Majority of Canadians not interested in joining the CAF

[RangerRay]

Is there a profession that would get a majority saying they want to be?

 

[JLB50]

I think the heart of the issue might be this:

"There is a great deal of advertising that is much better than the product. When that happens, all that the good advertising will do is put you out of business faster." - Jerry Della Femina

The problem is, I don’t think there has been much good advertising to put them out of business. Or even any advertising to speak of. Just a few dribs and drabs. Death by a thousand cuts. I hate to think what would happen if patriotism in Canada were really put to the test.

 

[Quirky]

Is there a profession that would get a majority saying they want to be?

In Canada? NHL hockey player.

 

[mariomike]

This would plug recruiting gaps in one year as 1/2 million people come to Canada and need work every year.

Good idea.

Also, some good ideas for retention of those already in,

OP:

I feel that the CAF need to do more to retain our members.

Retention vs Recruiting

I always thought these ads covered all the bases: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snYeEMRXt2o Doing awesome shit while drinking on Fridays? This would not hit any of the kinder and gentler metrics we are trying to target!

army.ca

 

[Brad Sallows]

"Majority of Canadians have no interest in dirty, strenuous, frequently outdoor, occasionally hazardous work."

Film at 11.

 

[dimsum]

Same thing with sanitation workers, janitorial staff, contractors, pipefitters, electricians, etc. Our school systems are often the biggest proponents of avoiding anything blue collar. My son doesn't want to go to university, but has been bandied about the head by his school administration with it as his only option for success in life.

Like most blue collar industries have done, we should open up recruiting to Permanent Residents and Commonwealth applicants. Screen them, employ them, have them take a chunk of money and send it home, or offer citizenship after their first 5 years.

Now that I've had some time to think about it, I don't think the military is purely blue-collar. There are plenty of white collar jobs in the CAF but when people think "military", most people think "infantry" or "jet pilot".

What the CAF should also publicize is that there are tons of other jobs, and some really interesting ones that you generally need to transfer into.

Some prefer clean, inside work with no heavy lifting and a thermostat on the wall.

So, AERE, PAO, TDO, Physiotherapist, Social Worker, Legal...

 

[RangerRay]

"Majority of Canadians have no interest in dirty, strenuous, frequently outdoor, occasionally hazardous work."

Film at 11.

Nor do they like being told how to dress, how to cut their hair, how to walk, being confined to barracks, waking up at 0 dark 30, getting yelled at, being called “f’ing hemorrhoids”…

Did I miss anything?

 

[dimsum]

how to cut their hair

Soon to be a thing of the past.

 

[Bluebulldog]

Nor do they like being told how to dress, how to cut their hair, how to walk, being confined to barracks, waking up at 0 dark 30, getting yelled at, being called “f’ing hemorrhoids”…

Did I miss anything?

That's page 1....

 

[FSTO]

Our advertising are crap. Being beside the US and inundated 24/7 by US Culture, I would hazard that most Canadians know all about "ARMY, AIRFORCE, NAVY MARINES!" meanwhile we have this milktoast obscure message that doesn't say a damn thing

 

[Brad Sallows]

Well, we carry briefcases. Life in the CAF is basically a uniformed middle management job!

 

[Grimey]

Same thing with sanitation workers, janitorial staff, contractors, pipefitters, electricians, etc. Our school systems are often the biggest proponents of avoiding anything blue collar. My son doesn't want to go to university, but has been bandied about the head by his school administration with it as his only option for success in life.

Like most blue collar industries have done, we should open up recruiting to Permanent Residents and Commonwealth applicants. Screen them, employ them, have them take a chunk of money and send it home, or offer citizenship after their first 5 years.

Although they didn't implicitly state it, the feeling you got from early 80s HS Guidance Councilors wasn't much different. Uni was the preference, Community College was a somewhat acceptable alternative, the trades were sneered at and if by chance you showed an inkling of interest in the CF, you were pretty much written off. I doubt their approach has changed much.

 

[Brad Sallows]

For those sneering at trades, the older houses (c. 1990) in the neighbourhood I live in now routinely list above $1M. (I bought "older" in 2007 under $500K). Lots of RVs, a few boats on trailers, typically every 2- (and 3-) car garage either full of recreational stuff and/or some kind of classic/hobby car.

Parked in many driveways come end of day: tradesmen's vans and pickups.

 

[rmc_wannabe]

Although they didn't implicitly state it, the feeling you got from early 80s HS Guidance Councilors wasn't much different. Uni was the preference, Community College was a somewhat acceptable alternative, the trades were sneered at and if by chance you showed an inkling of interest in the CF, you were pretty much written off. I doubt their approach has changed much.

Same approach as 2006 when I graduated. Same as what my kid is going through in 2022.
You're thought a fool if you wish to work with your hands and not advance to "higher education."

