Liberal Minority Government 2019 - ????

[Jarnhamar]

Morneau is a sacrificial lamb its just that in this case he also deserved it.

 

[Remius]

You guys are celebrating a bit early.

Ok, Morneau’s gone. Note that of the whole cabinet he had by far the most real- world business experience. He’s the sort of self-made millionaire the Conservatives tend to court and drool over. He knows economics. He was also helping to restrain some of the more fiscally profligate urges in the LPC. Now he will not longer be there to curb spending to any extent.

Meanwhile the NDP are broke. They can’t afford an election. The power they wield is being able to single handedly prop up the LPC minority government. The LPC need only keep them on side, and they don’t have to worry what the CPC or Bloc do or say. They can still command a majority of votes.

And how are they likely to court that support from the NDP? Further spending on social programs. The sort of stuff that Morneau was probably the most credible and capable person in cabinet to keep a lid on.

So, by all means cheer on his departure. But the current government likely isn’t going anywhere any time soon. Not a chance Trudeau will resign; he doesn’t have to. Sure, Morneau’s gone, but this may be a case of be careful what you wish for...

You and I generally agree politically.  I’m not sure Morneau was some sort of gatekeeper though.  For whatever they are worth and when they are required, this government has never been afraid of spending or deficits.  And morneau has been there since day one with that program.  Maybe there was a fallout but I am still of the opinion that this was a staged exit allowing him to leave with dignity more or less and he’s moving to a position I am sure the PM will support.  He became a liability though with this latest scandal making very hard for him to be at the forefront of any recovery or spending.  Everything he would touch would be under scrutiny and likely any link however tenuous would be used against him. 

I don’t think he was fired.  But I don’t know how he could stay on either without causing more damage.

I agree though, Trudeau isn’t going anywhere and the liberals don’t have a lot of viable and as qualified people to fill that portfolio in their current lineup.  So in the grand scheme of things I’m not sure that this a better situation for Canadians.  (But with Morneau giving up his seat, a quick by election with some talent brought in might fill that gap, hint hint, Carney)

 

[shawn5o]

Here's Maclean's take on FM Morneau


Bill Morneau, melting away

Paul Wells: The PM is permitting his finance minister—the supposed incarnation of his government's fiscal credibility—to be set up. It does not bode well.

By Paul WellsAugust 17, 2020
https://www.macleans.ca/politics/ottawa/bill-morneau-melting-away/

[UPDATE, 7:55 p.m.: This column, written before Bill Morneau announced his resignation, stands up after with no need for amendment. I’ll simply add two observations based on his remarks at his news conference.

First, Morneau has always believed he could offer talking points in place of answers, and that unshakeable belief continues. He just got fired. It is pathetic to pretend otherwise. Pathetic.

Second, he will be a candidate to be secretary-general of the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development. Like so much else about this fiasco, this fits a pattern. Justin Trudeau is getting into the habit of peddling his problems to the world. He campaigned for a second mandate for Michaëlle Jean as head of La francophonie, after her spending habits made her candidacy untenable. And he improvised an unacceptable double diplomatic appointment for Stéphane Dion when he got tired of hearing Dion at the cabinet table, forcing France to threaten to veto an EU ambassadorship for the first time in the history of the union.

Laundering his problems on the world stage is getting to be a thing Justin Trudeau does. Eventually the world will notice. Maybe it already has. – pw]

The lesson from Bill Morneau for all remaining Trudeau cabinet ministers is this: you cannot make yourself small enough to be safe. No amount of self-effacement will ensure you stay on as a minister of the crown. If you commit ethical lapses too reminiscent of the Prime Minister’s, any disagreement, even if you expressed them in private, will be used against you in an extended campaign of leaks.

Here’s the suite of stories people who claim to be speaking on Trudeau’s behalf have deployed against Morneau in the past week. Globe, Monday: Morneau “could be replaced.” Bloomberg, Saturday: Morneau’s “too orthodox.” Reuters, Sunday: he “pushed back against other cabinet ministers.” Clearly he’s got to go.

