Applications to join foreign forces (Britian and Australia)

[Jumbuck]

Ya there is a lot of misinformation on this forum. My buddy aplied to join the British army last year for the parachute regiment and he is a straight Canadian citizen and they took him. He was told that all he needed was a Sponsor, no work permit or anything because they took care of all that. They paid for his flight to Britain to do all his tests on the same day but he had to pay for his return flight home. Hes gonna try for SAS selection once he can.

 

[Pieman]

Ya there is a lot of misinformation on this forum. My buddy applied to join the British army last year for the parachute regiment and he is a straight Canadian citizen and they took him. He was told that all he needed was a Sponsor, no work permit or anything because they took care of all that. They paid for his flight to Britain to do all his tests on the same day but he had to pay for his return flight home. Hes gonna try for SAS selection once he can.

Actually, the misinformation with regard to the work permit has been corrected, try reading it again. The process is not so clear cut as you may like to think as you read about it from your armchair. A lot of forms and paper work to dig through and like i said i am just figuring this out as i go through the process.

If your buddy was flown out there and he did all his testing in one day that is really oddly fantastic. However, the British recruiters are telling me directly that I have to fly myself out there and then stay there for the entire selection process, which is 4-6 months. So I am not sure when your friend went over there, but it would appear the process has changed drastically. Perhaps your freind had previous military experience, which may be the cause of the difference in process? Or perhaps it is because I am applying as an Officer and he was a NCM? The process for those situations are different, and I am simply posting my experience as an applicant for a British Officer position as it happens.

 

[Jumbuck]

He was going NCM and it was over a year ago to so who knows.

 

[Pieman]

Got an email from the British recruiting center and my medical has cleared OK.

They have invited me to come out there for the rest of the application for the middle of this October!

They are sending me a bunch of information in the mail which will give me all the details of what I have to do. So I have to start to prepare to leave as I will also need a place to stay and hopefully some kind of job to help support myself. I will post again after I get the package in the mail, as I will have a better idea of how this is going to work then.

 

[ringo_mountbatten]

just a hint for a job if you are going to london, in particular.  go to a pub and normally they will hire you under the table and have some sort of room and board agreement. 

 

[Pieman]

Been a busy week for The Pieman, lots of info was sent to me. Some things about this application are more clear, but there are a lot of decisions yet to be made.

From my understanding, my application for a British Officer is going to go   something like this:

First, I will travel to London around October 15th. Upon arriving I will meet with a recruiter for my initial interview. If they like me they will then schedule me to go to something called the regular Commission Board' (RCB) Briefing.

While waiting for my appointment in the briefing I am to try to gain sponsorship from a regiment of my choice. I have selected a Parachute Regiment that interests me the most so far. I will set up an interview and travel to that regiment. They will conduct an interview and if they like you they will support your formal application to the Forces.   Most of these regiments have a weekend course you can attend where they will stick you in some green camo, give you a tour of the regiment, have you run around obstacle courses, give some lectures on what they do etc. Sounds like so much fun! I will be making an effort to contact the regiment and set up a date next week.

After that my RCB   Briefing date will come up. The briefing lasts 1 1/2 days . The webpage says that it is simply information on their testing procedures and selection process.

After the briefing I would procede to the RCB Main Board. From what I understand from my recruiter, I should be able to get into this the middle of November. This is a full 4 day Officer selection process. During this time it sounds like they do similar things that the CF does, but also a lot of things that are specific to selecting people with leadership abilities. I will give a run down of the 4 days:

Day 1: Upon arriving there is a formal greeting and lecture by the Brass. This is followed by a series of written tests. (I assume these are same kind of aptitude tests the CF does)

Day 2: Applicants are divided up into a group of 8 and assigned a Group Leader who will observe and test the group.
          - First thing is a open discussion where all 8 members are given a topic to talk about. Applicants are tested on their ability to express ideas and listen to others.
          - More interviews are conducted by a Vice President, Deputy President, and a Education adviser.
          - The group heads outdoors and the group leader will lead the group through obstacle courses and watches the applicants ability to work in a team.
          (Sounds like a long day!)

