CDN/US Covid-related political discussion

[MilEME09]

Opposition MPs call for emergency probe of health agency's use of Canadians' mobile data during COVID

It is 'extremely alarming' that a government body would use the pandemic as an excuse to secretly collect the mobile data of Canadians without telling them, a Conse…

calgaryherald.com

Well now, conspiracy nuts will be all over this

 

[Fishbone Jones]

And the 95% will not convince the 4% they are wrong and the 95% are right. The government lied about masks. The government lied about social distancing. The government lied about the vaccine. The government has used coercion, lies, threats, false data and now forced vaccines are being prepared. Call them mandates or whatever you want. Make no mistake, going down this road may cross a line which we won't come back from. What will be the next thing trudeau decides is good for us and with the precedence set, makes it mandatory under threat of fines or jail?

 

[Quirky]

And the 95% will not convince the 4% they are wrong and the 95% are right. The government lied about masks. The government lied about social distancing. The government lied about the vaccine. The government has used coercion, lies, threats, false data and now forced vaccines are being prepared. Call them mandates or whatever you want. Make no mistake, going down this road may cross a line which we won't come back from. What will be the next thing trudeau decides is good for us and with the precedence set, makes it mandatory under threat of fines or jail?

Trust the science. It’s never wrong.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

The government lied about masks. The government lied about social distancing. The government lied about the vaccine. View attachment 68064

And those lies were???

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Opposition MPs call for emergency probe of health agency's use of Canadians' mobile data during COVID

It is 'extremely alarming' that a government body would use the pandemic as an excuse to secretly collect the mobile data of Canadians without telling them, a Conse…

calgaryherald.com

Well now, conspiracy nuts will be all over this

Why? Because the government surreptitiously and secretly tracked the locations of unaware citizens. Spying on Canadians, collecting data on them, invading their privacy? Yeah, no conspiracy there. Just normal trudeau government SOPs.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

A Damning Letter.
The facts, with references, from BC Health Practioners and Concerned Citizens. A letter that cuts through the gobally goop and political and media spin and double talk. Make your own judgements.

A Damning Letter ——Open Letter to Dr. Bonnie Henry, Adrian Dix, and Premier John Horgan (Links Restored)Of British Columbia

September 11, 2021 Open Letter to Dr. Bonnie Henry, Adrian Dix, and Premier John Horgan We are a group of extremely concerned health professionals in the Okanagan Valley, B.C. We have s…

peckford42.wordpress.com

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

I did......and won't get that 20 minutes back.

Way back to last Sept and Anonymous. Hey look....another straw just ran by.

 

[Fishbone Jones]

So you don’t want the measles vaccine to be mandatory? How about Polio?

It is recommended by the medical community, that if you have natural immunity to those diseases, you don't get vaccinated for it. A recent study from Israel says that the natural immunity to covid is better and stronger than the vaccination. So why does someone with natural immunity have to get jabbed?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

I did......and won't get that 20 minutes back.

Way back to last Sept and Anonymous. Hey look....another straw just ran by.

20 minutes without checking the references. 20 minutes for that narrative? See Dick. See Sally. See Dick and Sally run.

 

[Weinie]

There are tens of millions of pro-vaxx parents/people in Canada.
So, for the approx. 92% of those 12+ who have chosen vaccines and those approx 2-3.5% who can’t get vaccines for legitimate health reasons, those 94-95.5% 12+, they’re calling the shots and the 4.5-6% are just going to have to deal with it.
This is a democratic country, and within the framework of the law, the 95.5% can do whatever the heck they want. Those 4% can protest all they want, as is their right, they can launch as many legal challenges as they want, but guess what? As things stand right now, they will not convince the 95% that they are wrong and the 4% is right.

Here is the real problem.

John Ivison: Legault's draconian overreach on the unvaccinated is no cure for the malady

From the article:

"The cure is not to further polarize the population but to treat the malady — the lack of health-care surge capacity.

Take Ontario as an example — between 1990 and 2017, the province saw its population increase 36 per cent. At the same time, its hospital bed count fell from 33,403 to 18,571. Hospitals were operating at 130 per cent capacity, even before the pandemic.

At 2.5 beds per 1000 inhabitants, Canada compares poorly to countries like France (5.8 beds) and Germany (7.9).

........Yet, rather than risk being blamed for the system’s limitations, Legault has engaged in the time-honoured tradition of political deflection."

Provinces have had two years to react to Covid-19. They have been sounding the alarm about the collapse of the Health care system for at least 18 months, yet did little to address it.

 

[Altair]

Here is the real problem.

John Ivison: Legault's draconian overreach on the unvaccinated is no cure for the malady

From the article:

"The cure is not to further polarize the population but to treat the malady — the lack of health-care surge capacity.

Take Ontario as an example — between 1990 and 2017, the province saw its population increase 36 per cent. At the same time, its hospital bed count fell from 33,403 to 18,571. Hospitals were operating at 130 per cent capacity, even before the pandemic.

