The Canadian Peacekeeping Myth (Merged Topics)

[Halifax Tar]

Good Lord....it can't possibility be any longer than you guys did for Afghanistan....that was ridiculous.......

9 Months holding down a picnic table in Meaford, Pet and California

 

[TangoTwoBravo]

Wait until a person gets some TI with the UN.  Then and only then I fear they will develop a healthy case of skepticism.

I recently served for a year on a UN mission. The first half was in the field and the second half was in the force HQ. There are always issues serving in a multinational environment and a UN mission can have some particular challenges, but this was also true for my two missions to Afghanistan. I would willingly serve under a blue baseball hat or blue helmet again.

 

[jollyjacktar]

I recently served for a year on a UN mission. The first half was in the field and the second half was in the force HQ. There are always issues serving in a multinational environment and a UN mission can have some particular challenges, but this was also true for my two missions to Afghanistan. I would willingly serve under a blue baseball hat or blue helmet again.

Experiences differ, of course.  I know of others who share your views and others still that are more along the lines of the dissenters presented here. 

My point was more directed at the cheerleader who has no operational experiences to base his viewpoints upon the completion of any operational TI they might acquired one day.  Nothing like a taste of the real thing to give one some proper perspective on the reality of it all. 

After all, everyone has a pre-conceived conception of what sex is about and like.  I know for me personally, the real deal was not exactly what I was envisioning before I was well and truly fucked.

 

[Altair]

Experiences differ, of course.  I know of others who share your views and others still that are more along the lines of the dissenters presented here. 

My point was more directed at the cheerleader who has no operational experiences to base his viewpoints upon the completion of any operational TI they might acquired one day.  Nothing like a taste of the real thing to give one some proper perspective on the reality of it all. 

After all, everyone has a pre-conceived conception of what sex is about and like.  I know for me personally, the real deal was not exactly what I was envisioning before I was well and truly ****ed.

Ah yes.

My opinion counts for nothing until I have some operational experience but I get flak for wanting to go on a mission that would grant me said operational experience.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch-22_(logic)

 

[jollyjacktar]

Ah yes.

My opinion counts for nothing until I have some operational experience but I get flak for wanting to go on a mission that would grant me said operational experience.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch-22_(logic)

Your opinion is yours to do with as you wish. 

As with any opinion, the originator shouldn't expect blanket acceptance across the board, just because they have an opinion.  After all, opinions are a dime a dozen, everyone has them.  And some have more weight than others, especially those that have experience to back them up.  Take it as you will as that's my opinion.

 

[Bird_Gunner45]

Experiences differ, of course.  I know of others who share your views and others still that are more along the lines of the dissenters presented here. 

My point was more directed at the cheerleader who has no operational experiences to base his viewpoints upon the completion of any operational TI they might acquired one day.  Nothing like a taste of the real thing to give one some proper perspective on the reality of it all. 

After all, everyone has a pre-conceived conception of what sex is about and like.  I know for me personally, the real deal was not exactly what I was envisioning before I was well and truly ****ed.

That said, perhaps there's validity in the following quote, which is featured on this site:

“Frederick the Great’s horse was on seven separate campaigns with him. In the end he was still a dumb horse.”
– Unknown (on experience in military decision-making)

Experience is great, but experiences from 20-ish years ago may not be applicable today just as they weren't for the French and British in 1940. The UN had a rough go in the 1990s especially, but some/much of that can be viewed as an inability to adapt to the changing situation on the ground after the fall of the USSR. Part of this failure was the deployment of armies designed to fight the Soviets into complex civil wars with roots going back thousands of years and a maintenance of the "split the two sides" mentality in a non-permissive environment.

That's why I choose to remain cautiously optimistic about a mission. The recent actions of the Liberals in parliament and their seeming to not have known that Pearsonian peacekeeping was over (if it ever really began) certainly don't give me warm and fuzzies, but I'm not going to trash a mission before there are any details based on experiences from the early to mid 1990's. It's akin to the French building the Maginot Line because of their experiences in WW1 only to find out that the situation had changed.

 

[Altair]

If I expected blanket acceptance of my opinions I would have stopped posting here years ago out of frustration.

People disagreeing with me because they think I'm wrong or have evidence contrary to what I said, fine.

It's statements like

My point was more directed at the cheerleader who has no operational experiences to base his viewpoints upon the completion of any operational TI they might acquired one day. 

that get to me.

 

[Altair]

That said, perhaps there's validity in the following quote, which is featured on this site:

“Frederick the Great’s horse was on seven separate campaigns with him. In the end he was still a dumb horse.”
– Unknown (on experience in military decision-making)

Experience is great, but experiences from 20-ish years ago may not be applicable today just as they weren't for the French and British in 1940. The UN had a rough go in the 1990s especially, but some/much of that can be viewed as an inability to adapt to the changing situation on the ground after the fall of the USSR. Part of this failure was the deployment of armies designed to fight the Soviets into complex civil wars with roots going back thousands of years and a maintenance of the "split the two sides" mentality in a non-permissive environment.

That's why I choose to remain cautiously optimistic about a mission. The recent actions of the Liberals in parliament and their seeming to not have known that Pearsonian peacekeeping was over (if it ever really began) certainly don't give me warm and fuzzies, but I'm not going to trash a mission before there are any details based on experiences from the early to mid 1990's. It's akin to the French building the Maginot Line because of their experiences in WW1 only to find out that the situation had changed.

