it as an example.

I know it won't be 9-5 job and I undersatnd and agree with alot of what your saying... all I'm saying is that BMQ is Step 1.... then QL3's, etc.. it goes in steps, BMQ helps recruits with the change from civy to military... are you saying that because someone VRs once means they shouldn't get a second chance... I guess time will tell if I'll pass the second time but I'm confident I'll suceed

 

[aesop081]

I'm actually gonna be a RMS Clerk not a chef I was just using it as an example.

are you saying that because someone VRs once means they shouldn't get a second chance...

No i am not......but if you managed to come up with that sad an excuse for doing it the first time........I will wish you good luck but i wont be holding my breath.

 

[NJL]

Thanks Infantry, that's all I'm saying.... is it's up to me to change and pass the courses...which I plan on doing

Cdnaviator thanks for wishing me good luck and I know you have your doubts but time will tell.

 

[armychickenlittle]

Hi again, Rather than tell you to "get over it" as some would, I'd rather help you out. I wasn't on your course, I don't know just how hard that serial was so telling you to get over it or look for another line of work certainly isn't constructive or helpful. Sorry, guys.  So what I do want to tell you is that I happened to ask a few questions at work today about someone like you who wants to reapply and does he have to wait the six months. The answer I got back implied that you should apply now because "the powers that be" MAY be able to waive the requirement to wait the six months IF you are going for a trade that's in high demand. If you want something that's harder to get into, like, say, a construction trade or RMS, you might as well wait until the new fiscal year when there'll likely be more openings. I hope this helps.  As for the sleep issue, you just have to tell yourself that at 2300 hrs it's time to sleep, whether your s**t is done or not. You can't pass your classroom tests if you don't get the sleep, and THAT's something they can send you home for.

 

[NJL]

Thanks armychickenlittle for the info..  but my trade choices are RMS (I took 2 yrs of accounting/business in college) and Trafic Tech, I was accepted as a RMS clerk before so I'll probably stick with it and wait a few months to reapply (gives me more time to train)... I think some people here are misunderstanding my posts/story, I never said that I found the BMQ really hard (physically/class room lessons) cuz I didn't... I was doing fine (as well as most in my platoon) throught the day (5 a.m.- 11.am.) it just the fact the I wasn't sleeping at all started to cause mental fatigue/blood pressure issues (it's a fact people need to sleep, if you don't you'll begin to have health/stress issues)... I know for a fact that had I been sleeping more (and not had the health problems)  I wouldn't have VR and would've probably passed the course. One of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon (where most days I would work in Farnham from 7-4 doing manual labor jobs) and began to sleep better (the 6hrs were supossed to get) I was fine, and the issues (mental fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.     

 

[aesop081]

Thanks armychickenlittle for the info..  but my trade choices are RMS (I took 2 yrs of accounting/business in college) and Trafic Tech, I was accepted as a RMS clerk before so I'll probably stick with it and wait a few months to reapply (gives me more time to train)... I think some people here are misunderstanding my posts/story, I never said that I found the BMQ really hard (physically/class room lessons) cuz I didn't... I was doing fine (as well as most in my platoon) throught the day (5 a.m.- 11.am.) it just the fact the I wasn't sleeping at all started to cause mental fatigue/stress/blood pressure issues (it's a fact people need to sleep, if you don't you'll begin to have health/stress issues)... I know for a fact that had I been sleeping more (and not had the health problems)  I wouldn't have VR and would've probably passed the course. One of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon and began to sleep better (the 6hrs were supossed to get) I was fine, and the issues (fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.     

I understood your problem quite well NJL and i regardless of what chickenlittle has to say , i stand by my comments.  lack of sleep is a fact of life regardless of trade or posting.  if you are going to start having health/stress/blood pressure issues everytime you dont get 6 hours sleep and cant do you job...again...seek life elsewhere. It may not be constructive....but its a fact !!

 

[Zertz]

At anyrate, are you not given 2300-0500 to sleep? Add firepicket somewhere in there are it adds up to around 5 hours, no? I'm not sure how you're not getting sleep.

 

[NJL]

I never once have said that when I don't get 6 hrs of sleep I experience these problems... even now in my civy life I sometimes only get 3-4 hrs of sleep and am able to function fine with no problems. I've even gone a couple days without sleep and have been fine... I'm not saying that lack of sleep was the only problems I had during my last BMQ time, but I feel it was a major contributing factor. I've learned from my past mistake (VR) and when I return to BMQ if/when I again have problems (sleep or anything else) I will suck it up and deal with it looking at the big picture... why I joined and what the future will hold

Zerts, I was in my bed from 11-5 yes but for some reason I was only sleeping 1-2 hrs if that.. whereas most everyone else had no problem sleeping... why wasn't I sleeping? if I knew then I would've fixed the problem. I realise now that one of the factor was that I didn't get into a proper sleep pattern before leaving (which won't happen again) and figured I would adapt easily.