But it’s a funny thing. Add up the articles of indictment nameless PMO sources have read out to a succession of reporters and you find a list of purported differences that were (a) entirely resolved in Trudeau’s favour at Morneau’s expense (and the taxpayer’s, if anyone still notices such things); (b) entirely private—until the Trudeau camp decided to exhume them for reporters’ delectation.

The Globe story says the PM wants a two-year EI premium freeze in the transition from a Canada Emergency Response Benefit (CERB) to a retooled EI. Morneau, we’re told, wants only a one-year freeze. That’s the first anyone’s heard about the purported dispute. Morneau’s kept shtum about it. On past disputes, we learn Morneau wanted to keep the original post-lockdown 10 per cent wage subsidy and Trudeau wanted to increase it to 75 per cent. Trudeau won that dispute, which was never reported at the time. We learn that Trudeau told Morneau to drop a dumb plan that would have permitted the minister to tax and spend on fiat, without parliamentary approval, through 2021. Frankly I have a hard time believing the plan was Morneau’s idea, but whatever: he dropped it as (purportedly) ordered, never complained. Trudeau won again.

The Bloomberg story repeats some of those claims and adds a new one, that Morneau wanted the CERB to be smaller than $2,000. If that’s true, Morneau lost that one too and has never complained.

Caucus members and cabinet ministers are told, not only in the Liberal party but in every Canadian party and to an extent no parliamentarian in other large countries would ever accept, that they mustn’t air their dirty laundry in public. For the last decade or so, in fact, they have been strongly discouraged from appearing to have independent personalities, social-media personae, social circles or fashion sense. Morneau has followed this advice scrupulously. Fat lot of good it’s done him. He’s spent three days in the last seven reading about his dirty laundry in the papers.

More at link above

 

[OldSolduer]

Justin is going to need a new bus as the undercarriage of this one is getting clogged up.

:2c:

 

[Haggis]

(But with Morneau giving up his seat, a quick by election with some talent brought in might fill that gap, hint hint, Carney)

Unless the Liberals lose that by-election.

 

[Remius]

Unless the Liberals lose that by-election.

In Toronto?


Toronto Centre hasn’t been conservative since 1993....

 

[dangerboy]

A new finance minister has been selected https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-cabinet-finance-minister-1.5690404.

How many different jobs does she now hold in the government?

 

[shawn5o]

Spencer Fernando writes that the liberal government will be prorogued


Liberals To Prorogue Parliament Until OCTOBER

SPENCERFERNANDO AUGUST 18, 2020

The governor general will be asked by Justin Trudeau to prorogue Parliament until October.

It is almost certain that she will agree to the request.

This means Trudeau – engulfed in scandal and with his poll numbers dropping – will be shutting Parliament down for months in an effort to avoid accountability for his actions.
The Liberals are hoping that with Bill Morneau gone and Chrystia Freeland set to replace him, they will be able to hit the ‘reset button’ and move on.

More at
https://spencerfernando.com/2020/08/18/liberals-to-prorogue-parliament-until-october/

 

[Donald H]

What, exactly, is wrong with spending on social programs?

Nothing! But the rightist mindset refers to it as stealing and spending other people's money.

  But I personally have no issue with social program spending. Perhaps it’s that we don’t trust government to manage social programs, even excellent social programs, wisely with a view to helping up? 

And also perhaps, it's more that the Conservatives don't believe in social spending. Canadians should be watching intently what is happening south of the border for an indication of what we could become.

 

[Remius]

Spencer Fernando writes that the liberal government will be prorogued


Liberals To Prorogue Parliament Until OCTOBER

SPENCERFERNANDO AUGUST 18, 2020

The governor general will be asked by Justin Trudeau to prorogue Parliament until October.

It is almost certain that she will agree to the request.

This means Trudeau – engulfed in scandal and with his poll numbers dropping – will be shutting Parliament down for months in an effort to avoid accountability for his actions.
The Liberals are hoping that with Bill Morneau gone and Chrystia Freeland set to replace him, they will be able to hit the ‘reset button’ and move on.

More at
https://spencerfernando.com/2020/08/18/liberals-to-prorogue-parliament-until-october/

CBC. Reporting the same thing.

Will be interesting to see all those that defended and were in the Harper gvt when they did the same thing will have to say about this.

