Trudeau Popularity - or not (various polling, etc.)

[YZT580]

IF we are constitutional monarchies may I be King of Saskatchewan?

Ya didn't expect that did ya?

theoretically, yes. All you have to do is give Mo lots of cash

 

[FSTO]

Completely relevant and I think we are going to see a big political shift in the next 5-10 years.

The situation seems remarkably similar to what led to the rise of Fascism in Italy and elsewhere: runaway spending, high taxes, budget deficits, debts, inflation and unemployment.

The question will be, what will be the response?


Personally, I think there is a massive lack of ambition in this Country and vision. Especially amongst people my age and younger.

"Being 35-40 and realizing you'll never own a home, and can't afford to have a family is a very different beast"

My answer to that is: Well, not with an attitude like that you won't!

I know for a fact that wealth, home ownership, etc are all achievable. I know it's achievable because I've done it all myself and consider myself to be a self-made man. That being said, there is no such thing as a free lunch. In this World, if you want something, you need to take it for yourself.

Now what do I think the future will look like? Probably more authoritarian, corporatist and we will probably see a rebirth of hyper-nationalism which will look remarkably similar to Fascism in certain respects.

This will all be driven by my generation. The ones who lived through 9/11, the 2008 Financial Crisis, The GWOT, COVID-19.

New leadership will emerge from this cohort.

Heaven forbid a kid has to leave Toronto to work in a remote hell hole like Orillia ON or even worse Dryden to make some money and start the process to become independent.

 

[FSTO]

Last guy who played that role (Riel) ended up hanged, not sure I would want that role myself knowing the outcome

Actually Riel was fighting for Métis peoples rights to recognized by the GoC. He wasn’t fighting for an independent state that would have been swallowed up by Manifest Destiny Mad USA immediately.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Heaven forbid a kid has to leave Toronto to work in a remote hell hole like Orillia ON or even worse Dryden to make some money and start the process to become independent.

Or, heaven forbid, rural Saskatchewan/Manitoba/Alberta, where houses can be had for under $200K…

 

[GR66]

Or, heaven forbid, rural Saskatchewan/Manitoba/Alberta, where houses can be had for under $200K…

How many decent paying jobs with potential for career growth are there in rural Saskatchewan or even Orillia, ON? Enough for the 1,000,000+ Torontonians in the 20-30 age group?

I have three friends who's kids have moved to Orillia but even there the housing market is out of reach for most young people. Average house prices are just under $800k.

Yes there are definitely opportunities for individuals to re-locate and find work in parts of Canada with cheaper housing prices but let's not pretend that there's anywhere near the housing or jobs available in these areas to make a dent for the bulk of the youth that are concentrated in the major population centres where pricing is simply unaffordable.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

How many decent paying jobs with potential for career growth are there in rural Saskatchewan or even Orillia, ON? Enough for the 1,000,000+ Torontonians in the 20-30 age group?

I have three friends who's kids have moved to Orillia but even there the housing market is out of reach for most young people. Average house prices are just under $800k.

Yes there are definitely opportunities for individuals to re-locate and find work in parts of Canada with cheaper housing prices but let's not pretend that there's anywhere near the housing or jobs available in these areas to make a dent for the bulk of the youth that are concentrated in the major population centres where pricing is simply unaffordable.

Go make your own opportunity. Seriously.

 

[GR66]

Go make your own opportunity. Seriously.

As I said it's definitely an option for individuals but please don't pretend it's THE solution for the housing crisis writ large. Literally millions and millions of young Canadians from our major population centers showing up in rural communities across the country to "make their own opportunities".

 

[dimsum]

Heaven forbid a kid has to leave Toronto to work in a remote hell hole like Orillia ON or even worse Dryden to make some money and start the process to become independent.

I wonder what parallels there were to the 1700s / early 1800s, when Europeans left to come to North America or Australia before the Gold Rush (in North America) and free land. How willing would someone from the big cities of Europe want to relocate?

Yes, the telecommunications and travel situation is completely different now but having lived OUTCAN, there is still a sense of distance when you are partially across the world.

