B Fleet divestment & B vehicle rust-out (Split from: TAPV thread)

[Fishbone Jones]

In a perfect world a Reserve Squadron would have 4 troops. One in open top and partly mine-protected G-wagons. A Troop in the armoured G-wagons to provide support. A HQ troop in enclosed G-wagons with the radios and bits required and a Support troop in a larger 1 1/2 ton (Unimog) to provide POL, Rations, Ammo and support weapons.

Colin,

I'd be interested as to where you found that TO&E for Reserve Recce. BTW, in a perfect world, we would also have an Assault troop.

In fact, the Sabre troops would all be mounted in the same equipment configuration, as all are required to fill in, and perform, all our main tasks according to the BTS. Mainly, AtoC, OPs, Retrograde Ops (RAS, Convoys Escort, etc). The SHQ portion is required to maintain comms with higher (and lower), supply, and security. All C\S, with the exception of the SSM replen group, require two radios and amps. One to speak on Sqn and Troop frequency and the other to speak directly to Div\ Brigade CP, the people we are actually working for and conducting the recce for. We've fallen into the trap of reporting to Regt\Sqn, then they pass up to Brigade\Div because we lack the range without the proper equipment. We typically only operate on one frequency because of lack of equipment and the fact we can, normally, only get two frequencies assigned.

As to the amount of troops and vehicles, the Regiment here, when in Iltis could field 3-4 full troops with an SHQ on a given weekend. We had the pers and vehicles to do it. Nowadays, we still have the pers, but nowhere near the vehicles, and equipment, to fill out. We went from 28 Iltis, to IIRC, 14 G-Wagons. Only two have dual installations and one amp. The rest have one radio and no amp. SHQ has gone from one LSVW CP, one SSM's LSVW, two MLs and two HLs to one SSM Milcot, and two MSVS (you can't mix POL with other cargo). We also have the problem of having to send most of our fleet to Meaford or Gagetown on a regular basis. Taskings that are CFTPO are normally one - two months. This stretches to approx. 4-5 including turning them in and receiving the back. That's providing Meaford or Gagetown haven't broke them, then it could take up to a year to get them back.

 

[McG]

SHQ has gone from one LSVW CP, one SSM's LSVW, two MLs and two HLs to one SSM Milcot, and two MSVS (you can't mix POL with other cargo).

How much of that reduction was over the past year with the B Fleet divestment?

 

[Fishbone Jones]

Most of it I believe. Mind, some of it disappeared before I retired in July 13.

 

[Old EO Tech]

How much of that reduction was over the past year with the B Fleet divestment?

I can't speak to what specifically happened in PRes units, but there was no intelligent decisions from CA/Divs on the B fleet divestment, Bde's and units were just told to cut 50% and it was up to them to balance unit needs and maintain at least 1 Echelon per unit..... A end result that Bde's will have a very tough time projecting units out far from home on domestic ops, especially with us out west with a very big AOR.  And we are 6 years from LVM Project even starting to deliver replacement vehicles :-/

 

[McG]

Indeed.  I consider what 1 CMBG rolled to Calgary and High River for flood support last year, and wonder what could be done this year now that half of that is gone.

 

[Colin Parkinson]

I made it up on the fly but was thinking about what I have seen in the reserves and combined it with the Brit system of a "light troop" (ferret) medium troop (fox) and firesupport troop (Saladin). I tried to make it more realistic for us. I recall back in the day BCR had 6 GPMG armed jeeps divided into 2 troops and a HQ troop in 2 x 5/4 and a support troop with a deuce and van. The BCD's had the Cougars, so there is your fire support troop

 

[blackberet17]

About a decade ago, we managed a 3xtp Sqn, all in Iltis, with a full Ech (I can't recall all the Ech vehs).

Two years ago, for our first fall ex, we fielded 2x5-veh tps, all in LUVW. BC was in a milcot with a trailer from the Sigs. Ech was composed of 1xmil, 2xMS, and maybe the Cube van we had at the time.

First fall ex this year...1x6-veh tp, all in LUVW minus the tp ldr in a milcot. Ech was 1xmilcot. We did have an assault gp...with an MS for tpt.

Weeeeee.

Last I checked with Tpt, we had 6xLUVW in Gagetown, in various stages of "waiting". One of the objectives of Ex STRIDENT TRACER XIV was the RTU of vehs. We came back with 5, not 12 as we were apparently supposed to at end ex.

As recceguy noted, we too have the pers. At this time, we could field 2x8-veh tps, plus an Ech, plus an Opfor of 8 pers, if not more. We just need the ****ing vehicles to do so.

 

[Kirkhill]

About a decade ago, we managed a 3xtp Sqn, all in Iltis, with a full Ech (I can't recall all the Ech vehs).

Two years ago, for our first fall ex, we fielded 2x5-veh tps, all in LUVW. BC was in a milcot with a trailer from the Sigs. Ech was composed of 1xmil, 2xMS, and maybe the Cube van we had at the time.

First fall ex this year...1x6-veh tp, all in LUVW minus the tp ldr in a milcot. Ech was 1xmilcot. We did have an assault gp...with an MS for tpt.

Weeeeee.

Last I checked with Tpt, we had 6xLUVW in Gagetown, in various stages of "waiting". One of the objectives of Ex STRIDENT TRACER XIV was the RTU of vehs. We came back with 5, not 12 as we were apparently supposed to at end ex.

As recceguy noted, we too have the pers. At this time, we could field 2x8-veh tps, plus an Ech, plus an Opfor of 8 pers, if not more. We just need the ****ing vehicles to do so.

Do you need Million Dollar Buggies (TAPV) - or even $100,000 G Wagons?

Would $25000 Jeeps and Milcots get the job done for you?

 

[Colin Parkinson]

Going by this brochure Mercedes offers a soft top version which would be great for recce and a 6 wheeled version to replace the LSVW, not to mention a more heavily armoured version. I would say that your support troop needs a larger equally capable off-road vehicle equipped with a good winch to be used to extract your troop vehicles without waiting for Svc Battalion who will be to far back anyways to respond in time.

http://www.mb-military-vehicles.com/fileadmin/downloads/G_ClassMilitary_en.pdf

 

[McG]

Now you are not talking about the fleet we have, but the fleet we need next:
http://army.ca/forums/threads/100166.0.html