Put Leopards in Afghanistan stuff HERE
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A bit more info, shared in accordance with the "fair dealing" provisions, Section 29, of the Copyright Act.
Canada to lease 20 modern tanks from Germany for Afghan mission
Leopard A6M equipped with much-needed air conditioning
CanWest News Service, Ottawa Citizen, 4 Apr 07
Article link
The Canadian government is proceeding with the lease of 20 of some of the most modern Leopard tanks on the market as it boosts its equipment stocks in Afghanistan.
Defence sources told the Citizen that Canada will lease the 20 Leopard A6M tanks from Germany. The tanks, which have improved protection against landmines and other enemy weapons, could be shipped to Afghanistan direct from Germany, sources said.
Krauss-Maffei, the original German manufacturer of the Leopard tanks, also has a maintenance team in Kandahar working on other equipment for multinational forces there so there would be a built-in support system for the tanks, sources said. In addition, the new Leopards are outfitted with an air conditioning system so they could operate in Afghanistan's stifling summer heat.
Canada's older Leopard tanks now in Kandahar do not have air conditioning and there have been concerns the heat would limit their usefulness on the battlefield. Temperatures inside the vehicles would soar beyond 60C.
The lease was approved last week by the cabinet priorities and planning committee.
The Citizen first outlined the details of the tank lease arrangement in February when Canadian Forces officers started initial discussions with German officials in regards to the deal. The arrangement has now received Canadian government approval.
Defence Minister Gordon O'Connor wasn't releasing details about the Leopard tank lease yesterday. But he did say that the tanks were a necessity for the Afghan mission. "Our experience in Afghan has proven we need main battle tanks," he said. "It's really to offer security to our soldiers."
Mr. O'Connor suggested that the decrease in the number of Canadian casualties in the last six months was due to increased use of heavier armoured vehicles, including the tanks.
But Canadian Forces officials have acknowledged that the terrain in Afghanistan is also taking its toll on the military's vehicles. Army commander Lt.-Gen. Andrew Leslie said in Kandahar that some of the service's light armoured vehicles will have to be replaced because of the excessive wear and tear.
Mr. O'Connor explained that meant the vehicles will be sent back to Canada for repair and they will be replaced from the existing inventory. He said there is no need to buy new light armoured vehicles. The same thing will happen to the Nyala armoured vehicles that wear out over time, he added.
Lt.-Gen. Leslie said yesterday in Kandahar that the 17 Leopard tanks currently in use there are "at the end of their legs" and are in need of being replaced. In an address to troops earlier this week, Lt.-Gen. Leslie said Prime Minister Stephen Harper is considering the acquisition of new tanks and that there could be a decision on the matter within the coming days.
But when asked if the army will have to park the older Leopards altogether during the hottest parts of the Afghan summer, Lt.-Gen. Leslie said that's "an option which we'll have to consider."
"We are not going to lose soldiers because they overheat," Lt.-Gen. Leslie said. "We will have to restrict their operations," he added, saying the tank issue was the greatest concern raised by troops in his recent tour of the battlefield.
Lt.-Gen. Leslie said the interior of the Leopard tanks in use here can reach as high as 65 C during hot summer months.
Over the past year there has been a major about-turn in the Canadian military's view of the usefulness of tanks. The Leopards were originally scheduled to be destroyed or sold off, but the army put a halt to that program. It sent the Leopards to Afghanistan in the fall and began its search for newer tanks to purchase or lease.
Three years ago, however, Gen. Rick Hillier, then army commander, labelled the Leopards as a "millstone" around the neck of the service. Several months later, Gen. Hillier wrote an article for the Citizen criticizing retired officers who wanted to keep the Leopard tanks in the army's inventory. He called those officers "armchair strategists" who didn't understand the changing face of warfare.
But as they came to grips with the war in Afghanistan, senior military leaders changed their minds and turned to the tank to provide increased firepower and protection.
Yesterday, the second-in-command of Canada's tank squadron in Afghanistan agreed heat is a significant problem in the tanks -- explaining that because of the combination of air temperature, internal hydraulics and engine heat the tank compartments are already reaching temperatures of about 48 C.
"Having somebody work in above 50 to 60 C is a huge challenge," said Capt. Craig Volstad.
Canada's army has been trying to find solutions to make the tanks cooler -- testing options such as heat shields for the outside of the tanks or cooling vests for the troops to wear inside -- though Lt.-Gen. Leslie conceded yesterday that none of those are likely to bring the relief that is needed.
