Legal Officer Recruiting [Merged]

[tyorke0]

Also last question,

If I go this route and do everything through the military and serve my 5 years as a legal officer, if I then leave the military at that point, would I then have all the certifications or requirements to serve as a lawyer in the civilian world such as opening a private firm etc. or would I need additional training or certifications before I could be a lawyer as a civilian.

Thanks

 

[Blackadder1916]

Also last question,

If I go this route and do everything through the military and serve my 5 years as a legal officer, if I then leave the military at that point, would I then have all the certifications or requirements to serve as a lawyer in the civilian world such as opening a private firm etc. or would I need additional training or certifications before I could be a lawyer as a civilian.

Thanks

It appears that you have not fully understood FJAG's learned explanations.  The military does not educate soldiers to be lawyers, they train lawyers to be soldiers.  To be a lawyer in the CAF, one has to go to a recognized Canadian (civilian) law school just like all the rest of the potential ambulance chasers out there and then they have to article with a law firm or other appropriate legal position (civilian) and then get called to the bar in a province (i.e. receive a civilian license to practise law).  Then, and only then, does the Canadian Forces start training an already licensed lawyer the idiosyncrasies of military legal practices.  So the question is not do you need further civilian certifications to practise law after leaving the military, but does a civilian lawyer have enough certifications to join the CF as a lawyer.

Yes, as quoted in the message announcing an MLTP competition for 16/17, there is a rare possibility of a serving Reg F officer being subsidized for a legal education, but (as FJAG stressed) it should not to be confused with probability nor should it form the basis of a plan.  I've known a few (in years long past, since like FJAG, I'm also retired) who applied for MLTP.  Most didn't get accepted; those who really wanted to be lawyers left the Reg F and went to law school on their own dime.  The one individual of my acquaintance who did get accepted for MLTP, surprisingly (or so the story goes) did not get accepted into law school.  He (a DEO who entered the CF with a masters degree) continued in his original occupation and retired as a colonel.  If your end game is to be a lawyer, plan your education with that goal in mind.

 

[FJAG]

Blackadder1916 is right on.

The short answer to your question is that every legal officer in the CF, regular or reserve, have completed law school, articles and been called to the bar of a provincial law society. In fact the military pays the appropriate law society dues for each of its legal officers every year to keep their practicing certificates active. On top of that every legal officer remains liable to his/her respective law society for that society's code of professional conduct. Accordingly on retirement from the CF every legal officer is entitled to immediately take up a civilian practice IN HIS HOME PROVINCE. That last bit is important because even if called to the bar in Manitoba I can practice law ON BEHALF OF THE CF anywhere in Canada and beyond. BUT, when I retire I'm only entitled to practice in Manitoba. In order to practice elsewhere I must follow the appropriate law societies rules and procedures for transferring my practicing certificate to another province.

:subbies:

 

[tyorke0]

Oh Ok i see.  Thank you all very much for your help. 

I greatly appreciate it.

Take care

 

[DazedandConfused19]

Hi everyone,

I recently finalized my JAG application. I've provided my online application, passed by CFAT for a DEO position, and gave the JAG office my updated CV, reference letters, and personal statement.

I was wondering, what next?

The person in charge of my file at the CFRC told me that the JAG office will contact me directly once they have completed my assessment. He also told me that this could take "a couple of months".

So I was wondering:

1. Is there a general timeline for JAG recruitment?
2. How long does it typically take for the JAG office to review a file?
3. The career counselor told me that at the moment, the JAG office is only looking to fill 6-7 spots so I'm not super hopeful.  I don't have any prior military experience and only have a year of practice under my belt. How much experience do typical JAG recruits have before joining the office?
4. Once the JAG office has assessed my file, what happens next? Do they call me for an interview? Will they let me know if they have decided that I do not qualify for an interview?

Thanks everyone,

 

[mariomike]

See also,

Legal Officers 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/83972.0

7 Year Commitment?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/121752.0
"I am considering a career with the CF as a legal officer."

Law articling?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/96732.0
"I'm starting law school this year, and am interested in a military law career."

