Direct Entry Officer (DEO) questions [Merged]

[George Wallace]

Several things -mike:

First it is hard to take someone seriously who claims to have numerous Degrees and can't use proper grammar.  (See Army.ca Conduct Guidelines)  If your written form is as bad as your post, you will not pass the strict standards expected of your written products.

Second thing would be that if you can not provide a list of locations you have lived, nor not have lived in Canada, dating back ten years (with no break in timeline), then you are not likely to get a Security Clearance.  Without a Security Clearance you are not likely to be accepted into the CF, especially in the Intelligence field.  All this on top of the long line ups of people currently in the Recruiting Process or aspiring to start that process, a process that is currently frozen.

Currently the INT Branch has a two to three year backlog in applicants, and is weeding them out.

 

[Cdnleaf]

hi everyone -
i've done some reading up here and on the CF website, but it's always nice to have some human opinions, too. 
i'm coming toward the end of my PhD in anthropology and am considering applying to the CF.  intelligence officer seems like it fits my skills and interest. 
on most aspects of recruitment i feel fine - i'm in excellent shape, good health, speak a few languages, etc.  i was with the cadets as a kid, so range and drill might come back to me a bit easier than a complete rookie. 
however, since the age of 10 i've lived in about 8 countries and traveled to 40 or so.  things like listing my addresses will be a serious challenge - i literally can't remember them all.  similarly, providing medical records - i haven't had a conisistent family doctor since i was a kid. 
so i'm guessing that if i go through with it, the recruitment process for me would take ages?
\also, does anyone have any insights in entering CF with a PhD?  any changes in entry rank etc? 
and specific insights into the intelligence officer track?
thanks!
-mike

Human opinions as opposed to what, opinions from those with non-retractable thumbs?  ;D  Anyways, your PhD will get you 2 or 3 points if/when you're eventually merited for promotion.  OCdt to Capt is pretty automatic providing you keep out the schmidt and pass all courses; Common Army Phase should be fun if you get there.  I don't work with CFRG, however believe as a DEO to Int O, your degree will not accord you any particular advantage compared to those with a BA.  All the best / Dan.

 

[jackel_99]

Though yes a PhD will help you along your track, as cdnleaf says, I don't think it will fast track you as much as you assume it would.  You should have saved the 4 - 6 years of doing a masters and PhD, and joined when you had a BA.  By now you would have been promoted, and on your way to a great career.  There are many great people in the forces who have the drive, determination and skills that only have a BA.  Trust me you will have competition from many people, who didn't spend 5 years getting a PhD.

** Though it does help a little, personally I would have stopped at a Masters**

On a side note, you cannot enter the CF as an int officer.  You must transfer into the trade from another, and there is a long line up.  Therefore you must join a trade, such as arty and stick it out for a while until you transfer.

Your Anthropology major might not help you as much as you think either, and obviously limits some of the choices you can go into (engineering .. medical ..)

I don't know if you have a great passion to be a member of the forces, or you have just realized holy crap I need a job ... but I would think about what would be best for your education.  Obviously you are smart, perhaps CSIS or foreign affairs would be another option if you don't want to compete with 25 year olds with a BA ;D

just my personal opinion

 

[George Wallace]

just my personal opinion

Yes.  Your personal opinion.  Perhaps you'd like to also post from where you are coming from to make such an opinion so as to give the OP the benifit of knowing from whence it came.  Looking at your profile, you owe the OP an explanation.

 

[Journeyman]

just my personal opinion

Looking at your profile, you owe the OP an explanation.

Sorry George, I have to disagree.

A quick glance through a posting history shows a track record of recruiting advice from someone not even in the CF -- no further explanation required.

I am interested in becoming a MARS officer....

The line for INT officer is years long ... Thats what I was going to do

I applied for DEO Armour

Life in the military is not "easy" and it changes with the wind....expect to go overseas once every 3 years or so for a tour

Being an officer will help after the military, but your degree will be what really helps you. 

