Hillier says Forces in 'war for talent' to boost ranks - CP

[MedTechStudent]

It's sad that the CF had to lose a talent like that.We have to look at retention.Peroid.Fresh blood is great,but nothing compares to the crusty Cpl's and the Snr NCO's with many years of military experience.

Indeed, that way there would be less newbie recruits like I'm soon to be, and more "crusty" Cpls to give me good advice.  ;D

And yes its a real shame about Cpl Furlong, I would like very much to meet that guy and get his story if he were kind enough to share it.

 

[WannaBeFlyer]

nothing compares to the crusty Cpl's and the Snr NCO's with many years of military experience.

I agree. I recently transferred within the Reserves and the Cpl's & Snr NCO's have been the main reason I have been so happy with my transfer.

 

[EW]

....I think that recruiting is going to be a hard thing for the forces in the next couple of years, because the youth waiting in the wings aren't suited for military service. ...............

As compared to which generation that was suited for military service in the past fifty years?  How do you think the old soldiers in the sixties and seventies felt when they saw the flower children of those times? They must have thought it was the end of the gene pool.  This coming generation will turn out quite fine I'm sure.  The system will likely have to adjust a bit, but in the end the core values of learning teamwork and developing leadership will shine through.  Those are requirements for self preservation in the military and people will always do what they need to do to survive.  Things might go a little left or right of center once in awhile, but every once in awhile something will come up to keep things on track.

Seems that every generation likes to think that things are one step away from falling apart.

 

[Yrys]

How do you think the old soldiers in the sixties and seventies felt when they saw the flower children of those times? They must have thought it was the end of the gene pool. 

Interesting point. Anyone here that went army in those decades ? How did the flower children reacted ?
And your new colleagues, the soldiers ?

 

[rifleman]

Just like we tend to train for previous wars, we continue to recruit for previous generations. If the potential recruits are different, then we have to find a different methods for recruiting. As for their potential for military service, they work out just fine.

 

[Drummy]

Interesting point. Anyone here that went army in those decades ? How did the flower children reacted ?
And your new colleagues, the soldiers ?

Well, I joined in the 50's(not a flower child) and the Cpls and Sgts(WW2 and Korea vets) involved with us thought that most of us wouldn't make past week 10.

We did though, and then thought that the ones coming after us were the donkeys of the decade. And so it continues. 

Drummy

 

[Booked_Spice]

I think that the we need to look at the " Retention aspect" We are loosing valuable members everyday due to circumstances the forces can control.

For example:

Getting a 6 week Tasking then home for 48 hours then getting tasked out again for another 8 weeks because we are short of bodies. Coming home for 3 weeks leave then start a year of work up training.

The members were told that the pace is not going to stop. So from a spouses point of view. I am looking at for the next 2 and half years, my husband will not be home. I know for a fact that 4 of my friends husbands have put their releases in due to the pace and no home time.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[aesop081]

We are loosing valuable members everyday due to circumstances the forces can control.

Ok, just what is it exactly, in your opinion, that is causing retention issues that the CF can control ?

 

[Booked_Spice]

If there are not enough able bodies to run some of the courses, then how about cancelling some or running them at a different time. I am not talking about recruitment training but some sniper courses ect.. I don't know if this is possible as I am not well educated in military aspects.  So I will apologize upfront if my thinking is incorrect.

Also, if the company is going on the next tour and work up training is coming up, we need to utilize other companies  to conduct some of the courses, again if this is possible.

All I know is 2 and a half years from home is a long time. It takes its toll not only on the family but on the member as well. I know for a fact that alot of members are reaching the " Burn out" stage. I cannot speak on behalf of them but I have heard the rants and raves. If they achieve this " burn out " stage then how good of a combat soldier will they be in operations? Like I said, I know of some members that have put their release in. I also know of some that have already released due to the pace and some other political red tape.

If the army releases are up 13 percent over all other trades. This needs to be looked at. I am sure their are other causes. But this needs to be investigated and solutions need to be brought forward. It will not help the Army if we are loosing valuable combat experience to things that can or might be controlled.

 

[aesop081]

If there are not enough able bodies to run some of the courses, then how about cancelling some or running them at a different time.

Cancelling courses only compounds the shortage of trained personel. This leads to people going over on operations more frequently.

I am not talking about recruitment training but some sniper courses ect..