At 2.5 beds per 1000 inhabitants, Canada compares poorly to countries like France (5.8 beds) and Germany (7.9).

........Yet, rather than risk being blamed for the system’s limitations, Legault has engaged in the time-honoured tradition of political deflection."

Provinces have had two years to react to Covid-19. They have been sounding the alarm about the collapse of the Health care system for at least 18 months, yet did little to address it.

I hate comments like our health care is better than the USA.

Well, yes, we are not rock bottom, but that doesn't make us good. We are in many ways second worse in the western world, absolutely garbage compared to Europe, but we don't notice because of the tire fire next door.

 

[The Bread Guy]

And those lies were???

One man's lies are another man's "changing rules as we learn more about the virus & how it evolves"

 

[OceanBonfire]

The CEO of United said 3,000 employees have COVID - but that the airline's vaccine mandate is working: 0 are currently hospitalized. Prior to the mandate, more than one United employee, on average, was dying from COVID per week:

United says 3,000 employees have COVID, but its vaccine mandate has saved lives

In a memo to employees, United CEO Scott Kirby said the airline has 3,000 employees who are currently positive for Covid but that zero of its vaccinated employees are currently hospitalized.

www.npr.org

 

[lenaitch]

I don’t pay taxes if I don’t buy sugary products. I don’t pay taxes if I don’t buy cigarettes. I pay taxes that pay for roads when I buy gasoline. Why should I pay for a system I don’t use as much as everyone else? The portion taken off my pay to keep this crippled system afloat hasn’t given anything back to me because of my choices.

A true market driven healthcare system would see costs go down, service level go up, for 95% of the population its a win-win. I’m done subsidizing mooches which is why we need a hybrid model at a minimum for users to have some sense of financial burden and responsibility. The other 5% can keep calling 911 for constipation. People who are obsessed with a free healthcare system have never experienced anything else.

Here is the real problem.

John Ivison: Legault's draconian overreach on the unvaccinated is no cure for the malady

From the article:

"The cure is not to further polarize the population but to treat the malady — the lack of health-care surge capacity.

Take Ontario as an example — between 1990 and 2017, the province saw its population increase 36 per cent. At the same time, its hospital bed count fell from 33,403 to 18,571. Hospitals were operating at 130 per cent capacity, even before the pandemic.

At 2.5 beds per 1000 inhabitants, Canada compares poorly to countries like France (5.8 beds) and Germany (7.9).

........Yet, rather than risk being blamed for the system’s limitations, Legault has engaged in the time-honoured tradition of political deflection."

Provinces have had two years to react to Covid-19. They have been sounding the alarm about the collapse of the Health care system for at least 18 months, yet did little to address it.

I certainly don't want to let government off the hook but, simply in terms of people, I'm not sure what could have been accomplished in 18 months. In Ontario, it takes 4 years to train a Registered Nurse and about 10 years to train a doctor. These not counting any additional specialties. We could build 1000 new ICU spaces but have nobody to staff them. The bottleneck in the pipelines predates the pandemic.

 

[YZT580]

Could have re-opened those beds that have been closed. Most of the physical plants still exist. They could easily have been used as covid (low treatment) facilities with staffing being drawn from our core of RPNs and those retired types that were refused reinstatement or perhaps those immigrants who have the training but can't get endorsed in Canada. there are options other than wringing our hands and locking everybody up, just saying.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

Could have re-opened those beds that have been closed. Most of the physical plants still exist. They could easily have been used as covid (low treatment) facilities with staffing being drawn from our core of RPNs and those retired types that were refused reinstatement or perhaps those immigrants who have the training but can't get endorsed in Canada. there are options other than wringing our hands and locking everybody up, just saying.

Once again. ....there IS NO STAFFING TO PULL FROM. I know a dietitian therapist who is pulling ICI duties.....

 

[PMedMoe]

Once again. ....there IS NO STAFFING TO PULL FROM. I know a dietitian therapist who is pulling ICI duties.....

Yeah, people keep saying "Open more beds!" but without people to staff them, more beds are useless.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Yeah, people keep saying "Open more beds!" but without people to staff them, more beds are useless.

... and "if all those unvaccinated nurses/other health professionals were allowed to work, we wouldn't be so short."

 

[QV]

Once again. ....there IS NO STAFFING TO PULL FROM. I know a dietitian therapist who is pulling ICI duties.....

Staffing challenges you say? I think they should put more people on LWOP then. The people they punted worked through the entire pandemic from the start and probably have natural immunity, and they kicked them to the curb. You just can't make this shit up.

And now we're hearing officially that a majority of the "C19 deaths" probably died from something else but just happened to be positive with C19 at the time.

 

[QV]

... and "if all those unvaccinated nurses/other health professionals were allowed to work, we wouldn't be so short."

Said as though it makes no difference.

Keep believing.