And my favourite  ;D

My only problem with the game is that me and all my peeps are still playing MW2 daily...

Quite often, free advice is worth exactly what's paid 

 

[iron_mike]

Hello everyone, and thanks for the feedback.  Briefly:

-George: I'm sorry if my grammar or style was inappropriate; I didn't mean any disrespect.  Other than assuring you that my written and verbal communication skills are excellent, and assuring you that I have a good command of the language in my publications and in my professional work, I'm not sure how to convince you to "take me seriously" as someone with "numerous degrees."  I'm confident, though, of my ability to pass standards for written work and don't believe that would be a serious obstacle to a military career for me, though I appreciate the concern.

-As for recruitment, though, you seem  be to saying that the process is logjammed right now and I'd be looking at a serious wait.  Do you think it's best to begin the process while I have other 'irons in other fires'?  I can't realistically be unemployed for 2 years while waiting for an answer!

-cdnleaf: Considering my 9-5 work, yes - I often need to go out of my way to get opinions from primates with opposable thumbs!  Thanks for the input and it's nice to know the extra degrees might help even a little bit.

-jackel: Thanks for the input.  To be honest, I pursued the training I did because I had a passion for the material and the work, and because I thought I might help some people along the way (I do health/development research).  A CF career option was in the cards when I was a teen, but I've always figured education is a good investment regardless.  I'm 30 now and as fit as I was when I was 18, so I'm not too worried about having to compete with 24-year-olds!  CSIS and DFAIT are also avenues I'm exploring right now.  They're also looking at long backlogs and even recruitment freezes, so I'm trying to learn about all my options at this point.  I don't graduate for another year, so now seems like the time to be laying the groundwork.

-journeyman: Thanks for the . . . um. . . fact checking. 

Thanks again all.  I don't live in Canada, so visiting a recruiter isn't an option for the time being.  Glad for this forum, though - it's a great resource!


-Mike

 

[FDO]

Lets do this one line at a time;

hough yes a PhD will help you along your track, as cdnleaf says, I don't think it will fast track you as much as you assume it would.

The higher your education and the better your marks gives you a better score when calculating your "Military Potential" So yes a PHD is better than a BA (Bachelor of Anything) Sorry if that offend any BA's

You should have saved the 4 - 6 years of doing a masters and PhD, and joined when you had a BA.

Didn't realize getting a PHD was a waste if time. Good thing I know that I'll scratch it off my "bucket List"

By now you would have been promoted, and on your way to a great career.

Really, You have a crystal ball that says if he joins now he WON'T have a good career and get promoted?

There are many great people in the forces who have the drive, determination and skills that only have a BA.

PHD = Slug? And here I thought you needed drive and determination to get a PHD. I guess they DO come in a Cracker Jack box!!

This one in my fav!!

On a side note, you cannot enter the CF as an int officer.  You must transfer into the trade from another, and there is a long line up.  Therefore you must join a trade, such as arty and stick it out for a while until you transfer.

I guess thins have changed since I was a Recruiter in February. We were hiring INT O straight off the street back then and for the 3 years I was a Recruiter.

The rest is just to idiotic to comment on except this;

just my personal opinion

Keep it to yourself!!!

Iron_mike

Go in and talk to a RECRUITER in a RECRUITING CENTRE!! They will be able to give you all the info you want. Have a list of questions and ask them one at a time and write down the answers so you have them for later reference. Look on line or in the Yellow Pages for a Recruiting Office near you!!

 

[George Wallace]

Sorry George, I have to disagree.

A quick glance through a posting history shows a track record of recruiting advice from someone not even in the CF -- no further explanation required.

Actually, that was the point I was making.

 

[Michael OLeary]

-As for recruitment, though, you seem  be to saying that the process is logjammed right now and I'd be looking at a serious wait.  Do you think it's best to begin the process while I have other 'irons in other fires'?  I can't realistically be unemployed for 2 years while waiting for an answer!

