USAF Woes

[dapaterson]

RCAF can't train its own in a timely manner.  I am beginning to think that running pilot training is too complex an undertaking for pilots to manage...

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Training is hard to do when the budget isn't fat enough to do it the way it should be done.  This isn't limited to Pilots in the RCAF.

 

[rnkelly]

RCAF can't train its own in a timely manner.  I am beginning to think that running pilot training is too complex an undertaking for pilots to manage...

What trade do you suggest?

Training output is fine, retention on the other hand...

 

[dapaterson]

Pilots are too expensive to train to employ significantly outside the cockpit.  So, employ them as instructors.  But to run the training system, you'd probably be best suited to have the majority of the staff as civilians: less expensive to employ, generally, longer tenures in positions and thus can take the long view.

Planning and coordinating training is not a task worth employing pilots on.  And given the shortages of TES vs TEE, and oversize BTL currently in place for Pilot, it's clear that letting inmates run the asylum pilots run the training system hasn't worked.

 

[Eye In The Sky]

Pilots are too expensive to train to employ significantly outside the cockpit.  So, employ them as instructors.  But to run the training system, you'd probably be best suited to have the majority of the staff as civilians: less expensive to employ, generally, longer tenures in positions and thus can take the long view.

Planning and coordinating training is not a task worth employing pilots on.  And given the shortages of TES vs TEE, and oversize BTL currently in place for Pilot, it's clear that letting inmates run the asylum pilots run the training system hasn't worked.

We could say the same thing for....MARS officers, or...Combat Arms types.  Would MARS or Combat Arms types want to be trained by civies? 

Unless the pilots leaving the service become the civies that do the teaching.  Not sure the CFFTSs are located in the most desireable living locations.

 

[rnkelly]

Pilots are too expensive to train to employ significantly outside the cockpit.  So, employ them as instructors.  But to run the training system, you'd probably be best suited to have the majority of the staff as civilians: less expensive to employ, generally, longer tenures in positions and thus can take the long view.

Planning and coordinating training is not a task worth employing pilots on.  And given the shortages of TES vs TEE, and oversize BTL currently in place for Pilot, it's clear that letting inmates run the asylum pilots run the training system hasn't worked.

Like many occupations, pilots are required in command and admin positions.  That's just the cost of doing business in the military.  I wouldn't want to see pilots get any less operationally driven than they are right now during training.  I think we've maxed out the benefits of civilian contractors with the likes of Bombardier, CAE, Allied wings, Kelowna Flightcraft, Canadian helicopters, Top Aces, Discovery Air Defense services, Calian etc.

 

[dapaterson]

The cost of training pilots is almost an order of magnitude greater than that for other occupations.  We therefore need a greater return on that investment; if more than half a career is spent flying desks then we're wasting millions on pilot training.

Indeed, if we push some pilots out of cubicles in YOW, YWG and YGK and back into line functions, some of those contracted functions could be brought back in house.

Ultimately, the RCAF (run by and large by pilots) has failed to keep the pilot production pipeline in good working order.  As with any bureaucracy, we have an unfortunate habit of reinforcing failure, by throwing more money at the problem, instead of cutting our losses and starting anew (Cough Phoenix cough).  Fixing RCAF pilot training also means fixing the pilot occupational structure writ large; and therefore it won't happen - too many vested interests in preserving the status quo, warts and all.

 

[rnkelly]

I agree with a lot of what you're saying but we can't have 100% of our TES in cockpits either.  You need pilots in the HQ's just like you need Infantry and MARS otherwise the tail starts wagging the dog.  As far as numbers in HQ's I've never been but I've heard some fat could be cut.  Again, I think that training pilots to wings standard isn't the main problem, we define that as being OFP which I find amusing since you are no where near deployable yet.

If a pilot retires after 25 yrs as a Captain or Major the vast majority of their career should be spent flying for sure.  I don't think it's unique to pilots though, it's probably better than most trades though.  If you have a room full of infantry captains you would be hard pressed to find a platoon commander.  When I'm being charitable I like to think the CAF has a method to their madness (re; frequent postings) and is trying to give a member a wide variety of experiences and exposure so that when the day comes to deploy they are versatile and could serve a number of different roles/purposes competently, sometimes on the same deployment. 

