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The RCAF's Next Generation Fighter (CF-188 Replacement)

Harrigan said:
Yet we never see discussion on the relative merits of the 5 x companies industrial benefits policies.
The questionnaire sent out to the five companies included a specific series of Industrial Benefit questions (7 specific sub-topics); it's not remotely being ignored.

Cynically, a more relevant question would be "Has the Evil HarperTM ever dealt with your company previously?  'Yes' = exclusion from bidding"  >:D
 
F-35C for RCAF (cf. naval Hornet?

A friend familiar with defence matters observes:

“I think we need a bit of humility to this discussion. Not everyone in the Norwegian, Danish, British, Israeli etc. air forces are fools and some of these are well respected for the depth of their technical competence. Understandably, many in the CAF find the fighter ‘debate’ in Canada extraordinarily frustrating, even if they are not close to the project, for the simple reason that the public discussion is incredibly idiotic and the politicians are no better. As has been the case in almost every similar procurement, except those done under pressure of war.

My own sense is that the F-35A has shortcomings in the RCAF context: aerial refueling is by the boom system which the RCAF does not have and the A model doesn’t have an adequate tail hook for use with the arrestor system at the far northern FOLs which is used much of the year, given the marginal length of the runways and the cost of fixing bent aircraft if they over-run. The USN F-35C has neither limitation but would be considerably more expensive.

I do not believe that the single engine should be a factor for NORAD missions up north but the internal capacity for weapons in stealth mode may be–pylons will no doubt be added for tanks and weapons but that will reduce the low observable quality.

Range on internal fuel seems no worse than the competition.

Perhaps it would be most responsible to argue for:
– the C model
– at least 80 aircraft.

Yes, this would cost more but we can afford it with a small increase of the budget to historic averages decade by decade.

As for the quality of the national conversation on defence, DND has to shoulder some responsibility for cancelling its academic support program.”

Money, money, money rather than public logical analysis based on knowledge in this country.
https://cgai3ds.wordpress.com/2016/08/02/mark-collins-new-rcaf-fighter-debate-on-f-35-vs-rest-esp-super-hornet/comment-page-1/#comment-18125

Mark
Ottawa
 
Good2Golf said:
So, as referred to earlier in this thread, with the USN replacing the Super Hornet with the F/A-XX in the mid-30s, who will be still operating the SH, and how many will be left, across which the burden of continued in-service support will be borne?  ???

The US Navy will be operating it as their first line fighter until 2035 and operating it until almost 2050.
 
jmt18325 said:
The US Navy will be operating it as their first line fighter until 2035 and operating it until almost 2050.

SH would be perfect for our aircraft carriers then. Oh wait....
 
PuckChaser said:
SH would be perfect for our aircraft carriers then. Oh wait....

They can land on ground too... you do realize the CF-18 is a naval aircraft as well, right?
 
Bird_Gunner45 said:
They can land on ground too... you do realize the CF-18 is a naval aircraft as well, right?

Google didn't get me that far. CF-18 is a variant of the A-6 Intruder, right?
 
PuckChaser said:
Google didn't get me that far. CF-18 is a variant of the A-6 Intruder, right?

::) The point was that it's irrelevant if we have aircraft carriers or not.
 
Carrier-based aircraft are hardened for the rigors of carrier launches/landings. Why do we need an aircraft like that? More cost for little operational gain.

Need probe/drogue AAR capability and a hook? Ask Lockmart. Israel heavily modified their F-35 models and are starting to get the first ones now. A hook and a probe where the parts already exist on a variant seem easy.
 
PuckChaser said:
Carrier-based aircraft are hardened for the rigors of carrier launches/landings. Why do we need an aircraft like that? More cost for little operational gain.

Need probe/drogue AAR capability and a hook? Ask Lockmart. Israel heavily modified their F-35 models and are starting to get the first ones now. A hook and a probe where the parts already exist on a variant seem easy.

True, carrier based aircraft are hardened for life on a carrier but can also be used off of one based on the variant. The F35C, for example, is designed to be flown off of a carrier. To be honest, I have come around to the F35 and think it's the best option available for Canada as it would allow us, with limited resources, to have more operational impact and "punch above our weight". The F35 has all kinds of advantages over the SH, but the fact that the SH is a naval aircraft is not one of them.
 