We need snipers to support operations. If we dont get newly-trained snipers that means we have to deploye the old ones again and again and........That leads them to leave the CF....round and round we go.

Also, if the company is going on the next tour and work up training is coming up, we need to utilize other companies  to conduct some of the courses, again if this is possible.

Maybe that "other company" you are refering to , is the one that just came back from tour. Maybe they wouldnt mind some home time as well. See what i am getting at ? IMHO, its lose-lose.

It will not help the Army if we are loosing valuable combat experience to things that can or might be controlled.

The government controls the pace of operations. Most other things that the CF has to do is required to sustain and support those operations. I know that there are things the CF can control ( lenght of pre-deployement training anyone ?) but IMHO, we are in a perfect storm. We do not have the manpower we need and we dont have the resources to correct that situation.

 

[blacktriangle]

I think that the we need to look at the " Retention aspect" We are loosing valuable members everyday due to circumstances the forces can control.

For example:

Getting a 6 week Tasking then home for 48 hours then getting tasked out again for another 8 weeks because we are short of bodies. Coming home for 3 weeks leave then start a year of work up training.

The members were told that the pace is not going to stop. So from a spouses point of view. I am looking at for the next 2 and half years, my husband will not be home. I know for a fact that 4 of my friends husbands have put their releases in due to the pace and no home time.

Just my 2 cents.

Just as they burn out the Reg Force, the slow CT process makes it very discouraging for res members to step up and fill the void. I hate to bitch, but they seem to put so much emphasis getting fresh troops they forget about who they already have. Excellent course reports, perfect attendance, stepping up to help pers shortages...doesn't seem to matter.

I'm 18, not going to school next year, and looking to step up...I'm not looking to be rich, or to be treated amazing. Just want the chance to do my job, is that so much to ask?

Until then, I just spend everyday at the beach.  8)

 

[aesop081]

the slow CT process makes

The CT process is "robing Peter to pay Paul" IMHO. Its not a long term solution to the RegF shortages and doesnt help reserve units keeping experience at the unit level.

 

[Booked_Spice]

Thanks CDN,

I understand it is a lose- lose situation. I also understand without the resources it is hard to manage. But it is frustrating to see so many people who have great experience and leadership throwing in the towel. This doesn't help matters, it makes it worse. I am not sure there is a solution to the amount of releases going in, but  like I mentioned it should be investigated why the army is double compared to other areas. I am sure there are more reasons other then the pace. If those reasons can be rectified then maybe we can have more retention. More retention equals more resources.

Thanks

 

[blacktriangle]

The CT process is "robing Peter to pay Paul" IMHO. Its not a long term solution to the RegF shortages and doesnt help reserve units keeping experience at the unit level.

I would agree with that conclusion in some instances.

However, if you were to see what I actually do on a day to day basis (at least where I am)  you might agree that 6 months from now I will bring more to the table as a RegF Pte then I will as a reserve Cpl. Spaces need to be filled, so I say fill them.

For units/trades in the res that really do nothing on an average workday, and can't train properly, the regs might as well get the guys that want to soldier. There will be plenty of once a weekers and Class B lifers to fill the gap I'm sure.

 

[Big Red]

Why are there not retention bonuses for EVERY trade? Could you not give an infantry Pte whos basic engagement is up $100,000 and still come out ahead?

 

[Yrys]

Could you not give an infantry Pte whos basic engagement is up $100,000 and still come out ahead?

Isn't that a bit much ?

 

[aesop081]

Why are there not retention bonuses for EVERY trade? Could you not give an infantry Pte whos basic engagement is up $100,000 and still come out ahead?

While i fully support bonuses when one re-signs, i do not think that it will significantly help the situation we are in now.

my 2 cents

 

[Big Red]

Isn't that a bit much ?

What are the costs associated with recruiting, basic training, trades training, QL4s, workup trg, etc he takes in his first three years? When someone releases you lose all of that, plus their experience.

$100k is just a number I threw out, I'm sure a much smaller amount would entice some to stay in. Right now AFAIK there is no incentive to sign your next contract besides keeping your job.

 

[QV]

Not only would that help retention, but also recruitment.  Everybody loves a big lump sum cheque.

 

[aesop081]

Not only would that help retention, but also recruitment.  Everybody loves a big lump sum cheque.

Until people are back at the point of rundown and no home time and then they figure out that the money isnt worth it. Bonuses alone will accomplish nothing in the long term.

IMHO of course