"We don't have a solution that's outside the scope of a newer more modern machine," he said, adding there are currently tanks available from other countries that could be in Afghanistan and ready for use by the summer.
Canada to lease 20 modern tanks from Germany for Afghan mission
Leopard A6M equipped with much-needed air conditioning
CanWest News Service, Ottawa Citizen, 4 Apr 07
Article link
The Canadian government is proceeding with the lease of 20 of some of the most modern Leopard tanks on the market as it boosts its equipment stocks in Afghanistan.
Defence sources told the Citizen that Canada will lease the 20 Leopard A6M tanks from Germany. The tanks, which have improved protection against landmines and other enemy weapons, could be shipped to Afghanistan direct from Germany, sources said.
Krauss-Maffei, the original German manufacturer of the Leopard tanks, also has a maintenance team in Kandahar working on other equipment for multinational forces there so there would be a built-in support system for the tanks, sources said. In addition, the new Leopards are outfitted with an air conditioning system so they could operate in Afghanistan's stifling summer heat.
Canada's older Leopard tanks now in Kandahar do not have air conditioning and there have been concerns the heat would limit their usefulness on the battlefield. Temperatures inside the vehicles would soar beyond 60C.
The lease was approved last week by the cabinet priorities and planning committee.
The Citizen first outlined the details of the tank lease arrangement in February when Canadian Forces officers started initial discussions with German officials in regards to the deal. The arrangement has now received Canadian government approval.
Defence Minister Gordon O'Connor wasn't releasing details about the Leopard tank lease yesterday. But he did say that the tanks were a necessity for the Afghan mission. "Our experience in Afghan has proven we need main battle tanks," he said. "It's really to offer security to our soldiers."
Mr. O'Connor suggested that the decrease in the number of Canadian casualties in the last six months was due to increased use of heavier armoured vehicles, including the tanks.
But Canadian Forces officials have acknowledged that the terrain in Afghanistan is also taking its toll on the military's vehicles. Army commander Lt.-Gen. Andrew Leslie said in Kandahar that some of the service's light armoured vehicles will have to be replaced because of the excessive wear and tear.
Mr. O'Connor explained that meant the vehicles will be sent back to Canada for repair and they will be replaced from the existing inventory. He said there is no need to buy new light armoured vehicles. The same thing will happen to the Nyala armoured vehicles that wear out over time, he added.
Lt.-Gen. Leslie said yesterday in Kandahar that the 17 Leopard tanks currently in use there are "at the end of their legs" and are in need of being replaced. In an address to troops earlier this week, Lt.-Gen. Leslie said Prime Minister Stephen Harper is considering the acquisition of new tanks and that there could be a decision on the matter within the coming days.
But when asked if the army will have to park the older Leopards altogether during the hottest parts of the Afghan summer, Lt.-Gen. Leslie said that's "an option which we'll have to consider."
"We are not going to lose soldiers because they overheat," Lt.-Gen. Leslie said. "We will have to restrict their operations," he added, saying the tank issue was the greatest concern raised by troops in his recent tour of the battlefield.
Lt.-Gen. Leslie said the interior of the Leopard tanks in use here can reach as high as 65 C during hot summer months.
Over the past year there has been a major about-turn in the Canadian military's view of the usefulness of tanks. The Leopards were originally scheduled to be destroyed or sold off, but the army put a halt to that program. It sent the Leopards to Afghanistan in the fall and began its search for newer tanks to purchase or lease.
Three years ago, however, Gen. Rick Hillier, then army commander, labelled the Leopards as a "millstone" around the neck of the service. Several months later, Gen. Hillier wrote an article for the Citizen criticizing retired officers who wanted to keep the Leopard tanks in the army's inventory. He called those officers "armchair strategists" who didn't understand the changing face of warfare.
But as they came to grips with the war in Afghanistan, senior military leaders changed their minds and turned to the tank to provide increased firepower and protection.
Yesterday, the second-in-command of Canada's tank squadron in Afghanistan agreed heat is a significant problem in the tanks -- explaining that because of the combination of air temperature, internal hydraulics and engine heat the tank compartments are already reaching temperatures of about 48 C.
"Having somebody work in above 50 to 60 C is a huge challenge," said Capt. Craig Volstad.
