Fleet of armoured trucks plagued with problems

[TheHead]

I suppose I could ding you for attitude, but instead I'll just say that redundant posts really don't help your case.  Some originality could have better served your subjective views.  Should I go around cleaning up repetative posts or just leave them........seeing as currently your post in the other topic is just two down below this topic at present......perhaps I should. 

Fleet of armoured trucks plagued with problems « 1 2  All »  GAP  18  998  Today at 14:53:27    by TheHead 

Family of Future Combat Vehicles  Bubbles  0  39  Today at 13:16:57    by Bubbles 

Canada buys Buffalo & Cougar MPV for Afghanistan  Allen  11  523  Today at 02:29:15    by TheHead 

:

So people who think the Nyalla are the greatest thing in the world but have no "Originality" for their views can post whatever they please praising the vehicle.  But when someone has something bad to say they need to make a huge elaborate thesis on why it's shit when experience isn't enough.    Good Logic George  :  I see a whole lot of hypocrisy going on here.

 

[George Wallace]

:  I suppose you can read and comprehend the English language, or is it a second language for you?  If English is a second language for you, then I can understand why you are misinterpreting what is posted.  It won't be the first time that a poster on these forums has faced these problems.

I have neither praised, nor condemned the Nyala.  I have just pointed out that your repeating the same sentences over and over do nothing to develop your argument.  If you were to use some more originality and elaborate more in the defence of your position you would be better off.  You can sit here all day and say it is crap over and over, but unless you stop being repetitive, you'll get nowhere. 

I have provided reference to your other post, in the other discusion, and although it is for all practical purposes identical to your post here, does open up room for two discusions along the same lines of thought that will eventually have to be merged.

 

[TheHead]

The RG-31 I think is one of the best vehs we could have had over there. I know there were issues with the alternator whereby you could not run the RWS, A/C and the black box at the same time, but they had been resloved by the time I left in Feb.
The biggest problem was drivers...yes drivers! Know what the veh is capable of...you can't go full throttle though grape fields and not expect to break something...however a little more suspension would be nice.
On the whole...I think the RGs are being employed better now, minimizing down time

  I disagree with your statement here.  Blaming the drivers is a scapegoat for an item purchased without any thought involved.  During tactical road moves you have no choice but to keep up with the convoy as a driver (Try arguing with a cocky Coy 2 i/c about the limitations of the Nyalla and you'll be doing shitter burning detail at FOB Robinson for a month).  During Night Road Moves with no headlights the drivers were severely handicapped due to the fact all the lights on the dashboard light up hampering his night vision capabilities and putting the crew and passengers in harms way. More than once we found ourselves cock eyes in a wadi or almost on the verge of rolling down a hill due to the fact our Platoon commander wouldn't allow us to drive lights on.

  Now to the second point.  Any Tactical road moves at night without headlights was wasted on the fact that the gunners display lights up the entire vehicle.  You're basically a slow moving target for timmy Taliban.

  Than there is the issue about kit.  Now I don't know about unit SOPs but when your section commander has the common sense of a brick the SOP was to keep your rucksacks in the Nyalla. How do  you fit 7 rucksacks on or in that thing?  We were forced to strap them to the sides/top/keep them inside all jammed in there.  Well this raises huge issues #1.  Any Rucksack on the top is an issue for the turrets mobility.
                                                                                                                                  #2.  Any Rucksack INSIDE the Nyalla becomes a projectile if hit with an IED/Mine.
                                                                                                                                  #3.  Any Rucksacks on the Side hurt the occupants vision through the windows.

  Than we have the RWS. An amazing piece of kit if you plan on staying on the pavement. The optics system is what we should now have in the LAV3.  Any Tactical Road moves off road, the thing is useless (Unless a stab has been incorporated now).  Also how fragile the RWS is a big issue a night sized rock will put that thing out of action.

 

[TheHead]

Also George I never stated YOU were talking about the Nyalla once did I?  I was stating that people in this thread who are praising it are also not developing their argument are they?
Also please stop with the sarcasm it's petty  :  If you want a pissing match take this to PMs.  Thank you.

 

[3rd Herd]

Mods free to Move:
The usual Disclaimer:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2007/08/05/nbook105.xml

Christopher Booker's notebook
By Christopher Booker, Sunday Telegraph
Last Updated: 12:51am BST 05/08/2007
The death of a Pinzgauer driver

More than once last year this column strongly questioned the decision by the Ministry of Defence to equip our troops in Afghanistan with 100 Pinzgauer Vector patrol vehicles. These are not "mine-protected", unlike various vehicles the MoD rejected for the role, such as the RG-31, made in South Africa by BAe Systems, or the Australian-built Bushmaster. To send such vehicles to a country with more mines than any other in the world seemed inexplicable.

