Op UNIFIER - CAF and the Ukraine Crisis

[Czech_pivo]

True, even though yesterday there was still alleged talk of maybe/perhaps sending Canadian troops to eastern Europe - maybe they got the answer to their internal ask?

Maybe we can gather up say 500 CDN Rangers and send them over? They've already got excellent cold weather gear and recently were issued new rifles...

 

[KevinB]

True, even though yesterday there was still alleged talk of maybe/perhaps sending Canadian troops to eastern Europe - maybe they got the answer to their internal ask?

I suspect Canada will end up either sending another BattleGroup - or beefing up the Latvian presence - the US just picked 4 Div over to Europe, and the Brit's 2, so I don't think the cupboard is bare argument will fly well - considering the fact Canada has committed to being able to field a Heavy Div to Europe for NATO (NATO might actually ask some awkward questions if the CAF didn't do anything).

I don't think they will accept as excuse saying that the entire CAF is occupied with the EA...

 

[The Bread Guy]

I suspect Canada will end up either sending another BattleGroup - or beefing up the Latvian presence ...

One hopes the cupboard isn't so bare that some of this can happen - but I also keep my fingers sadly crossed.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I suspect Canada will end up either sending another BattleGroup - or beefing up the Latvian presence - the US just picked 4 Div over to Europe, and the Brit's 2, so I don't think the cupboard is bare argument will fly well - considering the fact Canada has committed to being able to field a Heavy Div to Europe for NATO (NATO might actually ask some awkward questions if the CAF didn't do anything).

I don't think they will accept as excuse saying that the entire CAF is occupied with the EA...

That's probably why Trudeau pulled the trigger on the EA: to avoid having to send troops to Europe.

 

[KevinB]

That's probably why Trudeau pulled the trigger on the EA: to avoid having to send troops to Europe.

Honestly I have been mulling that over - while I don't credit JT himself with a lot of intelligence, I think his team is pretty cunning and ruthless.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Honestly I have been mulling that over - while I don't credit JT himself with a lot of intelligence, I think his team is pretty cunning and ruthless.

They're the same crew that said 'we'll keep your seat warm in Afghanistan' while they waved goodbye as the US went into Iraq.

 

[McG]

... considering the fact Canada has committed to being able to field a Heavy Div to Europe for NATO ....

Why do you think that Canada has committed to sending a Division? I haven't seen anything to suggest we've committed to even a brigade.

 

[KevinB]

Why do you think that Canada has committed to sending a Division? I haven't seen anything to suggest we've committed to even a brigade.

I meant Bde, my bad -- still having my coffee.

NATO definitely believes the CA has committed to a Bde, I'll leave it at that.

 

[rnkelly]

I think your analysis of what is being said between the lines is quite accurate. We are once again faced by the fact that over 100,000 military members and civilians are stressed deploying 2,000 people notwithstanding SSE calls for up to 4,000 on sustained operations and up to an additional 2,500 on time-limited ones. We have both a structural and leadership problem that desperately need addressing.

These numbers are incredible.

I don’t know if SSE’s numbers are realistic or not but it’s crazy to me how much difficulty the CAF has with fulfilling their mandate of deploying overseas. I often think we’re too risk averse, we don’t need everyone deploying to be all singing and all dancing. We don’t have enough depth to be picky, sure mistakes will happen but the alternative is worse. It‘s not the time to be reducing our engagement abroad.

 

[MilEME09]

These numbers are incredible.

I don’t know if SSE’s numbers are realistic or not but it’s crazy to me how much difficulty the CAF has with fulfilling their mandate of deploying overseas. I often think we’re too risk averse, we don’t need everyone deploying to be all singing and all dancing. We don’t have enough depth to be picky, sure mistakes will happen but the alternative is worse. It‘s not the time to be reducing our engagement abroad.

Increase deployment length to 9 months, all brigade and below level HQs must deploy. Increase reserve augmentation, allow members not fully qualified in trade to deploy in trade as OJT(but not solo), especially techs who can get valuable real world training deploying to Latvia.

 

[Czech_pivo]

Increase deployment length to 9 months, all brigade and below level HQs must deploy. Increase reserve augmentation, allow members not fully qualified in trade to deploy in trade as OJT(but not solo), especially techs who can get valuable real world training deploying to Latvia.

Question, who else besides us only deploys troops on 6 month rotations? The US 1yr rotations, correct? What about the Brits, the Poles, Germans, etc?

 

[KevinB]

Question, who else besides us only deploys troops on 6 month rotations? The US 1yr rotations, correct? What about the Brits, the Poles, Germans, etc?

No set standard down here - generally 9-12 months, but in Iraq at the peak 18months + did occur.

 

[dangerboy]

When I was in Bosnia, the British soldiers I talked to said they were there for around 6 months. Don't know if that is a standard length for them and as that was about 20 years ago if it is still like that.

 

[KevinB]

When I was in Bosnia, the British soldiers I talked to said they were there for around 6 months. Don't know if that is a standard length for them and as that was about 20 years ago if it is still like that.

The did 6 month rotos in Cyprus (which was 30 years ago) and Afghanistan as well

 

[Humphrey Bogart]

The French do 4 month deployments. They have a different way of looking at readiness than we do and have a lot more Presence Forces already pre-positioned that are rotated frequently.

They also don't really do the sort of large scale exercises we do and almost all large scale exercising of HQs, etc are accomplished with CAX as opposed to something like MAPLE RESOLVE.

 

[Fabius]

I don’t think the cupboard is so bare that we can’t put together at least a BG but that would mean actually deciding upon priorities, activating reserve forces to take over IRU tasks, accepting tour extensions for deployed forces etc.

Our military senior leadership is incapable of not only making those decisions I am increasingly sure they can’t even visualize those options.

 

[daftandbarmy]

I don’t think the cupboard is so bare that we can’t put together at least a BG but that would mean actually deciding upon priorities, activating reserve forces to take over IRU tasks, accepting tour extensions for deployed forces etc.

Our military senior leadership is incapable of not only making those decisions I am increasingly sure they can’t even visualize those options.

But we have 9 x Inf Bns and umpteen Recce Regts

 

[OldSolduer]

I don’t think the cupboard is so bare that we can’t put together at least a BG but that would mean actually deciding upon priorities, activating reserve forces to take over IRU tasks, accepting tour extensions for deployed forces etc.

Our military senior leadership is incapable of not only making those decisions I am increasingly sure they can’t even visualize those options.

I think a good many are capable but its the bean counters and the risk averse that seem to hold sway.

 

[KevinB]

The French do 4 month deployments. They have a different way of looking at readiness than we do and have a lot more Presence Forces already pre-positioned that are rotated frequently.

Most SOF rotations are 4 months - but the Op Tempo was pretty high - for many it was 1 on 1 off, not 1 on 2 off.

 

[MilEME09]

Another radical suggestion, get the changes made to the NDA and other legislation to call up reserve units to active status for a fixed period.