TASER OPINIONS?

[zipperhead_cop]

How about the new 12gauge Taser..probless rubber bullet with an extra How ya doing.

(I'll try add pic here)..Can't so here is link.
Go to See armoury (big box), picture number 7
http://dsc.discovery.com/tv/future-weapons/weapons/zone3/slideshow/slideshow.html

Would switching to a probless taser be better or worse?
You get to hear the Shotgun go boom, the bad guy/gal falls to the ground doing a funky chicken in-front of a camera. What would public "outcry" be then? Would there be less Medical complications?

That would be an interesting device to try out.  However, for us a shotgun is usually a support weapon and isn't usually carried into a situation unless it is a firearms call.  So if it is a firearms call, you would want to be loaded up with your good ole slug ammo. 
Lets just get people over the Taser, and I think that will be sufficient. 

 

[Old Ranger]

Maybe down the road they'll be able to make 9mm or 40cal version.
Simple mag change and every officer can have one. >
Less room on your belt.

 

[gate_guard]

Unfortunately the taser shotgun shells are approx $100 each...not exactly cost efficient when compared against other less lethal options.

Old Ranger, I like your sentiment but I cringe at the thought of carrying a mag of "less lethal rounds" (technological issues aside) on my duty belt. In high stress/adrenaline situations, the last thing you want to be doing is messing around with clearing your duty pistol in order to load a less lethal magazine. As well, what happens if the guy who previously presented an active resistant/assaultive threat pulls a knife/gun and you suddenly need lethal force. Too many variables there for my liking.

 

[Old Ranger]

Gate Guard - seen.

Unless 1st or 2nd round is the Taser...but still probably not good for those double tappers.
And I guess you wouldn't get the visual threat tactic of the Taser.

12 ga. would seem like the best option for cycling out of the way for the now I really mean it round.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

Interesting developments in NS.S\
Shared with usual disclaimers

N.S. needs clearer standards for Taser use: report
Updated Wed. Mar. 5 2008 11:05 AM ET

The Canadian Press

HALIFAX -- A review into police use of Tasers in Nova Scotia says the amount of officer training "differs significantly'' between police departments and suggests the province establish standard qualifications for those using the devices.

The report, released Wednesday, also says that police use of the devices has shot up 80 per cent in the past three years -- from 101 to 182 incidents last year.

Provincial Justice Minister Cecil Clarke called for the review in November following the death of a 45-year-old Dartmouth man about 30 hours after he was Tasered by Halifax police.

Howard Hyde, a man who suffered from paranoid schizophrenia, was arrested for spousal abuse. He had struggled with jail guards moments before his death in a Dartmouth jail.

Hyde's case was one in a series of Taser-related incidents that prompted concern over police use of stun guns.

Nova Scotia's review is one of several across Canada ordered following the death of Robert Dziekanski, the Polish man who died after he was Tasered by RCMP officers at Vancouver International Airport on Oct. 14.

Reviews have also been ordered in British Columbia, New Brunswick, Newfoundland and Labrador, and nationally by the Canadian Association of Chiefs of Police and the Canadian Police Research Centre.

The Nova Scotia review concluded there were wide variations in the Taser policies adopted by various police forces and correctional institutions.

Some police forces require notification of a supervisor before Tasers are fired, while others do not.
The RCMP manual is the only one that sets up special procedures when the person is in excited delirium, a state of heart-pounding agitation.
Some forces caution against using the device more than once, while others contain no reference to the topic.
But the report repeatedly zeros in on training.

"The amount of training differs significantly among law enforcement agencies: municipal police officers and Sheriff Services receive eight hours of training in order to qualify...while the RCMP and Correctional Services staff receive 16 hours of training.''

In recent months, Nova Scotia's Opposition New Democrats have been pushing Clarke to get tough on what they see as excessive use of the devices.

But the minister has said he won't be rushed into any decisions.