Yes, the system is jammed up right now, with many trades and occupations having no definite openings in sight.  But, if it's something you really want, start the process. At the same time, pursue your best other options with equal determination.  If your recruiting process takes a year or more, your situation may have changed to the extent that a CF career may not be your best, or preferred, option.  When you find yourself at that decision point, you can reassess the viability of your CF application and withdraw it at any time.

 

[Journeyman]

iron_mike, check your PMs.

The "fact checking" had to suffice because personal attacks on site members is not allowed. Use the info as you see fit.

 

[Cdnleaf]

Hello everyone, and thanks for the feedback.  Briefly:

-cdnleaf: Considering my 9-5 work, yes - I often need to go out of my way to get opinions from primates with opposable thumbs!  Thanks for the input and it's nice to know the extra degrees might help even a little bit.

:cheers:  Healthy sense of humour will bode you a long way in the CF.  Good luck with the process and sincere congratulations on completing your PhD; a noteworthy accomplishment in any discipline/profession.

 

[Pusser]

-jackel: Thanks for the input.  To be honest, I pursued the training I did because I had a passion for the material and the work, and because I thought I might help some people along the way (I do health/development research).  A CF career option was in the cards when I was a teen, but I've always figured education is a good investment regardless. 

There is no finer argument for the pursuit of education.  This is supposed to be what higher education is all about.  Universities are not job training centres!  Good luck in your work.

 

[Labtc]

Hello, this is my first post, but i've been reading things on these message boards for a few months now. I'm a year from graduating from a civilian university and planning on applying as a DEO officer (I'd like either Armour or Artillery). My major is military history and my minor is psychology. I was wondering how important marks are as a DEO applicant? Mine aren't terrible, but they aren't great either (2.5 GPA), so do your marks matter a great deal in the application process? I know the RMC has pretty high standards, and if I partied a little less in my first two years of school I'd probably have much higher marks also. Anyone with any knowlage of this please let me know. Thanks

 

[mathabos]

If the criteria for a DEO candidate is the same at for ROTP then I would say that you need to look at
other factors on top of marks.

During an interview, the recruiter is looking for a well rounded person. They look for extra curricular activities
that involve some sort of leadership skill (especially for officer candidates).
For example: volunteering, team sports, being the president of an association at your school, etc.

I would say that good marks do help but they are not the only factor to be considered.

 

[Pusser]

Once you have a degree, the most important thing is that you have the degree.  I would suggest concentrating on the other aspects of your resume (since you can't go back and un-party anyway).

 

[mattg]

I am thinking of joining up through the DEO plan and was wondering if anyone here could answer some questions I have.

From what I can tell from the CF recruiting site, some DEO candidates are commissioned as 2nd LT while others immediately as a full LT. Is this the case? Also, why would some start off with a higher rank? (ie level of education education, language proficiency, career path in the forces, previous leadership experience, etc)

Thanks in advance for your help

Matt

 

[Trick]

I'm a little curious about this myself. If you don't mind my asking, what are you looking to do? My understanding is that pilots don't follow the normal line, and I imagine the same is true for a few other trades. I know this is the case in some, especially more technical, NCM trades.

 

[mattg]

I'd like to get a position as an intelligence officer, which from my understanding progresses along normal lines (as opposed to pilots, medical officers, etc), except that there are fewer positions for promotion past the rank of Captain, so it would be more competitive than say an infantry or armored officer. I'm interested in how intitial rank is determined because I have a masters degree in a relevant field and some previous leadership experience.

 

[Drag]

Commissions directly to LT and Capt depend on the trade and military experience.  As a DEO with no previous service you would only get commissioned to a rank other then 2Lt if your trade calls for it.  While most of those trades require advanced degrees, not necessarily, since I believe MPs get commissioned to Lt and require only a bachelor.  Having a PhD will not get you commissioned to anything other then 2Lt in the infantry for example.  However, having an advanced degree will get you in at a higher pay incentive level.

 

[mattg]

Thanks for the help.