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Red/ Green/ White Poppies- Does The Colour Matter?- Merged

It is disappointing to see that our education system has been so lacking for so long.  Steven Staples of the Rideau Institute is not a young pup, so it is an indication how long we have been seeing the degradation of the education system in Canada.  For the University of Ottawa students to now actively promote this, demonstrates the successes of our Veterans to preserve our way of life and freedom, allowing ignorant voices to be heard.  Yes, it is a slap in the face of those who have made the sacrifices to preserve those freedoms and a shame that such 'educated' people can not comprehend the significance and meaning of the Red Poppy. 

I find it amusing that this movement, Rideau Institute and the U of O students, have chosen the White Poppy.  Their colour may vary from plant to plant, but traditionally, opium poppies are white.  That speaks volumes to me. 




I wonder what they have been smoking?  >:D
 
The National Post's Matt Gurney takes issue with the protestors' flawed logic that the red poppies "symbolize war" while the white ones supposedly symbolize peace.

Gurney hits the nail with his rebuff of their flawed logic.  :salute:

National Post

Matt Gurney: Protesters need to learn history; the poppy is already a symbol of peace

(...)

The red poppy is inherently a symbol of peace. Not just of peace as a concept — pleasant a concept as it is — but as the hard-won peace that hundreds of thousands of Canadians, and our allies, earned at such great cost. The poppy is not a symbol of our victory — a national flag or a military battle ensign or guidon would serve more than ably in that role. Poppies are not a symbol of military conquest and national glory; indeed, they are not a symbol of any nation at all.

Though no Canadian should need to be reminded, it is worth ever so briefly recapping why the poppy was chosen as the symbol of remembrance. As is so memorably told in John McCrae’s In Flanders Fields, the poppies were the Belgian wildflower that went forth and multiplied so prodigiously in the blood-soaked, artillery churned soil of First World War battlefields. They added a rare splash of colour, and life, in the blasted landscapes of that brutal conflict. And the poppies bloomed over the shattered bodies and among the trenches of the Allies and our enemies alike.

There can be no better symbol of peace than that. The very existence of a white poppy campaign, ostensibly to promote peace, is insulting by its implication that the red poppy glorifies war. No one who saw the poppies blooming in the blood of 1915, or has walked the silent rows of white headstones in the Commonwealth war cemeteries that are still carefully tended throughout Europe, sees any glory there.

War is, as the cliché tells us, hell. In modern times, we Westerners have been spared the full horrors of total global conflict. But there are still Canadians today who remember the Second World War, even fought in it. There are also thousands of Canadians with us today who served in Afghanistan, and countless Canadians who loved or knew someone who went to that far-off land and never returned. There are the Canadians who died in peacetime, in accidents at home and abroad, while standing guard in Western Europe across from the might of the Soviet Red Army, or while doing their best to bring peace to war-torn lands abroad. And, of course, there are all those that these peace-time casualties left behind.

I wonder how much they feel Celyn Dufay has to teach them about sacrifice and the glorification of war.

Personally, I see no problem with Canadians taking pride in what our country has accomplished on the battlefield. War is hell, but just wars are sometimes necessary. The brutal reality is this — if guys like my grandfather hadn’t flown bombers against German cities during the flower of their youth, guys like my brother-in-law’s grandfather would never have gotten out of Auschwitz alive. There is evil in the world, and some problems that can only be solved through the controlled application of violence. That is a tragic fact, but less tragic than what happens when the good guys decide they’re too kind-hearted to fight the bad ones, or fail to prepare for the possibility of war and are unable to raise an army in time.

But that’s not glorifying war. It’s acknowledging what others have done on our behalf, at great (sometimes ultimate) personal sacrifice. War should not be glorified, but it should be remembered, so that the peace we’re lucky enough to enjoy today can be fully appreciated. The poppy is how we do that — and I’m wearing my red one with pride.

 
I haven't seen one yet. What I have seen is a load of the local students wearing the red poppy, more than I can recall from ever before.

I think it's important to remember that not all students fall into the same category (whatever you wish to name it: stupid, attention gathering, misinformed, etc) as the few who are actively doing this.

I am shocked that Staples, et al. could miss such simple distinctions in their whining bunch of self serving bullshit. Credibility: fail. Any student that does any amount of research would have a field day debunking their statements.



 
Scott said:
I am shocked that Staples, et al. could miss such simple distinctions in their whining bunch of self serving bullshit.

....only in a Captain Renault sort of way.....

rains-300x225.jpg
    :boring:
 
Oh, well..it's their right, I guess. We don't have to like it, but drawing too much attention to them probably isn't a good idea either.

These people have been around forever (or at least, since 1933...). They are probably the same ones who were going round Kingston a couple of years ago defacing/removing "I Support The Troops" stickers.