As the Tory defence spokesman, Gerald Howarth MP, observes on his website, the Pinzgauer "does not provide much better protection than the Snatch Land Rover" that it was intended to replace.

The week before last, as reported by my colleague Dr Richard North on his website, www.eureferendum.com, three Nato patrol vehicles in Afghanistan were blown up by insurgents. The crews of a Canadian RG-31 and a Dutch Bushmaster escaped unhurt. When a British Pinzgauer was hit by a roadside bomb, one soldier died and two were seriously injured.

When I asked Pinzgauer to comment on this very unfortunate news, the company referred me to the MoD. The MoD said on Friday that it is "still investigating the incident".

What you are not allowed to know…
http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/
We can only speculate as to why that might be but, those with an idle moment might care to look at this entirely unrelated site which, of course, has absolutely nothing to do with the Booker story.

Remaining in speculation mode, the thought occurs that the MoD might possibly be keen to conceal details about what is known in the trade as a "cock-up", spending huge amounts of money on sending a dangerously vulnerable vehicle to Afghanistan, putting our troops unnecessarily at risk.

However, it surely cannot be because the MoD wants to conceal this information from the terrorists. They have been highly adept at producing detailed video training films, which they post on the internet, identifying coalition force vehicles, their weak points and the tactics for destroying them. Routinely, they film their own IED hits and post them on websites as well.

Thus, one might just speculate that the real concern of the MoD is to conceal their own failures from the British public and taxpayers, and from the soldiers who must ride in these "coffins on wheels", in procuring inadequate vehicles when cheaper, better vehicles are readily available.

See also:
Coffins on wheels
Monday, June 26, 2006
http://eureferendum.blogspot.com/2006/06/coffins-on-wheels.html
"Smith then remarks that the Canadians have bought the RG-31 for use in Afghanistan but, strangely, does not mention that the US has bought 148 for use in Iraq for protection against IEDs. "Ministers still defend the decision not to go for the RG-31," he then tells us, "It might have proven effective against land mines. It might be good enough for the Canadians. You might even be able to get it on the ground very quickly. But its profile is all wrong and it's just that bit too big for Basra."

 

[Jammer]

  I disagree with your statement here.  Blaming the drivers is a scapegoat for an item purchased without any thought involved.   During tactical road moves you have no choice but to keep up with the convoy as a driver (Try arguing with a cocky Coy 2 i/c about the limitations of the Nyalla and you'll be doing shitter burning detail at FOB Robinson for a month).   During Night Road Moves with no headlights the drivers were severely handicapped due to the fact all the lights on the dashboard light up hampering his night vision capabilities and putting the crew and passengers in harms way. More than once we found ourselves **** eyes in a wadi or almost on the verge of rolling down a hill due to the fact our Platoon commander wouldn't allow us to drive lights on.

  Now to the second point.  Any Tactical road moves at night without headlights was wasted on the fact that the gunners display lights up the entire vehicle.   You're basically a slow moving target for timmy Taliban.

  Than there is the issue about kit.  Now I don't know about unit SOPs but when your section commander has the common sense of a brick the SOP was to keep your rucksacks in the Nyalla. How do  you fit 7 rucksacks on or in that thing?   We were forced to strap them to the sides/top/keep them inside all jammed in there.   Well this raises huge issues #1.  Any Rucksack on the top is an issue for the turrets mobility.
                                                                                                                                  #2.  Any Rucksack INSIDE the Nyalla becomes a projectile if hit with an IED/Mine.
                                                                                                                                  #3.  Any Rucksacks on the Side hurt the occupants vision through the windows.

   Than we have the RWS. An amazing piece of kit if you plan on staying on the pavement. The optics system is what we should now have in the LAV3.   Any Tactical Road moves off road, the thing is useless (Unless a stab has been incorporated now).  Also how fragile the RWS is a big issue a night sized rock will put that thing out of action.

 

[a_majoor]

From what I have seen, the probems with the RG-31 are mostly reated to attempting to upgrade the machine and make it do things it was not designed to do. As a mine proof transport, it is a great machine (that's what it was made for, after all). Going cross country or adding extra kit to turn it into a fighting vehicle is asking for trouble, although the design seems adaptable enough to take some of these roles.

Like I said earlier, the entire concept of APV's isn't really defined, so I suspect you could cobble together almost anything and declare it to be an APV. The vast differences in size, weight, shape and fighting ability of various APV's in service would seem to point to that (you notice in many other categories of military equipment like AFV's, IFV's and even medium weight fighting machines the products that different nations build and use are actualy quite similar in size, weight and layout).

Until the role and use of APVs is defined, I think we will see lots of disagreements as to the utility and use of vehicles like the RG-31, Vector, Bushmaster, Cougar etc.