 

[Remius]

A new finance minister has been selected https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-cabinet-finance-minister-1.5690404.

How many different jobs does she now hold in the government?

All of them.  She’s the real PM at the end of the day

 

[shawn5o]

Chrystia Freeland will become Canada's new finance minister, the first woman to take on the powerful role, CBC News has confirmed.

National Citizens Coalition has this to say, especially about FM Freeland.


Unserious Leaders in a Serious Time

National Citizens Coalition

It's no secret as to what transpired yesterday in Ottawa. Bill Morneau threw himself under the bus before Trudeau could back over him, and we all saw it was coming. That sudden "rift" between the two? All of the sudden it was in every Liberal-friendly paper, and appearing in op-eds across the country. The PMO spin was in -- and it was obvious to just about everyone that Katie Telford was hard at work behind the scenes.

So it's no surprise that Bill Morneau didn't survive the week. Trudeau has punted cabinet ministers for far less -- like, for having ethics, for example. But it is a bit of a surprise to see so many believe the competing spin-jobs from the PMO and team Morneau that some irreparable philosophical difference had developed between the trust-fund twosome, seemingly out of nowhere.

Morneau, up until his very resignation, remained forever loyal, and forever a "useful idiot" to an unserious PM who never had any interest in balancing the budget, and who lacks the ability to address adult matters with his head instead of his heart.

Bill Morneau labelled ordinary hard working Canadians who didn't inherit their wealth as "tax cheats", while failing to disclose his French chateau. Bill Morneau accepted lavish favours from the WE 'Charity', and only remembered to pay them back when he was caught. Bill Morneau was the most fiscally irresponsible finance minister in Canadian history.

This loss is no loss at all.

But what comes next might be worse.

With reports now confirming that Chrystia Freeland of all people will now be taking over the reigns of finance minister, we have another unserious act from a sitting minority prime minister at an incredibly serious time -- and one that only serves to further highlight the weakness of Trudeau's cabinet.

Of course the Liberal government couldn't leave such a post vacant at such a critical time of economic recovery, but now, we've left a former journalist in charge of the nation's finance, a position that is completely incongruous to her career experiences.

In an effort to turn a negative into a positive, the spin will be in high gear, with friendly pundits carrying water for a struggling party desperate to change the channel. But make no mistake: Justin Trudeau just appointed what appears to be the least qualified finance minister in history, at a time when the finances of millions of Canadians are on the brink.

The wrong person resigned last night, and for the same sins as his boss. And now, once again, Trudeau gets to skate free and use Chrystia Freeland has cover.

These are unserious leaders, in a serious time.

** No link as it was sent to me by email

 

[PuckChaser]

And also perhaps, it's more that the Conservatives don't believe in social spending. Canadians should be watching intently what is happening south of the border for an indication of what we could become.

You're right, as politicians push into hard left woke identity politics where its a race to the bottom to be the most offended/oppressed individual then the majority will vote for literally anyone who's not doing it.

You're also using a vast generalization for Conservatives. The majority of small "c" conservatives don't mind social spending, they just don't believe in the runaway train of the government paying for everything in your life. The problem with socialism is that you will eventually run out of other people's money, take a look at New York City's exodus of "the 1%" who actually are about 50% of their tax base.

 

[Haggis]

In Toronto?


Toronto Centre hasn’t been conservative since 1993....

Who'd have thought a part-time drama teacher/snowboard instructor could be our PM or that a reality TV star would be POTUS?  Nothing is impossible in politics these days.  And it's still 2020.

 

[Donald H]

You're right, as politicians push into hard left woke identity politics where its a race to the bottom to be the most offended/oppressed individual then the majority will vote for literally anyone who's not doing it.

You're also using a vast generalization for Conservatives. The majority of small "c" conservatives don't mind social spending, they just don't believe in the runaway train of the government paying for everything in your life. The problem with socialism is that you will eventually run out of other people's money, take a look at New York City's exodus of "the 1%" who actually are about 50% of their tax base.

You make a great point with N.Y.'s 1%!

And so now we get down to discussing the finer points. Canada's government must make sure that they leave no safe place for the 1% to go. Not to the Bahamas as is the case in the US to a large extent. And not to the Bahamas or Alberta as is the case in Canada.