To me, you wear a red poppy, period. What you wear it for, or what you think about when you're wearing it, are your business.
 
pbi said:
Oh, well..it's their right, I guess. We don't have to like it, but drawing too much attention to them probably isn't a good idea either.
Agreed.  That's why I laugh when the group promoting the idea whines about the concept being discussed (and disagreed with) in public - I guess they're learning media & public attention can be a two-edged sword.

Also, a mention from a Tory MP in the House of Commons yesterday:
Mr. Speaker, I call upon my colleagues in the Liberal Party and in the NDP to join with me in denouncing the ideological extremists who, this Remembrance Day, are defacing the poppy, and in doing so, disrespecting the courage, sacrifice and honour that generations of Canadian veterans have made for our freedom and for theirs.

    The so-called white poppy campaign is an outrage. It dishonours our veterans.

    I ask all parliamentarians to support my call to lay politics aside this Remembrance Day, leave the poppy in its glorious red and stand to remember the sacrifices of our veterans, and to not play crass political games this week and on November 11.
 
I tend to turn off when I see Staples' name connected to anything.....
 
Not that I agree with how they're promoting the idea of peace, but the idea of what they're promoting.  As are we all. 

From that standpoint, the one's whom we do remember might not necessarily be so pissed off at these Stapleites who are enjoying the freedom to be idiots, which was won and paid for at such a high cost by those we remember.  And after all, isn't that why we do what we do and they did before us for our fellow citizens? To stand up and guard the peace and freedoms for all perhaps at the cost of our lives.

pbi - I have Staples on permenant ignore in my head.  He's a tool in my opinon.
 
jollyjacktar said:
...the idea of what they're promoting. 

But what they're promoting isn't peace, they're promoting the position that the red poppy, those who wear it and the traditional acts of remembrance are all glorifying war... hence the need for their innovative, new and improved white poppy.
 
I couldn't care less what colour the center of the RED poppy is. What really angers me is this whole white poppy thing. These cowards need to give their heads a shake.

I suppose those that fought did so to secure freedom of speech for these freaks and generations to come. It just seems like a sharp blade has been driven squarely between the shoulder blades of our Honoured Vets.

Would it be such a bad thing to pull those white poppies off and stomp on them?
 
I certainly don't disagree with promoting peace however in this situation it just seems to me that the way it's being done is in bad taste. There are 364 other days in the year that they could promote this and wear a white poppy or any other symbol they choose. The fact that they chose a poppy and to do it on Remembrance Day in an effort to bring attention to their cause by piggy backing on to such a day of significance for so many shows a lack of judgement and respect IMO.
 
AirDet said:
I couldn't care less what colour the center of the RED poppy is. What really angers me is this whole white poppy thing. These cowards need to give their heads a shake.

I suppose those that fought did so to secure freedom of speech for these freaks and generations to come. It just seems like a sharp blade has been driven squarely between the shoulder blades of our Honoured Vets.

Would it be such a bad thing to pull those white poppies off and stomp on them?

We all are of the same convictions.  It is an insult to the Vets and those that serve, but a Right that our service has guaranteed them.  I think that if you seriously were to start to pull white poppies off these 'confused' twits, you would find that there would be a 'Barrack room Lawyer' in that crowd just waiting to charge you with "ASSAULT".

Perhaps it would be better to educate them that:

1.  White has been associated with COWARDICE (ie. the White Feathers of bygone days.);

2.  White has been associated with "SURRENDER"; and

3.  White Poppies have been associated with the OPIUM TRADE.

>:D  Would that mean that they would rather be cowering in an Opium den than looking forward towards the future? 




Oh well, the miscreants will make fools of themselves and it will be over with for another year.

Making its rounds on FB:

 
George Wallace said:
We all are of the same convictions.  It is an insult to the Vets and those that serve, but a Right that our service has guaranteed them.  I think that if you seriously were to start to pull white poppies off these 'confused' twits, you would find that there would be a 'Barrack room Lawyer' in that crowd just waiting to charge you with "ASSAULT".

Perhaps it would be better to educate them that:

1.  White has been associated with COWARDICE (ie. the White Feathers of bygone days.);

2.  White has been associated with "SURRENDER"; and j

3.  White Poppies have been associated with the OPIUM TRADE.

>:D  Would that mean that they would rather be cowering in an Opium den than looking forward towards the future? 


Oh well, the miscreants will make fools of themselves and it will be over with for another year.

Making its rounds on FB:

That and if we go pulling off their white poppies and filling them in then we'll be playing right into their stereotype of us that we're all mindless warmongering thugs.
 
X_para76 said:
That and if we go pulling off their white poppies and filling them in then we'll be playing right into their stereotype of us that we're all mindless warmongering thugs.
:nod:

Also, something to help maintain a bit of perspective:
.... One report I read said perhaps 11,000 people wear white poppies at this time of year in Canada. The red poppy, meanwhile, is worn by an estimated 18 million.
 
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