Blood Type Tattoo

[KevinB]

After reading the book "Roberts Ridge" and talking to some of the "guys who dont exist" here - there are people using whole blood in combat lifesaving...

 

[daftandbarmy]

Learning Moment: If you are ever asked by someone with a big honking hollow needle in their hand what your blood type is, don't answer 'Blue'. They might not think it's funny - and then they might just (legally) hurt you...  :'(

 

[RatCatcher]

First of all, last time I checked medics don't carry any blood with them. Any cas that will receive blood will get it at a facility with a lab, who will cross match the blood prior (hence one of the reasons they take blood in the trauma bays).  If they need it right away it will ffp or O-. They will ingnore any tats or anything written on kit... in case of people with the wrong type on tags.

 

[KevinB]

First of all, last time I checked medics don't carry any blood with them. Any cas that will receive blood will get it at a facility with a lab, who will cross match the blood prior (hence one of the reasons they take blood in the trauma bays).  If they need it right away it will ffp or O-. They will ingnore any tats or anything written on kit... in case of people with the wrong type on tags.

Your quoting conventional force doctrine -- I wasn't 

 

[Armymedic]

After reading the book "Roberts Ridge" and talking to some of the "guys who dont exist" here - there are people using whole blood in combat lifesaving...

First of all, last time I checked medics don't carry any blood with them. Any cas that will receive blood will get it at a facility with a lab, who will cross match the blood prior (hence one of the reasons they take blood in the trauma bays).  If they need it right away it will ffp or O-. They will ingnore any tats or anything written on kit... in case of people with the wrong type on tags.

Your quoting conventional force doctrine -- I wasn't 

So true, so true.

 

[medic65726]

I'll check with my friend who's working in the hospital in Kandahar and see what they are doing.

 

[medicineman]

I think you'll find that whole blood is coming back into vogue a bit in the military sphere due primarily to availability and convenience (ie walking donors).  Only a couple of years ago when I was in Haiti, I'm pretty sure there was whole blood at the ASC and I remember the US Navy guys had to burn about 30 units prior to them leaving due to the best before date coming a little too close to when they were leaving (a crying shame really, but it had to be done I guess).  MTF I'm sure.

MM

 

[medic65726]

Straight from staff at the Hospital in Kandahar:
"On arrival to our facility, each casualty gets a trauma panel of blood work that if required a group and match/screen is done. Western coalition troops all have our blood typing done and is on our ID/dog tags. Afgahan troops, a type and screening would be done if necessary. O neg blood, we have. FFP we use a fair amount of, mostly for concerns re INR/PTT. Packed cells are used. In a crisis requiring lots of blood, we initiate the "walking blood bank." A form of blood dontaion from pre-screened troops. I don't believe we have ever had to use it but it is in order. Right now, blood comes from USA or Netherlands blood banks. I have seen some US troops with bllod type and service number tatoo'd but this is an individual decision. Not a bad idea though."

 

[Fraser.g]

I was an RN at the Role 3 at KAF and will state that as of December 06 all pers that came through the trauma bays were typed and crossed before type specific blood products were given. We never looked for dog tags, tats, patches or any other indicators of blood type. Every one was tested...period.

There is much more than just the type and RH factor that must be tested for included anti bodies. If you have ever gotten a blood transfusion in the past, you may have antibodies in your blood and that will eliminate some units of blood.

 

[TN2IC]

Is there anyone here in the CF that got some blood type tattoo? Pictures please... 

Regards,
TN2IC

 

[Armymedic]

OK, Now just to summarize for all:

If you are a member of the conventional CF, tattooing or inking yourself and your gear with your blood type is a waste of time. It is because CF medics do not carry blood products, and you will be typed and crossmatched before receiving blood products in any NATO military or civilian medical facility.

 

[X Royal]

Another point is that if a standard place for the tattoo is not specified will the medic find it?
Nowadays some people are tattooing their medical alert info on themselves. If in an emergency situation, if it's not readily visible hows does a medical first responder find it. Not by touch on a rapid body survey. A bracelet, necklace or dogtags are easily felt & are places commonly checked for.

 

[kratz]

X Royal

+1

 

[DartmouthDave]

Hello,

Dose anybody have any studies on the use of whole blood.

The only whole blood that I have seen used is autologous blood transfusion from chest tubes (once).  Other than that just the standard PRBC, FFP, ect.