 

[OldSolduer]

Its not just the crappy ads, nor the sexual crap or even the toxic crap.

Canadians have been taught they are "entitled to their entitlements" AND want nothing to do with anything that might inconvenience them. Especially anything "military" unless of course a blue beret goes with it.

Having said that droves of people were signing up like crazy to get to Afghanistan.

 

[IKnowNothing]

For those sneering at trades, the older houses (c. 1990) in the neighbourhood I live in now routinely list above $1M. (I bought "older" in 2007 under $500K). Lots of RVs, a few boats on trailers, typically every 2- (and 3-) car garage either full of recreational stuff and/or some kind of classic/hobby car.

Parked in many driveways come end of day: tradesmen's vans and pickups.

A lot of inherent advantages to the trades, especially in a real estate driven economy
-skills to use your trade on your own property (and also tangential skills to do other work outside of your trade)
-connections to have skills you don't have completed by buddies for cash
-connections to materials at cost/wholesale
-4 years of earnings vs. 4 years of tuition cost
-likely go rent free longer
-likely buy younger

The interaction compounds pretty fast. You have to do pretty damn well for yourself post graduation to catch up.

Couple that with the runaway housing market since ~11 making each year of delay costlier and it's quite the recipe for success relative to higher education.

 

[btrudy]

Its not just the crappy ads, nor the sexual crap or even the toxic crap.

Canadians have been taught they are "entitled to their entitlements" AND want nothing to do with anything that might inconvenience them. Especially anything "military" unless of course a blue beret goes with it.

Having said that droves of people were signing up like crazy to get to Afghanistan.

Ultimately, if the CAF is having problems recruiting and retaining personnel because of the changing attitudes and tolerance for various working conditions of the general public, it's up to the CAF to change their working conditions to adapt. Whinging about how kids these days are soft or whatnot isn't going to fix anything.

This isn't to say that we need to abandon the actual job entirely, but at least stop making it suck as badly. People join the Navy understanding that they're going to have to sail, but that doesn't mean that you need to make people hop from jetty to jetty because you've got more ships going to sea than you have personnel to sail it.

Burning people out to support a brutal opsched is unsustainable. All you're doing is making the problem worse. But god forbid anyone suggests cutting back on the amount of going to sea we have the fleet do. God forbid we let our actual capacity determine what we are able to do, and plan accordingly.

 

[OldSolduer]

Ultimately, if the CAF is having problems recruiting and retaining personnel because of the changing attitudes and tolerance for various working conditions of the general public, it's up to the CAF to change their working conditions to adapt. Whinging about how kids these days are soft or whatnot isn't going to fix anything.

This isn't to say that we need to abandon the actual job entirely, but at least stop making it suck as badly. People join the Navy understanding that they're going to have to sail, but that doesn't mean that you need to make people hop from jetty to jetty because you've got more ships going to sea than you have personnel to sail it.

Burning people out to support a brutal opsched is unsustainable. All you're doing is making the problem worse. But god forbid anyone suggests cutting back on the amount of going to sea we have the fleet do. God forbid we let our actual capacity determine what we are able to do, and plan accordingly.

I agree with you for the most part. As I am sure you know the "working conditions" might be getting shot at, freezing your ass off in an assembly area, being soaked to the skin and hypothermic or extreme heat. Never mind getting yelled at to "move up on the left" as you try to attack an objective.

My point being is that the nation has forgotten what sacrifice is.

 

[btrudy]

I agree with you for the most part. As I am sure you know the "working conditions" might be getting shot at, freezing your ass off in an assembly area, being soaked to the skin and hypothermic or extreme heat. Never mind getting yelled at to "move up on the left" as you try to attack an objective.

My point being is that the nation has forgotten what sacrifice is.

Honestly, I don't think that's really all that accurate.

I think it's more so that "the nation" is made up of people who are unwilling to undergo hardship for the sake of hardship. For example: training exercises where the exercise is intentionally made harder and more uncomfortable and unpleasant than you'd actually ever see on operations.

Aside from the fact that it's abandoning the notion of train as you fight, it's going to be largely viewed by those "kids now-a-days" as pointless misery, and not as what I suspect "older generations" of CAF members would view it as, character building.

If you're going to expect people to endure suffering, they're going to expect it to be for a good reason. If you want people to sacrifice, then it needs a good reason.

 

[dimsum]

Our advertising are crap. Being beside the US and inundated 24/7 by US Culture, I would hazard that most Canadians know all about "ARMY, AIRFORCE, NAVY MARINES!" meanwhile we have this milktoast obscure message that doesn't say a damn thing

I've posted this before but we can (and sometimes do) post really good PR things, like below.

Just that no one watches them, because reasons.