Journeyman said:
The questionnaire sent out to the five companies included a specific series of Industrial Benefit questions (7 specific sub-topics); it's not remotely being ignored.

I didn't mean that it is being ignored at the Government level (they would never ignore industrial benefits), but it is rarely being discussed on this site.  Apologies if that wasn't clear in my previous post.

Harrigan
 
jmt18325 said:
6 - 7 tankers would mean that you'd have 2 available all the time (sometimes more, but fleet logistics generally means you need a 3 to 1 and sometimes a 4 to 1 ratio), while still having one available to send elsewhere to contribute.

Serious questions. 

1.  are you in the military?
2.  if so, are you in the air force?
 
Eye In The Sky said:
Serious questions. 

1.  are you in the military?
2.  if so, are you in the air force?

Do I need to be in the air force to participate in a discussion forum?  Is everyone that comments here in the air force?  Does being in the air force necessarily mean that you'd know anything about fleet logistics?  Does being outside the air force mean that you don't know anything about fleet logistics?

 
Don't get your knickers in a knot and go all  :tempertantrum: over a simple question.

It answers the question of HANDS ON EXPERIENCE vice "theories and good ideas looking from the outside in".  Pilots and ACSOs, AERE Officers, etc have a better understanding of the things you are talking about, as do the flying NCM trades.  Based on experience.  I find most people who answer that question the way you did have zero experience...and don't want to say it.  I'll take your posts with that level of credibility, as establishing experience levels is a retarded request apparently. 
 
JMT:

Check my profile and ask yourself how I have survived as long as I have on this site.  And that is including a number of dust-ups with EITS and a bunch of others.  I was never anything more than a weekend warrior and an interested civilian observer.

I asked a bunch of stupid questions and have offered a bunch of stupid suggestions. 

But I enjoy the learning experience.
 
Chris Pook said:
Check my profile and ask yourself how I have survived as long as I have on this site.  And that is including a number of dust-ups with EITS and a bunch of others.  I was never anything more than a weekend warrior and an interested civilian observer.

And I've never claimed to be anything else.  I can only get information the same way that you can - from online or print sources, or from things that people tell me.  I don't generally feel though that, for example, a police officer is best place to decide on things like police tactics or what equipment is necessary. 

That's not meant to insult anyone.  It's simply a recognition that we're all people posting on an internet forum. 

In this particular case, I do know that if you want to have 1 of something available all the time (99% of the time, anyway) you need 3 of them.  I also know that Australia, with a not much larger fighter force, feels they need 9 of them.  They have a similar sized area of operation (actually smaller).  In this case, I have to wonder why there is such a discrepancy.
 
Eye In The Sky said:
Don't get your knickers in a knot and go all  :tempertantrum: over a simple question.

The question is irrelevant.  The answer though, is no, and I've never made the a secret. 
 
jmt18325 said:
In this particular case, I do know that if you want to have 1 of something available all the time (99% of the time, anyway) you need 3 of them.  I also know that Australia, with a not much larger fighter force, feels they need 9 of them.  They have a similar sized area of operation (actually smaller).  In this case, I have to wonder why there is such a discrepancy.

"know" ?  ???

So you know the availability, serviceability and dispatch rates for RCAF AAR assets? Interesting.
 
Good2Golf said:
"know" ?  ???

So you know the availability, serviceability and dispatch rates for RCAF AAR assets? Interesting.

That's a general rule for any platform of anything.  It's always going to vary, of course, but as a general rule, to have one of something available 99% of the time, you need to have three of them.

For example, many people lament that we're only getting 2 JSS platforms.  That means a general 70% availability, rather than a 99% continuous ability.
 
jmt18325 said:
That's a general rule for any platform of anything.  It's always going to vary, of course, but as a general rule, to have one of something available 99% of the time, you need to have three of them.

For example, many people lament that we're only getting 2 JSS platforms.  That means a general 70% availability, rather than a 99% continuous ability.

So airlines have three times more planes than fly every day to support their 99%+ dispatch rate?  ???
 
jmt18325 said:
... I don't generally feel though that, for example, a police officer is best place to decide on things like police tactics or what equipment is necessary. 
...

I hope you can clarify your thinking on that one - because, frankly, unless you have considerable undeclared medical expertise, I would not be wanting you to be equipping any operating theatre I might have occasion to visit.
 
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