I agree that a lot of things within the CAF need to be relooked at though.  When I arrived on Sqn, we only had a quarter of the helicopters we were suppose to have according to doctrine.  The PYs for the sqn, wing etc were based on the doctrine number though.  We had too many pilots for too few hours so you were spending the first half of a training flight shaking off the rust, not ideal.  When I took ATOC, I assumed wrongly that the Armoured Regiment had said number of tanks- I was laughed out of the mess. 

Return on investment is a can of worms, we're only here to offer a capability and may never be used at all.  Everyone can release after their initial VIE and if they decide to (which is their right) we aren't getting much bang for our buck (in most cases).  So the only way to get a return on investment is to retain members for longer than their VIE and the only way to do that is to keep them happy (read- not completely miserable).  We try to be the employer of choice and have great remuneration packages but somehow still have retention and recruiting problems.  When is Human Resources Officer going to be a thing, with actual training and stuff.

 

[MarkOttawa]

Cf. RCAF?

Air Force could recall as many as 1,000 retired pilots to address serious shortage

President Trump signed an executive order Friday allowing the Air Force to recall as many as 1,000 retired pilots to active duty to address a shortage in combat fliers, the White House and Pentagon announced.

By law, only 25 retired officers can be brought back to serve in any one branch. Trump's order removes those caps by expanding a state of national emergency declared by President George W. Bush after 9/11, signaling what could be a significant escalation in the 16-year-old global war on terror.

"We anticipate that the Secretary of Defense will delegate the authority to the Secretary of the Air Force to recall up to 1,000 retired pilots for up to three years," Navy Cdr. Gary Ross, a Pentagon spokesman, said in a statement.

But the executive order itself is not specific to the Air Force, and could conceivably be used in the future to call up more officers and in other branches.

More: Army is accepting more low-quality recruits, giving waivers for marijuana to hit targets

The Air Force needs about 1,500 pilots more than it has. Bonus programs and other incentives have not made up the shortfall.

The Air Force has been at the forefront of the Pentagon's battle against the Islamic State, flying most of the combat sorties in Iraq and Syria since 2014...
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2017/10/20/air-force-recall-many-1-000-retired-pilots-address-serious-shortage/785344001/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[tomahawk6]

The USAF is also promoting all Captains to Major for the next 3 to 4 years.

https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your-air-force/2017/09/18/all-eligible-air-force-captains-to-be-promoted-to-major-for-next-three-four-years/

 

[Rifleman62]

T6 may miss the meaning. Hellyer Cpl's???

 

[tomahawk6]

T6 may miss the meaning. Hellyer Cpl's???

I googled the term  umpkin:

https://army.ca/forums/threads/21238.0

 

[dapaterson]

President Trump signed an executive order Friday allowing the Air Force to recall as many as 1,000 retired pilots to active duty to address a shortage in combat fliers, the White House and Pentagon announced.

Hmm...

 

[MarkOttawa]

Meanwhile:

Air Force: No plans to recall retired pilots to fix shortage
https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your-air-force/2017/10/22/air-force-no-plans-to-recall-retired-pilots-to-fix-shortage/

Mark
Ottawa

 

[tomahawk6]

Meanwhile:

Mark
Ottawa

I dont see how they can avoid doing that.They dont have to fly. Retired pilots can fill staffs and training roles to free up deskbound pilots.

 

[SupersonicMax]

Preclude to a Korean war?

 

[tomahawk6]

Not for North Korea.How many planes do you need to take out a military frozen in time ? In the first 24 hours their navy and air force would cease to exist. SAM defenses would be destroyed AAA would be a problem. Lil Kim would probably be a casualty in the ensuing power struggle .Kim goes and a deal might be struck.

 

[SupersonicMax]

You'd need a lot to neutralize the threat to Seoul (long range arty) and the ICMB threat.  Far more than you have 5th Gen (which you'd need)  North Korea is probably the hardest nut to crack in terms of military strategy.

 

[tomahawk6]

You'd need a lot to neutralize the threat to Seoul (long range arty) and the ICMB threat.  Far more than you have 5th Gen (which you'd need)  North Korea is probably the hardest nut to crack in terms of military strategy.

Helicopter gunships and C-130 gunships may be more effective against targets dug into the side of a hill or mountain.

 

[YZT580]

Helicopter gunships and C-130 gunships may be more effective against targets dug into the side of a hill or mountain.

Not to mention the antiquated relic of the cold war: the A10