David

 

[Blackadder1916]

Dose anybody have any studies on the use of whole blood.

http://www.usaisr.amedd.army.mil/gwot/FWB%20-%20Kauvar%202006%20J%20Trauma.pdf
Fresh Whole Blood Transfusion: A Controversial Military Practice
(Abstract - complete article at link)

David S. Kauvar, MD, John B. Holcomb, MD, Gary C. Norris, MPH, and John R. Hess, MD
The transfusion of fresh whole blood (FWB) for trauma-induced coagulopathy is unusual in civilian practice. However, US military physicians have used FWB in every combat operation since the practice was introduced in World War I and continue to do so during current military operations. We discuss our review of all blood products administered to US military casualties in Operation Iraqi Freedom (OIF) between March and December 2003. FWB transfusions were most frequent when demands for massive transfusions wiped out existing blood supplies.  FWB patients had the highest blood product requirements; however, mortality did not differ significantly between FWB and non-FWB patients overall or for massively transfused patients. We review the current military practice of FWB transfusion in combat theaters and conclude that FWB transfusion is convenient, safe, and effective in certain military situations. J Trauma. 2006;61:181–184.

Also look at the hyperlink in previous post http://forums.army.ca/forums/threads/66056/post-613986.html#msg613986

 

[elder medic]

Fascinating subject with many good and bad points. Speaking from my own viewpoint as an ex-member of the Corps,  who served with the RCR in Korea, we had no whole blood products other than plasma.  In the rifle companies we had NO blood byproducts whatsoever. Plasma was the product of choice until one got back to a MASH. I have been fortunate in that at 75 I have never needed such product, but had I needed it in the Korean business, could have been disaster. My dogtags carried one type, and in my 5th year of service, I attempted to donate to Red Cross. Refused due to malaria. However they did determine that my type and Rh was NOT what my dogtags said.   This is why any responsible medical facility does type and cross match as required without dumping in any old thing.
Just a word of personal experience from the old guy. 


Edited by Vern to remove line 3.

 

[elder medic]

FURTHER TO ABOVE:
My apologies. Seems as though the bugs got at my PC again  . Line three should not be there  Don't know where or why it came from.

 

[armyvern]

FURTHER TO ABOVE:
My apologies. Seems as though the bugs got at my PC again  . Line three should not be there  Don't know where or why it came from.

I took it out of there for you.

Vern

 

[daftandbarmy]

Fascinating subject with many good and bad points. Speaking from my own viewpoint as an ex-member of the Corps,  who served with the RCR in Korea, we had no whole blood products other than plasma.  In the rifle companies we had NO blood byproducts whatsoever. Plasma was the product of choice until one got back to a MASH. I have been fortunate in that at 75 I have never needed such product, but had I needed it in the Korean business, could have been disaster. My dogtags carried one type, and in my 5th year of service, I attempted to donate to Red Cross. Refused due to malaria. However they did determine that my type and Rh was NOT what my dogtags said.   This is why any responsible medical facility does type and cross match as required without dumping in any old thing.
Just a word of personal experience from the old guy. 


Edited by Vern to remove line 3.

Elder Medic,

What kind of medical support was available to the platoon/company in Korea? My understanding was that it was much better than previous conflicts.

 

[elder medic]

Good question, Daft. The establishment called for one Cpl, RCAMC for each rifle company. I don't believe Support Co'y got one. Back at the RAP was the RMO, (we had a Captain at one time, followed by a Major followed by another Major) a Sgt., battalion Hygiene Cpl, and a couple of other Cpls or Ptes "dogs bodies",(all RCAMC) 1 Korean interpreter, and a "houseboy" for the RMO.
We decided who should go on sick parade, where and how the latrines were placed and general health issues. My own experience was that any night action my co'y was involved in, whether in co'y or platoon strength, also involved me. I went out on patrol with 1 stretcher, and a huge haversack of shell dressings. PERIOD. In my bunker I also had a standard first aid kit, which meant many trips to the RAP to replenish it. Also armed with 2 Colt 45's scrounged from USMC, sometimes a Webley 38. My first patrol I took my rifle. Never again.
Since I found this site, I have often thought had we the supplies available today, we might have saved a few more lives. But then again, at Waterloo, casualties would have been fewer if they had our equipment, such as it was. Nothing advances military medicine like a war.
Hope this answers your question.