:goodpost:

 

[jollyjacktar]

If I expected blanket acceptance of my opinions I would have stopped posting here years ago out of frustration.

People disagreeing with me because they think I'm wrong or have evidence contrary to what I said, fine.

It's statements like that get to me.

As you've self identified, fine.  I stand by my statement that you won't be able to fully develop an opinion until after you have some experience to base it on, which would be the same for anyone in a similar position.  You don't need to accept my opinion and that is your right.  It's still my opinion.

 

[the 48th regulator]

As you've self identified, fine.  I stand by my statement that you won't be able to fully develop an opinion until after you have some experience to base it on, which would be the same for anyone in a similar position.  You don't need to accept my opinion and that is your right.  It's still my opinion.

That post made my head hurt.

 

[Altair]

As you've self identified, fine.  I stand by my statement that you won't be able to fully develop an opinion until after you have some experience to base it on, which would be the same for anyone in a similar position.  You don't need to accept my opinion and that is your right.  It's still my opinion.

Well, I'll cheerlead for going on a UN mission so I can have some experience to base UN missions on.

 

[jollyjacktar]

Well, I'll cheerlead for going on a UN mission so I can have some experience to base UN missions on.

There you go.  I do hope you get what you wish and that there's no buyers regret once you do.

 

[George Wallace]

Experience is great, but experiences from 20-ish years ago may not be applicable today just as they weren't for the French and British in 1940. The UN had a rough go in the 1990s especially, but some/much of that can be viewed as an inability to adapt to the changing situation on the ground after the fall of the USSR. Part of this failure was the deployment of armies designed to fight the Soviets into complex civil wars with roots going back thousands of years and a maintenance of the "split the two sides" mentality in a non-permissive environment.

Just because we have not actually partaken in any UN deployments, on a large scale, for the past "20-ish years" does not mean that we have been far removed from UN activities.  We still have UN Peacekeepers deployed around the globe.  We are quite capable of observing how other UN operations, that we are not involved in, are performing.  So, I would say that your comment is a bit of a red herring.  We can observe how little the UN's handling of these "Peacekeeping deployments" have changed.  There is no requirement to allude to our attitude as being that of the French and the Maginot Line or any other comparison.  We have not been BLIND to UN operations for the past two or three decades.  We know quite well how they have been performing.

 

[Altair]

Just because we have not actually partaken in any UN deployments, on a large scale, for the past "20-ish years" does not mean that we have been far removed from UN activities.  We still have UN Peacekeepers deployed around the globe.  We are quite capable of observing how other UN operations, that we are not involved in, are performing.  So, I would say that your comment is a bit of a red herring.  We can observe how little the UN's handling of these "Peacekeeping deployments" have changed.  There is no requirement to allude to our attitude as being that of the French and the Maginot Line or any other comparison.  We have not been BLIND to UN operations for the past two or three decades.  We know quite well how they have been performing.

I recently served for a year on a UN mission. The first half was in the field and the second half was in the force HQ. There are always issues serving in a multinational environment and a UN mission can have some particular challenges, but this was also true for my two missions to Afghanistan. I would willingly serve under a blue baseball hat or blue helmet again.

From a guy who's been there because I clearly have not.

 

[Jarnhamar]

Well, I'll cheerlead for going on a UN mission so I can have some experience to base UN missions on.

Until you're pulled off tour and replaced because of a gender policy highlighting the need for more females to be seen as peacekeepers.

 

[jollyjacktar]

Until you're pulled off tour and replaced because of a gender policy highlighting the need for more females to be seen as peacekeepers.

:rofl:

 

[Altair]

Until you're pulled off tour and replaced because of a gender policy highlighting the need for more females to be seen as peacekeepers.

They need minorities there so I'll probably be alright.

 

[George Wallace]

From a guy who's been there because I clearly have not.

???

Clearly you missed the essence of the post.  WE HAVE NOT BEEN TOTALLY IGNORANT OF HOW THE UN OPERATES ITS PEACEKEEPING OPERATIONS OVER THE PASS TWO OR THREE DECADES IN WHICH WE HAVE NOT CONTRIBUTED LARGE CONTINGENTS.  WE ARE VERY COGNIZANT OF HOW THE UN OPERATES.

 

[Altair]

???

Clearly you missed the essence of the post.  WE HAVE NOT BEEN TOTALLY IGNORANT OF HOW THE UN OPERATES ITS PEACEKEEPING OPERATIONS OVER THE PASS TWO OR THREE DECADES IN WHICH WE HAVE NOT CONTRIBUTED LARGE CONTINGENTS.  WE ARE VERY COGNIZANT OF HOW THE UN OPERATES.

Thank you, the cap lock helped me to understand.

I get you now.

 

[Jarnhamar]

They need minorities there so I'll probably be alright.

I think it's more of a want than a need but yea that might keep you in the running! Hope so.  If you dodge the gender bullet I'll hook you up with some sweet kit.


also..

the word “minority” is offensive and degrading to the people it represents, regardless of race because the word is originally a math term meaning “the smaller part or number; a number, part, or amount forming less than half of the whole.”

Just kidding (well not really, it's apparently a thing)