The problem with socialism is that you will eventually run out of other people's money,...........

That's pretty close to what I said and am thinking.

As Canadians we tend to seek out a balance as the pendulum swings between the Liberals and Conservatives, so far. That balance has been lost in the US and the people are paying a heavy price, yet they continue to wave their flag because they've been told they are doing well. They're not, they've fallen to 17th. on quality of life and are out of the running for the top ten capitalist countries of the world.

The point is, we must not let the Conservatives take Canada down too.

 

[PuckChaser]

You make a great point with N.Y.'s 1%!

And so now we get down to discussing the finer points. Canada's government must make sure that they leave no safe place for the 1% to go. Not to the Bahamas as is the case in the US to a large extent. And not to the Bahamas or Alberta as is the case in Canada.

What you propose is dangerous. California is looking at retroactively taxing former residents back to January an increased state tax on the upper 1% At a certain point, those individuals will just gain citizenship in another country and renounce their Canadian one to get away from whatever draconian cash grabs you can figure out. Whats next, midnight raids into private residences to check mattresses of people hiding money?

As Canadians we tend to seek out a balance as the pendulum swings between the Liberals and Conservatives, so far. That balance has been lost in the US and the people are paying a heavy price, yet they continue to wave their flag because they've been told they are doing well. They're not, they've fallen to 17th. on quality of life and are out of the running for the top ten capitalist countries of the world.

The point is, we must not let the Conservatives take Canada down too.

You clearly have a problem understanding how different on the political spectrum Canada is from the United States. By nature of our acceptance of socialized medicine, the CPC would be considered a center-left party in the United States. The Liberal/NDP parties are no where as far left as a growing group of key Democrats. You're comparing apples to oranges.

The CPC will lead Canada again, much like it did before. The sky didn't fall, abortions and gay marriage weren't outlawed overnight and no one was forced to go to church. The only ones currently taking Canada down is the Liberal party; down into a septic tank of national debt that we may never escape.

 

[Donald H]

You clearly have a problem understanding how different on the political spectrum Canada is from the United States. By nature of our acceptance of socialized medicine, the CPC would be considered a center-left party in the United States.

Yes, I agree and have said just that in some previous post I believe. All political parties in the US are to the right of Canada and the other leading capitalist countries of the world.

The Liberal/NDP parties are no where as far left as a growing group of key Democrats. You're comparing apples to oranges.

That's an interesting point but I'll need some convincing with some evidence. I see nothing that is happening in the US at the present as being left of Canada. I only see the failure of a movement spearheaded by Bernie Sanders and that movement would have barely caught them up with Canada. Then I saw the Dem party establishment hijack that movement to nominate Biden, the establishment's choice. So now they've left themselves with Biden <deleted>, who could be the very worst choice to beat Trump.

I'll assume you are referring to the Antifa movement as the hard left rising in the US. But whoever, what are you proposing to be left of Canada?

The CPC will lead Canada again, much like it did before. The sky didn't fall, abortions and gay marriage weren't outlawed overnight and no one was forced to go to church.

Yes, I agree that the pendulum will once again swing to the right.

The only ones currently taking Canada down is the Liberal party; down into a septic tank of national debt that we may never escape.

- Staff edit to comply with polictical forums posting guidelines

 

[ModlrMike]

Canada's government must make sure that they leave no safe place for the 1% to go. Not to the Bahamas as is the case in the US to a large extent. And not to the Bahamas or Alberta as is the case in Canada.

Section 6 of the Constitution might have something to say about that:

6. (1) Every citizen of Canada has the right to enter, remain in and leave Canada.

(2) Every citizen of Canada and every person who has the status of a permanent resident of Canada has the right

    a) to move to and take up residence in any province

 

[shawn5o]

The point is, we must not let the Conservatives take Canada down too.

Too late Don

The Liberal government already did that. 

 

[Brad Sallows]

Progressives are the most conservative people I know.  They press a point, returning to it at intervals - another debate, another referendum, another piece of legislation -  until they win it and then they come over all conservative: the debate is over, we had the vote, the question is settled, etc.