The second part of the review will see a panel of external experts, including representatives from law enforcement and scientific communities, examining the findings and providing advice to the minister.

The justice minister has said the review would also consider a February 2007 incident in which Halifax police shocked a 17-year-old while trying to arrest the teen in her bedroom.

Three officers went to the girl's Dartmouth home after her mother asked her to leave following a dispute.

Police tried to arrest the teen after she started swearing at them. She fought back, was wrestled her to the bed, Tasered, then handcuffed.

Two of the officers were kicked in the face while trying to arrest the girl, who was later acquitted of assault.

Police maintained that proper procedures were followed, but a judge ruled the officers had no legal grounds to arrest the girl.

 

[MedTechStudent]

When I was in Truro Nova Scotia last week I was talking to to police officers about this actually.  And I agree with what they said.

According to them, before this incident, there were people being given the taser hundreds of times a day in Canada, and that it is a very effective way to detaining someone.  Now with all this publicity, it has become harder for them to do their job.  Also, people don't die from the taser, they die from the over exited state their heart goes into while being shocked .  They begin to panic and their heart goes into over load and they have fatal heart attacks.  Most of the people who die from tasers are out of shape, have poor hearts or other medical conditions.  The guns themselves have cameras and mics built in so that ever time its drawn there is a record of it.  Every time its shot there is evidence why and to what means.  I mean the whole notion of taking the weapon away is ridiculous.  They are needed to subdue dangerous people, even if they are misused every once in a while, they are still needed.  The police officer I spoke to, tole me she had tased a man about 300 pounds and it had brought him to his knees, she said without that gun  he would have overpowered and possibly killed her. 

I don't think the question should be "Should they take the taser away as a weapon"... it should be more of a "On what grounds should it be used" type of debate.

 

[medaid]

MTS,

What you have said are points that have been raised by the members of the thread already. There are also already "when should they be used" rules, and they are called UoF continuems.

 

[MedTechStudent]

MTS,

What you have said are points that have been raised by the members of the thread already. There are also already "when should they be used" rules, and they are called UoF continuems.

Oh yes absolutely, I just noticed the thread about Nova Scotia above, and was reciting what the police officers there I talked to had to say about it.  Those two at least seamed pretty bitter about the situation.

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

In the Halifax paper yesterday. More reporting on tasers. Shared with usual disclaimers

Taser info blocked by privacy laws
RCMP spokesman says all that can be released has been
By The Canadian Press
Thu. Mar 27 - 5:42 AM

OTTAWA — The RCMP fended off increasing attacks Wednesday, blaming federal information and privacy laws for its move to strip public Taser reports of crucial details.

Sgt. Sylvie Tremblay says the Mounties released "all the information that could be provided" under the Access to Information Act when it disclosed newly reclassified and heavily censored records last week.

"The RCMP is committed to respecting the public’s right to know while upholding the law and protecting the privacy rights of individuals," Tremblay said in an interview.

"Requesters may challenge the RCMP’s application of various exemptions . . . should they be dissatisfied with the processing of their request."

Critics say that’s a lame excuse for shielding details — including whether zapped suspects were armed or injured — that were once routinely disclosed.

A joint investigation by The Canadian Press and CBC found the Mounties are now censoring key elements that must be recorded each time officers draw their electronic weapons.

As a result, Canadians know much less about who is being hit with the contentious 50,000-volt guns and under what circumstances.

Advocates of more openness point out the names and addresses of Tasered people are already struck from the forms, making further deletions unnecessary.

"The leadership of the RCMP appears to have a tin ear for what the public wants in relation to Taser use," says Frank Addario, president of the Criminal Lawyers’ Association.

"It seems obvious that the public wants transparency in relation to the training and circumstances in which this . . . device is used, limitations on its use after any apparent threat to public or officer safety is managed and, above all, thorough training of police officers in advance of using these devices."