Day 3:   Outdoor tasks are assigned and each member is given command of the group and leads them to solve the problem. This is really where they are looking for leadership abilities.
           - An individual obstacle course is run
           - Each applicant gives an informal five minute lecture to the group on five points that will be taken from your CV. This is to test our ability to communicate your knowledge to other people.
           - Formal Dinner

Day 4: Last day a race between all the groups is done.
         - The formal medical exam is conducted
         - Loads of paper work to fill out
         - The acceptance/rejection sent to you the following day. (Pending your medical)

After that I would be accepted for training at the Royal Military Academy Sandhurst (RMAS). Sandhurst intakes people three times a year, January, May, and September. From my talks with the recruiter and people on British Army forums, it is probably not likely I would get in January, but I should be able to make the May intake provided there are openings. So I am aiming for Commission in May of next year. BTW The training at Sandhurst looks simply amazing! It is broken into 3 terms and they let you go on a adventure trip (Africa or New Zealand or etc)   (http://www.atra.mod.uk/rmas/courses/structure.htm)

Now comes the hard part, getting over there and supporting myself is not going to be an easy task at this point. I don't have much time to arrange all this and raise enough money by October. Am I going to be able to do this so soon? I am not sure yet, but I will do my best to make it happen.

My plan is to do this in two trips. First, I will go over from October - November. If everything goes as planned I should be able to come back to Canada and then return again in May to start my training. Will I be able to do all these things in 2 months? I don't know. I am going to phone my recruiter on Monday to see if this plan is realistic or not.

*Man, just realized how long that post was! Thankfully Ninja Snipers type fast.

 

[Big Bad John]

Good Luck!  But consider the Royals...Marine training is superior to all other! 

 

[1feral1]

Sounds like a lot of hard yakka, and definately a lot more hoops to jump thru than I did back in 94/95.

Best of luck in your future endeavours, and remember - never give in, never give up, never back down, accept any challenge, and go hard or go home! There is a lot more at stake here than your pride. Once the peer pressure is on, you'll know exactly what I mean. During trg, I was singled out many times because I was a foreigner DE'd as a SGT at that too, and I had to 'prove' myself before being accepted by the troops, and I usually still do, as again I am posted at yr's end, and to a different Bde in the tropics, which means all new faces. At 44, I take no shyte anymore. PERIOD.

There was times I was cained so hard, I wanted to give in on occasion (one time after a wicked caining after a hell march in the heat), I wrung out the blood from my socks, and the lads just thought I was nuts), but I always seemed to get this second wind from somewhere within, and I sure did not want to embarass myself, my rank, fomer CF corps, and the CF.

I used to say to myself many times 'alright you bastards, I'll show ya what this Canadian is made of'. Sheer determination to gain respect of my peers, subordinates and superiors, which paid out on assessments over the years. Lots of times the blokes I was trg with were +10 yrs younger than myself.

Anyways enough of me 'flashing back'. I am sure you'll get what you're after.

Time for a Queensland beer (XXXX Gold) and a nice 'rare steak' on the barbie, she's pushing 1800 now.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[Pieman]

Big Bad John and Wes,

Thanks for the words of encouragement, I appreciate it. But I am still a long way from getting my butt over to Britain, lots could go wrong yet!

Good Luck!  But consider the Royals...Marine training is superior to all other! 

I don't know about the Marines...i saw a video of the Marines and those guys scare me! I will look into them again, but I believe I excluded that option as I could not be an Officer because I am over 25 from what I remember.

Actually, I check out the Royal Navy as well as the Royal Air Force. I ruled them both out as options be cause I was extremely limited in the number of positions I would be able to take. In the Navy, very few Officer positions are open to Canadians. In the Air Force, I face the same problem and could not obtain a position that put me inside any of the aircraft. I did look into being a RAF Gunner Officer (man, those guys look so cool!) But again I am over 25 and cannot apply as an Officer, I could be a NCM still, but that is not my calling.