Canada's army has been trying to find solutions to make the tanks cooler -- testing options such as heat shields for the outside of the tanks or cooling vests for the troops to wear inside -- though Lt.-Gen. Leslie conceded yesterday that none of those are likely to bring the relief that is needed.
"We don't have a solution that's outside the scope of a newer more modern machine," he said, adding there are currently tanks available from other countries that could be in Afghanistan and ready for use by the summer.
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Lease for 20... good to go for a squadron. Not a bad start.
I am guessing that the ill informed media is talking about the Leo 2A6?
I hope that it would lead to the CF actually purchasing some more, esp now that we are on the verge of getting C-17. (Can a C-17 haul a Leo 2?) I would love to see a purchase of many more in the future. In my world, lets say between 100-120 to fit out one Armoured Regt and fill out the Armour school for the appropriate trainers.
I am guessing that the ill informed media is talking about the Leo 2A6?
I hope that it would lead to the CF actually purchasing some more, esp now that we are on the verge of getting C-17. (Can a C-17 haul a Leo 2?) I would love to see a purchase of many more in the future. In my world, lets say between 100-120 to fit out one Armoured Regt and fill out the Armour school for the appropriate trainers.
Colin Parkinson
Army.ca Myth
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Well if the CPC gets a majority in the next election you can be sure they will finish thedeal by getting at least 60. The cost of buying them is minamal and the cost of running them will be the same or perhaps less than running the current fleet, which is less capable. Shouldn't be a hard sell.
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St. Micheals Medical Team said:
Wait for the future announcement.Many people know what, where, who, when.Yet allow a bit more time for the word to get out through offical means.
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Yes a future announcement...maybe like tomorrow (friday) maybe not. 
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I was talking to one of the higher ups at the RC over here, and he says we hope to get around 200 Leo 2's withing 5 years. I hope it happens :threat:
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BushmasterBob said:
Really? Sorry but what do the older blokes think of this? It sounds really nice but theres not much chance of seeing 200 is there? Seeing as Hillier wrote the tank off only a few years ago a turn around like that is impossible. It'd be great if it were true but i'd be very, very sceptical of every seeing that number.
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Hillier already said it was a mistake trying to get rid of the tanks. The number of A4s there looking at getting is between 100-120 and the A6M will arrive in theater this summer sometime.
Colin Parkinson
Army.ca Myth
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I suspect that we could buy as many tanks as we want, the prices are great for the slightly older models, so it will be a case of how many we want and can justify. I hope they make a good argument for a larger fleet of 200.
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RecceByForce said:
Roto 3/07 should be in theatre for August (+/-) and roto 1/08 should be in theatre for February (+/-)
Unless the tankers of 3/07 are travelling to germany as we speak to take delivery of the 20 A6Ms and do their tank conversion training in place (germany), there is a fair chance that one of two things will happen....
- 3/07 tankers will arrive in theatre late (forcing the 1/07 tankers to go into overtime)
or
-1/08 tankers will take care of delivering the new kit......
Lots to do & not much time to do it in....
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
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geo said:
geo
The problem is not the "Tankers". They can have their courses and be over there in little time at all. The problem lies in the "Maintainers" being trained up to speed on the various Trades, and on the new equipment. It takes longer to train the Veh Techs, FCS Techs, Wpn Techs, etc. than it does to train the tank crews.
George Wallace
Army.ca Dinosaur
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RecceByForce said:
Really? He wrote a full page letter to the editor of the Ottawa Citizen explaining how the "Tank" was outdated and thing of the past and that the MGS was the wave of the future. I was really disappointed with him over that.
Oh well! Saw him on the news last night with the owner of the Senators at Scotiabank Place and he looked very tired. His job is not an easy one.
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Yes george your right the maintainers take 16weeks to train on the A6M our training on it will be 3 weeks.
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The speculation should sum up. A good 70% of what's being posted here is wrong, including by those who claim to be "in the know". Wait for the proper, official announcement - if and when it comes.
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George Wallace said:
My impression was that he was making the best of the situation. Under the Liberals he couldn't sell them on a new MBT so he went for what he could get and then developed a strategy to adapt to the new position. Hillier is a tanker. He was a squadron commander in Germany driving the Leo so I can't see him giving up on tanks if he could have got them. Now that the political climate is right I imagine he is thrilled. My .02 cents
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Teddy Ruxpin said:
If not more.
