Canada's tanks

[Kirkhill]

Danish ships with Rheinmetall Oerlikon Contraves 35mm Millenium 35/1000 KDG GDM-008 gun and turret

Iver Huitfeldt class Guided Missile Frigate Royal Danish Navy

iver huitfeldt class guided missile frigate ffg royal danish navy hdms peter willemoes niels juel

www.seaforces.org

Absalon class Frigate Command Support Ship Royal Danish Navy

absalon class frigate command support ship royal danish navy hdms esbern snare stanflex essm missile harpoon

www.seaforces.org

Switzerland 35 mm/1000 Millennium - NavWeaps

www.navweaps.com

Evolution

Skyguard GDF-001 to -005 (owned by Canada I believe)

Oerlikon GDF - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Skyshield with the 35/1000 guns

Skyshield - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

And now

Skynex - open architecture

Rheinmetall

The modern air defence system Oerlikon Skynex is based on a concept to separate air traffic control from the effectors.

www.rheinmetall.com

Ukraine has already received Rheinmetall Skynex short-range air defense systems • Mezha.Media

Rheinmetall Skynex short-range air defense systems have already been put on combat duty in Ukraine. It was announced by Prime Minister of Ukraine Denys

mezha.media

Germany Buys Rheinmetall Air Defense Systems for Ukraine

Germany has contracted Rheinmetall to deliver two Skynex air defense systems to Ukraine for $192 million.

www.thedefensepost.com

The Gepard is basically the same 35mm gun with the same AHEAD ammunition mounted on a Leopard 1 hull.

Oerlikon GDF - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Flugabwehrkanonenpanzer Gepard
Service history
Specifications
Gepard 1A2 of the German Army
Type	Self-propelled anti-aircraft gun
Place of origin	West Germany
In service	1976–present
Used by	See Operators
Wars	Kosovo Conflict Russo-Ukrainian War
Mass	47.5 t (46.7 long tons; 52.4 short tons)
Length	Overall: 7.68 m (25 ft 2 in)
Width	3.71 m (12 ft 2 in)
Height	Radar retracted: 3.29 m (10 ft 10 in)
Crew	3 (driver, gunner, commander)
Armor	conventional steel
Main armament	2 × 35 mm Oerlikon GDF autocannon, each with 320 rounds anti-air ammunition and 20 rounds anti-tank
Secondary armament	2 × quad 76mm smoke grenade dischargers
Engine	10-cylinder, 37,400 cc (2,280 cu in) MTU multi-fuel engine 830 PS (819 hp, 610 kW)
Power/weight	17.5 PS/t
Suspension	Torsion bar suspension
Operational range	550 km (340 mi)
Maximum speed	65 km/h (40 mph)

 

[Spencer100]

Ok friends. You're in charge you have 3 billion to buy a new system for the Canadian Forces. But from. Rheinmetall you can choose Leo 2A8 or Skyguard systems? Which one? No spilt buy.


Me after watch the Ukraine war I would say Air defence first.

 

[MilEME09]

Ok friends. You're in charge you have 3 billion to buy a new system for the Canadian Forces. But from. Rheinmetall you can choose Leo 2A8 or Skyguard systems? Which one? No spilt buy.


Me after watch the Ukraine war I would say Air defence first.

Both, let's put sky guard on a leopard 2 chassis

 

[Maxman1]

The Leopard 2 hull is a bit overkill for a SPAAG. The Griffin II or M109 hull might be a better fit.

 

[KevinB]

The Leopard 2 hull is a bit overkill for a SPAAG. The Griffin II or M109 hull might be a better fit.

Only works if you have a common hull IMHO.

If Canada is to retain the Leo 2 as its MBT, then a Geopard 2 sort of makes sense for that formation, but since Canada has LAV’s as it’s IFV, the MSHORAD LAV makes more sense, and has both Missile and gun.

If Canada was to get a Tracked IFV, then I’d suggest that the looking at both MSHORAD turret and an Oerlikon Revolver 3 turret version makes sense.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Ok friends. You're in charge you have 3 billion to buy a new system for the Canadian Forces. But from. Rheinmetall you can choose Leo 2A8 or Skyguard systems? Which one? No spilt buy.


Me after watch the Ukraine war I would say Air defence first.

I am buying Korean, Likely get tanks, SPG and have money left over to buy Skyguard

 

[KevinB]

I am buying Korean, Likely get tanks, SPG and have money left over to buy Skyguard

3B would buy enough CV90’s to equip 2 Bde’s, and have some $ left over.
Including specialty variants

Then donate the Leo2’s to Ukraine and get an Abrams MBT for the two heavy Bde.

You can then have 2 Heavy Bde, 2 Medium (LAV), and 2 Light.
Making 2 real Div’s
1 Armor Div (2 Heavy and 1 Med) and a Light Div (2 Lt Bde plus a Med for protected mobility)

Yes you still need a bunch of SPA for the Armor Div, and a bunch of Div enablers for both Div’s. But you have a credible force for all spectrums.