Legal Officer App Process 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/119654.0

any legal officers here?
http://army.ca/forums/threads/101747.0
"It looks like a really exciting career path"

Legal Officer 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/29039.0

Legal Officer DEO in a couple years - any advice on preparing?
https://army.ca/forums/threads/90452.0

lawyer wants to join JAG...has questions 
http://army.ca/forums/threads/109676.0

JAG Officers 
https://army.ca/forums/threads/83.0

Legal Officer Recruitment
https://army.ca/forums/threads/109276.0

etc...

As always,  Recruiting is your most trusted source of information.

 

[FJAG]

Marionmike has pretty much pulled together everything that you could ask for.

As to your specifc questions:

1 &2 Your recruiter will know better than anyone here. A couple of months is not unreasonable but ir could even take longer.

3. The applicants' experience varies from year to year. Since the competition is competitive, the more that you have, the better. Also military experience (regular or reserve) and a capability in both official languages are definite assets.

4. You will be advised one way or the other. Assuming that you are not disqualified for failing to meet the required standards, you should be scheduled for an interview by a board.

:subbies:

 

[DazedandConfused19]

Thanks for your replies Mariomike and FJAG.

I guess there is nothing to do now but wait...

 

[DazedandConfused19]

FJAG,

So if I meet the required standards, will I definitely be interviewed?
Or will I only be interviewed if I rank in the top X% (whatever that may be) of candidates that meet the standards?

The reason I ask is that although I may not have as much experience as other applicants, I would love the chance to meet the Board and show them my passion for the job, etc.

 

[PuckChaser]

The reserves training year is September to end of April, and unit training shuts down over the May-Aug months for collective training (BMOQ-L, Trade Courses, etc). Your BMOQ will likely be the weekends in Sept/Oct/Nov, or Jan/Feb/Mar depending on how your local unit has its training calendar set up.

 

[FJAG]

FJAG,

So if I meet the required standards, will I definitely be interviewed?
Or will I only be interviewed if I rank in the top X% (whatever that may be) of candidates that meet the standards?

The reason I ask is that although I may not have as much experience as other applicants, I would love the chance to meet the Board and show them my passion for the job, etc.

I can't give you a definitive answer as I've been retired from the branch since 2009. In my day everyone who met the required enrolment standards was invited to an interview.

:subbies:

 

[fata morgana]

Hi everyone,

I have some questions regarding the recruiting process for a DEO Legal Officer (Reserve) that I am hoping someone can address:

1. I understand that the final determination is made by the JAG panel following an interview in Ottawa, Ontario.  What types of questions are asked in this interview?  How difficult/intense is it? Any tips on preparing for it, should my application get that far?

Could someone who has been through the JAG recruitment recently share a bit on these questions? When they schedule you for an interview, is the applicant informed of the topics that will be tested on? Do they test you during the interview on your foreign languages abilities?
What materials did you find useful in preparing for this interview (mostly internet, Letourneau & Drapeau's book)?

How long does the process take?

When do you find out where you will be posted?

Throughout your career, can you be posted to any base or only at the JAG offices (which should exclude places like Gander, Goose Bay) ?

What is the average age to start with JAG?

Thank you in advance.

 

[FJAG]

Before I start -- are you talking about regular force or reserve?  There is some difference between the two.

:cheers:

 

[fata morgana]

Regular. thank you.

 

[FJAG]

Could someone who has been through the JAG recruitment recently share a bit on these questions?

With a handle like fata morgana, I hope that you are not just a mirage trolling this site.

When they schedule you for an interview, is the applicant informed of the topics that will be tested on?
There is no testing. The interview is to learn about you as an individual. You'll be asked questons about yourself, what you have accomplished and what you are bringing to the table that makes you a better candidate than the others.

Do they test you during the interview on your foreign languages abilities? Again, no test but if you indicate that you speak both official languages you may be engaged in conversation in the other official language to see how you do.

What materials did you find useful in preparing for this interview (mostly internet, Letourneau & Drapeau's book)? Neither of those books are well thought of by many people in the branch. You're far better off to be broadly knowledgeable in current events and the Canadian Forces in general. If you are a specialist in a unique area then being prepared to discuss that may be useful. Remember, the board will already have been provided information from the recruiting office about your level of education, past experience etc. This is a chance for you to impress them on a personal level.

How long does the process take? It varies depending upon the number of people scheduled for that day but count on twenty minutes to an hour.

When do you find out where you will be posted? Not until after your entire recruiting and selection process is complete. Most newly enrolled LegOs start off in Ottawa but it is possible that you may be sent to a regional office.