Another RCMP spokesman, Troy Lightfoot, has said internal analysis of Taser reports concluded the weapons were being used correctly.

Newspaper editorials and opposition critics and newspaper editorials say that amounts to a "just-trust-us" approach.

The Mounties say they correctly withheld information on the forms under provisions of the information law related to personal privacy and police investigations.

Tremblay had no comment when asked if the RCMP broke the law by previously releasing details that it now insists must be protected.

A Canadian Press analysis last November of 563 cases between 2002 and 2005 found three in four suspects Tasered by the RCMP were unarmed.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

A Canadian Press analysis last November of 563 cases between 2002 and 2005 found three in four suspects Tasered by the RCMP were unarmed.

Yea, cause if they were armed they would hopefully be shot instead............deadly force begots deadly response,  etc......

 

[J.J]

Bruce,
Stop using common sense, it will get you in trouble.... You should know that by now!  ;D

 

[midgetcop]

If it was between me and an armed suspect.....you'd better BELIEVE I wouldn't reach for that taser.  :

 

[zipperhead_cop]

Bottom line is hippies like to see enforcers get hurt.  They would like to see police use tactics that would put Members into harms way just the same way that they want to see soldiers fail in Afghanistan and be removed in defeat.  Some people cannot handle the fact that force needs to be used against people from time to time, and those people sometimes get hurt (with reference to Chris Rock's helpful instructions on police relations). 
Those same people invariably get air time on TV. 
They also have rubber sheets.

 

[ENGINEERS WIFE]

I have a question, this thread is very long, so if it's been answered, forgive me.  When the person with the taser is actually tasing does the 'shock' stay on all the time or does it go in bursts?  So, what I'm asking is can someone be tased constantly for 10 mins or the taser more like a electric fence and 'shocks' intermittently?  And is there standard training and are all the tasers at the same standard? Compared to a deadly use of force I think they are a great idea, but just like everything in the wrong, untrained hands what could be the consequences?

 

[medaid]

TASERS only shocks when the trigger is depressed or activated. There's guidelines which states how long the trigger is depressed in different situations which I will not get into. There will very likely never be a situation where a TASER is continously shocking for 10min. Once the trigger is no longer depressed the shock is turned off and no energy is being transmited between the TASER and the subject in question. There is now a National UoF standard that applies to all LE UoF tools to which the TASER is a member of.

No untrained pers will be issued or equiped with a TASER or any UoF tools. If you do not qualify, you don't get to use it. In many cases and many agencies, it also means you sit in an office and NEVER go on the road if you fail any one of your UoF tool competencies.

The result of misuse of force could be Criminal or Civil or Both proceedings, departmental disciplinary action which would cover many different things.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

The shock is on for only 5 seconds at a time, regardless of how long you hold the trigger down.  You can let the trigger go, and pull it again, but you will only get another 5 second exposure.  The machine records the exposures, so you need to be able to justify why you gave a guy 15 doses.
If someone got a 10 minute dose, they would probably be dead.  But that could not happen.  There may be times when a person has the taser barbs with wires attached in them for an extended period of time (only medical personnel can remove barbs from sensitive areas, such as the face or genitals) but the current would not be flowing the whole time. 

 

[ENGINEERS WIFE]

Thanks for answering my questions.  I think it is great that police officers are able to use such things as tasers instead of deadly force.  And at the end of the day, make it back safe to their families.  And hopefully the bad guys, in jail after being tased and not shot. 
Thank you.

 

[Old Ranger]

And for the record, I would much rather be tazed than sprayed... :-*


And would prefer that if I have to take such a person requiring either, tazing doesn't put my Ambulance out of service for uniform changes and super deep cleans so as not to affect any other patients.

 

[zipperhead_cop]

And for the record, I would much rather be tazed than sprayed... :-*

That is pretty much the universal opinion for those who have gotten both.

 

[medaid]

Oh come on OC's not THAT bad... It's tasety on steak