I would also suggest that we in this group aren’t the norm - we are used to moving every X number of years. Most civilians aren’t, and think we are absolutely bonkers for doing so willingly.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I wonder what parallels there were to the 1700s / early 1800s, when Europeans left to come to North America or Australia before the Gold Rush (in North America) and free land. How willing would someone from the big cities of Europe want to relocate?

Yes, the telecommunications and travel situation is completely different now but having lived OUTCAN, there is still a sense of distance when you are partially across the world.

I would also suggest that we in this group aren’t the norm - we are used to moving every X number of years. Most civilians aren’t, and think we are absolutely bonkers for doing so willingly.

And there are stats on that, of course

Do Most Americans Still Live Where They Grew Up? | Exclusive Study

In a recent survey, North American Van Lines found that 72% of Americans still live in the same town they grew up in.

www.northamerican.com

 

[dimsum]

And there are stats on that, of course

View attachment 83984

Do Most Americans Still Live Where They Grew Up? | Exclusive Study

In a recent survey, North American Van Lines found that 72% of Americans still live in the same town they grew up in.

www.northamerican.com

Those are actually much higher than I thought. Wow.

I know those stats are for the US but I wonder what Canada would be like. I suspect similar, but maybe more movement because there are fewer cities.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Those are actually much higher than I thought. Wow.

I know those stats are for the US but I wonder what Canada would be like. I suspect similar, but maybe more movement because there are fewer cities.

Using the 'Costco KPI', I think Canada is pretty much the same.

They don't build those things to meet the needs of gypsy cultures

 

[FSTO]

I wonder what parallels there were to the 1700s / early 1800s, when Europeans left to come to North America or Australia before the Gold Rush (in North America) and free land. How willing would someone from the big cities of Europe want to relocate?

Yes, the telecommunications and travel situation is completely different now but having lived OUTCAN, there is still a sense of distance when you are partially across the world.

I would also suggest that we in this group aren’t the norm - we are used to moving every X number of years. Most civilians aren’t, and think we are absolutely bonkers for doing so willingly.

This is very much an urban phenom. In my home town/area we ALL left. Some left for a few years, some left for ever. Some were farm kids who worked abroad (meaning Alberta LOL) and then came back to take over the firm, or town kids who came back in 10 to 15 years to take over the business of their parents. Others (like me) got a career but plan to come back to retire.

It seems that alot of urban kids are scared to leave and strike out on their own. In my opinion of course.

 

[Kirkhill]

This is very much an urban phenom. In my home town/area we ALL left. Some left for a few years, some left for ever. Some were farm kids who worked abroad (meaning Alberta LOL) and then came back to take over the firm, or town kids who came back in 10 to 15 years to take over the business of their parents. Others (like me) got a career but plan to come back to retire.

It seems that alot of urban kids are scared to leave and strike out on their own. In my opinion of course.

As I have noted before a large percentage (unknown sense only) left Peterborough and found jobs around North America. Some of them have now returned to retire.

....

A thought...

How many enslaved people didn't want to be freed? Indenture was slavery pro tem. In exchange for services rendered the temporary slave got room, board, clothing, medical treatment and an education and possibly a small wage. A slave got those "advantages" for life. A layperson working for an abbey got similar treatment.

When Henry dissolved the monasteries the Yorkshiremen revolted in the Pilgrimage of Grace wanting to know how they were going to live now that their community supports had been taken away from them. (They eventually adjusted - "Where there's muck there's money" is a Yorkshire expression)

When Lincoln emancipated most of the blacks in the US how many of them approached freedom with trepidation? Wondering how they were supposed to find roofs, food, fire, clothing etc...

Were they better off as free share croppers and company miners?

When the Brits broke up the Arab slave trading world it seems reasonable that the slave-traders might hold a grudge. But how about the slaves that lost their jobs.

Lincoln's emancipation occurred in 1863, thirty years after the British emancipation. The forced emancipation of the Arab world took until 1962.
A lot of us were alive then. And a lot of Arabs and their slaves and their sons and daughters are also alive today.