Throughout your career, can you be posted to any base or only at the JAG offices (which should exclude places like Gander, Goose Bay) ? Postings are to established JAG/AJAG/DJA/RMP etc offices however as the CF changes its presence in various communities, so does the JAG to ensure proper coverage.

What is the average age to start with JAG? I'm not sure I can answer that very well. It varies from year to year. My guess is generally from the mid-twenties to early-thirties although clearly we have taken in folks older than that.

:cheers:

 

[H11F]

What materials did you find useful in preparing for this interview (mostly internet, Letourneau & Drapeau's book)? Neither of those books are well thought of by many people in the branch. You're far better off to be broadly knowledgeable in current events and the Canadian Forces in general. If you are a specialist in a unique area then being prepared to discuss that may be useful. Remember, the board will already have been provided information from the recruiting office about your level of education, past experience etc. This is a chance for you to impress them on a personal level.

How long does the process take? It varies depending upon the number of people scheduled for that day but count on twenty minutes to an hour.

What is the average age to start with JAG? I'm not sure I can answer that very well. It varies from year to year. My guess is generally from the mid-twenties to early-thirties although clearly we have taken in folks older than that.

:cheers:

I figured I'd add a little bit to this post, though I'll stay in my lane and speak to items I am familiar with. Upfront, I did not enter through the Direct Entry Officer program, but rather through the Military Legal Training Plan. This means I went to my interview not as a lawyer, but as an infantry officer with high hopes.

To prepare for my interview, though I believe this to be well-rounded advice, I took to time to learn everything about the branch I could. You can access the annual reports for the Branch online, and this will provide you with some information about the Branch, about the stats (though that wasn't really important), as well as recent court decisions of importance to the Branch (this was important). Going in with a firm understanding of what you may be signing up for is always a good start. To put it in perspective: I was asked what the "vision" of the Branch was.

My interview was fairly long, perhaps even over an hour. Why? Because I was interested in a lot of things, so I asked a lot of questions at the end. This may not be the best for you, that's your call to make, but it was an opportunity to learn for me and show my interest and eagerness (ask FJAG, I'm pretty sure I bugged him with about a dozen messages on here alone).

As for age... ugh. I'm starting to feel like an old man. I was accepted in early 2016 and started school September of that year. I'm 35 now. So... Age is only a number?

Hope that helps,
H11F.

 

[FJAG]

...
To prepare for my interview, though I believe this to be well-rounded advice, I took to time to learn everything about the branch I could. You can access the annual reports for the Branch online, and this will provide you with some information about the Branch, about the stats (though that wasn't really important), as well as recent court decisions of importance to the Branch (this was important). Going in with a firm understanding of what you may be signing up for is always a good start. To put it in perspective: I was asked what the "vision" of the Branch was.
...

That's excellent advice!

Here's the link: http://www.forces.gc.ca/en/about-org-structure/judge-advocate-general.page

:cheers:

 

[csers]

What are the chances that my file could have been closed without notifying me? I applied over a year ago, and have heard nothing. Because the Legal Officer process is outside the regular recruitment process, the recruiting office hasn't been able to advise me of anything. Now I'm wondering if I was rejected for some reason and they forgot to tell me...

 

[FJAG]

What are the chances that my file could have been closed without notifying me? I applied over a year ago, and have heard nothing. Because the Legal Officer process is outside the regular recruitment process, the recruiting office hasn't been able to advise me of anything. Now I'm wondering if I was rejected for some reason and they forgot to tell me...

All legal officer recruiting funnels through the office of the DJAG COS in Ottawa and whose name and contact methods ought to be available on the JAG's DWAN website. If a local recruiting office does not have information on the current round of recruiting available they should be able to check status through that office.

:cheers:

 

[Sorcerers]

I applied in May 2016, completed my CFAT in August 2016, and was told that my file was "proceeding" in September 2016. Since then, I've called my local CFRC three or four times and emailed twice - but so far, no response. Is a two-year, post-CFAT waiting period normal for the DEO Legal Officer applications?

I'm also curious about what looks to be a new call-out for applications on the CAF website. At a glance, it seems that the starting salary has been raised and there is a fresh request for applications. If I haven't heard back in two years, should I re-apply?

Thanks!!