 

[FJAG]

3B would buy enough CV90’s to equip 2 Bde’s, and have some $ left over.
Including specialty variants

Then donate the Leo2’s to Ukraine and get an Abrams MBT for the two heavy Bde.

You can then have 2 Heavy Bde, 2 Medium (LAV), and 2 Light.
Making 2 real Div’s
1 Armor Div (2 Heavy and 1 Med) and a Light Div (2 Lt Bde plus a Med for protected mobility)

Yes you still need a bunch of SPA for the Armor Div, and a bunch of Div enablers for both Div’s. But you have a credible force for all spectrums.

This gets me back to the "two armies" concept - one for day-to-day peacetime missions, the other for deterrence and conflict missions.

For the heavy division to be meaningful it needs to be a "deployable, force-generator/employer division" with a deployable division headquarters, at least two heavy brigades and a plan for a third brigade and divisional enablers (and by plan I mean a decision whereby we either have our own or have a structure that has these provided by an ally so as to be a complete division). To me requiring two deployable brigades requires at least one additional manned and equipped heavy brigade at home (You need a bench to draw on). Much of this division should be manned with part-timers.

The second, peacetime division does not need a deployable headquarters. It only needs a force generating headquarters. It needs one light and one medium brigade at a high full-time manning level and could use additional part-time manned, full-time equipped, brigades.

 

[Spencer100]

You are guys are no fun...LOL

I was this or that.

But really my main point was I think after watching Ukraine I think the AA is a bigger whole for the CAF than older tanks. With drone and loitering munitions being a bigger threat.

 

[GR66]

You are guys are no fun...LOL

I was this or that.

But really my main point was I think after watching Ukraine I think the AA is a bigger whole for the CAF than older tanks. With drone and loitering munitions being a bigger threat.

That brings us back to the point that the CAF is in such a state that people actually look at procurement of key capabilities as a binary decision...tanks or AD. A credible and effective military needs both. Unfortunately though even the senior leadership of the CAF seems to have bought into that mindset.

 

[Kirkhill]

That brings us back to the point that the CAF is in such a state that people actually look at procurement of key capabilities as a binary decision...tanks or AD. A credible and effective military needs both. Unfortunately though even the senior leadership of the CAF seems to have bought into that mindset.

Buy penny packets of everything every year for ten years, enough to fully equip a combined arms team or two each year.

 

[KevinB]

Buy penny packets of everything every year for ten years, enough to fully equip a combined arms team or two each year.

Commit to multi year program deliveries, instead of feast or famine (and it’s never even a feast for the CAF, more like a last meal)

 

[Spencer100]

Commit to multi year program deliveries, instead of feast or famine (and it’s never even a feast for the CAF, more like a last meal)

you just stop that crazy talk right now.


KevinB......I shouldn't ask. But what do you think of the Debt Ceiling deal? Good for the Miltiary or bad as it locks in Biden defence budget.

 

[KevinB]

you just stop that crazy talk right now.


KevinB......I shouldn't ask. But what do you think of the Debt Ceiling deal? Good for the Miltiary or bad as it locks in Biden defence budget.

I don’t think there was a choice.
DoD has done pretty well off this years budget, and I don’t ever see a Mil budget as locked here, as someone will always find more money

 

[Underway]

You are guys are no fun...LOL

I was this or that.

But really my main point was I think after watching Ukraine I think the AA is a bigger whole for the CAF than older tanks. With drone and loitering munitions being a bigger threat.

Tanks. Allies can provide AA. There. I made a choice.

 

[daftandbarmy]

FWIW, it looks like the M1 is safe to operate in school zones

 

[Spencer100]

FWIW, it looks like the M1 is safe to operate in school zones

View attachment 77851

I agree with those big hoods on the heavy duties. Can be a hard to see around.

And "no honey I did not hit the fence at the RV camp site backing up to load a propane tank with the one week old F-250" That was there when I picked it up. Its going to back to dealer on Monday I will give a piece of my mind. And $500.00.

 

[brihard]

Anyone able to confirm that the driver’s camera on this newly ERAed Leo2A4 in Ukrainian service makes it a Canadian one? If so, we may have the first authoritative sighting of a new Leo variant- the Leopard 2A4CANV

https://twitter.com/x/status/1675112776836997120

 

[Spencer100]

The Drive is saying it's a Canadian Leo.....got some mods too

Ukrainian Leopard 2 Tank Seen Covered In Explosive Reactive Armor

Seeing explosive reactive armor that traces its roots to the Soviet era on a Leopard 2 main battle tank is certainly different.

www.thedrive.com

 

[WLSC]

Interesting episode of The Chieftain on the future of tanks