...

The known devil and the unknown devil.

 

[dimsum]

As I have noted before a large percentage (unknown sense only) left Peterborough and found jobs around North America. Some of them have now returned to retire.

....

A thought...

How many enslaved people didn't want to be freed? Indenture was slavery pro tem. In exchange for services rendered the temporary slave got room, board, clothing, medical treatment and an education and possibly a small wage. A slave got those "advantages" for life. A layperson working for an abbey got similar treatment.

When Henry dissolved the monasteries the Yorkshiremen revolted in the Pilgrimage of Grace wanting to know how they were going to live now that their community supports had been taken away from them. (They eventually adjusted - "Where there's muck there's money" is a Yorkshire expression)

When Lincoln emancipated most of the blacks in the US how many of them approached freedom with trepidation? Wondering how they were supposed to find roofs, food, fire, clothing etc...

Were they better off as free share croppers and company miners?

When the Brits broke up the Arab slave trading world it seems reasonable that the slave-traders might hold a grudge. But how about the slaves that lost their jobs.

Lincoln's emancipation occurred in 1863, thirty years after the British emancipation. The forced emancipation of the Arab world took until 1962.
A lot of us were alive then. And a lot of Arabs and their slaves and their sons and daughters are also alive today.

...

The known devil and the unknown devil.

Now, I have never been in that situation, but I think the main difference is that being free means having the potential and opportunity to become more than a slave. Also, the chances of being bought/sold and having the family broken up (due to said buying/selling) isn’t an issue anymore, and they are able to actually visit them.

 

[Kirkhill]

Now, I have never been in that situation, but I think the main difference is that being free means having the potential and opportunity to become more than a slave. Also, the chances of being bought/sold and having the family broken up (due to said buying/selling) isn’t an issue anymore, and they are able to actually visit them.

Likewise...

WRT the family issue. Back in the good old days it was mum and dad doing the selling. It was common for parents to indenture their kids and sell them into service.

Complications to every tale.

 

[OldSolduer]

Or, heaven forbid, rural Saskatchewan/Manitoba/Alberta, where houses can be had for under $200K…

Winnipeg average is higher than 200 K, in rural areas I have no clue how expensive housing is.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

As I said it's definitely an option for individuals but please don't pretend it's THE solution for the housing crisis writ large. Literally millions and millions of young Canadians from our major population centers showing up in rural communities across the country to "make their own opportunities".

I didn’t pretend.

Nothing is “the” solution. But, it all adds up.

 

[lenaitch]

Rural and smaller communities have decent jobs. Maybe not with the income level of the large urban areas but, then again, your cost of living is generally lower. I get that there aren't as many opportunities. If your kid wants to be a Bay St. lawyer work in a tech hub or do cutting edge medical research, limitations will exist. What I don't get is people who simply will not consider them as alternatives. It makes no sense to me to stay in a place you can't afford, and may never afford, bounce around on contracts or low-paying gig jobs exercising your degree in English Lit, and not even consider other opportunities, simply because you don't want to leave family, friends, or that cute bistro. Hell, I've heard Toronto people say they would never consider living north of Bloor.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Part of the issue is that the Feds and the Provinces focus on the big cities, because that's where the votes are. They don't tell the cities "Your a big boy, you look after your own infrastructure for a bit" and then focus their efforts and monies on improving infrastructure in and around the smaller centres. Without good infrastructure, the smaller cities and towns can't attract businesses that generate the jobs that would draw the people in. So it's a vicious circle. Not helped by the fact that many of the smaller communities have very old infrastructure that needs replacing before considering expanding. Prince Rupert can now fix decade old problem thanks to the revenue from the LPG Terminal they managed to get built on City owned land.

 

[Brad Sallows]

Prince Rupert can now fix decade old problem thanks to the revenue from the LPG Terminal they managed to get built on City owned land.

In short: what's good for indigenous communities is good for all communities, so it should be available to all communities: title over local lands and a share of the revenues generated off of them.