 

[aesop081]

Well...i hope it works out for you.

For the record.....

..... of the reason I say that is becuse once I was put on PAT platoon (where most days I would work in Farnham from 7-4 doing manual labor jobs) and began to sleep better (the 6hrs were supossed to get) I was fine, and the issues (mental fatigue/blood pressure) I had before went away.     

BMQ is not the last course you will get 6 hours or less of sleep......
I didnt sleep much on my CLC...even less on my QL6A......i didnt sleep in navigation school...and now i cant sleep before 10 hour patrols.......

 

[NJL]

cdnaviator I realize that BMQ is just the beginning(then comes QL3's) and from there on sleep isn't guarnteed to nobody... I can remember my Platoon Commander saying "once we get to Farnham rules are I gotta give you guy 5 hrs of sleep/day but it doesn't say when and at what times)

thanks for your comments though and while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.  

 

[aesop081]

thanks for your comments though and while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.  

Dont get me wrong, i do hope it works out for you.  I sincerly wish you good luck.

BTW : 11 years combat engineer....3 years as a zoomie ...and counting

 

[exsemjingo]

... while you may not understand where I'm coming from your 14+ years of service as a Combat Engineer is something I find commendable... in the future I hope to have a similar career just in a different trade.  

Like Infantry?  You only sleep there when the enemy lets you.

 

[NJL]

Like Infantry?  You only sleep there when the enemy lets you.

I hear what you saying, Infantry are A+ in my book... they're on the frontlines (in places like Afganistan) doing/seeing crazy things, risking their lives for our country... true hereo's in every sence of the word. 

 

[armychickenlittle]

Ok, now I see what trade you wanted. No need to answer that part of the personal email you sent me.

 

[NavComm]

NJL I just re-read all your posts on this topic and I think it's you that doesn't understand. I think you have an idealized version of military life. I don't agree that it's a 'fact' that everyone requires 6 uninterupted hours of sleep a night. In fact, I had a sargeant tell me that a person only really requires 15 minutes of sleep in a 24-hour period.

In the military, you get sleep when you can, not when you want it. It doesn't matter what job you do.

Having said that, if you get a job at an office that is only open from 8 - 4 you might be on a typical civvie-like schedule, but what if you are overseas or on a ship? What if you get GD (general duties) before you are trade qualified? That could go on for a year or more.

I did GD all summer and I had a few 19-hr days. In the field we were lucky to get more than 2 hours of sleep at a time. I did GD on a ship recently and my day started at 4 a.m. and ended around 8 p.m. I didn't get to say 'people need sleep you know, it's a fact'. Nobody gives a rat's a## is it's a fact or not.

There were a few people on my bmq that vr'd for some pretty lame reasons, so I guess it's not all that unusual. I just hope that if you do go back, you change your attitude and are doing this for the right reasons. There are already too many people graduating bmq and trades courses who are lazy, whiny, annoying little princesses and I hope you don't become one of them.

My .02 and I do wish you success on all your courses and in your future in the military. Serving one's country is a priviledge and an honour not to be taken lightly IMO.

 

[IrishCanuck]

Allright, I'm seeing alot of guesswork being thrown back and forth in regards to the amount of sleep needed for any given person.

It is true the amount of sleep needed for any one person varies greatly. Some people are fine with four hours, others need six , seven, or even eight.

I also see the validity in stating that people in the military should for their own good and producitivity be some of the people that require less sleep than average.

However 15 minutes of a sleep a day is not enough for a person aside from maybe 1-2 days maximum at a time followed by a chance to catch up on their sleep.

The brain needs sleep, it's a fact. Anyone who has taken a basic psych class knows that if the brain isn't allowed to enter into continuous, then there are adverse side affects such as: inhibited physical growth ( as growth tends to be spurred by Stage 4 sleep), and with no REM sleep : reduced memory performance, and reduced verbal abilities. This stems from the brain not having time to "processes and assimiliate" new information gleaned since the previous sleep session. This is why anyone who pulls an all nighter for exams (bad idea) must stay awake until the exam, because getting 2 hrs sleep , the brain will not enter into REM stage sleep, at least not for a very long period of time, and that information will be lost.

If you are sleep deprived for too long a period, you may actually experience something called "microsleeps", in which the body falls asleep for a few seconds up to a minute at a time. People generally aren't aware of this, and it is most often described as "zoning or spacing out". This is highly dangerous for a soldier, operating high tech and deadly machinery , not to mention any sentries on duty.

Now , modern Armed Forces are aware of the effects of sleep deprivation, and the US military is working on pills that change the chemical and neural composition of the brain in the short term, and reduce the effects of sleep deprivation.

Just fyi haha.

Hence I believe at least 4 hrs a night at BMQ or on any course would be crucial, as the brain needs to process all the new training that has come its way.