I was singled out many times because I was a foreigner DE'd as a SGT at that too, and I had to 'prove' myself before being accepted by the troops

I have been thinking about this, as I know that I will never quite fit in no matter how hard I try. I can already hear the Moose and Igloo jokes. I wish I could impersonate a good British Accent, but the best I can do is a solid impersonation of John Cleese's 'Silly Walk' from the Monty Python shows. I suspect that would not go over well...especially in drill. I see it as an extra challenge I have to deal with and I believe the experience will be worth it in the end. I take comfort knowing that other Canadians have done this before and survived.

There was times I was cained so hard, I wanted to give in on occasion (one time after a wicked caining after a heck march in the heat), I wrung out the blood from my socks, and the lads just thought I was nuts), but I always seemed to get this second wind from somewhere within, and I sure did not want to embarass myself, my rank, fomer CF corps, and the CF.  I used to say to myself many times 'alright you bastards, I'll show ya what this Canadian is made of'. Sheer determination to gain respect of my peers, subordinates and superiors, which paid out on assessments over the years. Lots of times the blokes I was trg with were +10 yrs younger than myself.

My hat goes off to you Wes for pushing through all that, I can only hope I have as much determination if I ever get over there.  I will raise a pint of Guinness in your name tonight.

Pieman

 

[Figure11]

As one who crossed the pond and enlisted back in the '80's, I have followed this thread with interest. For me, it was a very simple and straightforeward process, although I'm sure that much has changed over the years. In those days the Brit army had over 50 regular infantry battalions and it only took a few months   to proceed from careers office to depot. I joined as a private soldier which also, no doubt, helped speed-up the process considerably. I absolutely agree with Wes that it can be quite a culture shock, when you immerse yourself in a different country so deeply.
Although I have British family members, I remember feeling like a fish out of water at first. My first year of what turned out to be a five year hitch was a total grind. By the second however, everything seemed to fall into place with an audible "click". If the first year was lousy, the next four more than made up for it. After five years, I was seriously considering dropping anchor there permanently.
Don't worry about being different! Ultimately your men will respect you based on your ability to lead, and how you treat them. Our battalion had an American captain on secondment for a year or two. He was well liked by the lads in #2 company and known universally as "Hank the Yank." Your colleagues and fellow soldiers will, I am sure, take the piss mercilessly just like they did to me, but that is to be expected in army life and always remember that while they are doing it to you, you will be doing it to them.   Before you know it you will be one of them and amongst comrades and friends,   some of the best folk in the world and the likes of which you would never have the privilege of meeting in civvy street. This   will be reinforced if you end up on the streets of NI or, I guess nowadays, Basra.
The very best of luck to you.

 

[Big Bad John]

Good luck.  The best advice I can give apart from the obvious, is to make sure you are very well rested before any interviews or schemes.  If you must go in the army, apply for the All Arms Commando Course.  it is part of "basic" training for all marines.  The army provides the Royals with support in the form of 29 Commando RE and 29 Commando  RA.  All graduates of the All Arms Commando Course!

Also start reading "Soldier", the official magazine of the British Army, if you can find a copy.

Cheers!

 

[Jascar]

Could someone post a link for the British Army forums? I've searched the net for them but had no luck so far. Thanks.

 

[Big Bad John]

Ministry Of Defense  http://www.mod.uk/

MOD Armed Forces Links  http://dmoz.org/Regional/Europe/United_Kingdom/Government/Defence/

Army  http://www.army.mod.uk/

Royal Navy  http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/

Royal Marines  http://www.royal-navy.mod.uk/static/pages/141.html

Royal Air Force  http://www.raf.mod.uk/

BATUS pictures  http://www.army.mod.uk/12brigade/batus_pictures/

Overview BATUS  http://www.army.mod.uk/servingsoldier/whatsgoingon/canada_battlefield_batus.htm

CFB Suffield  BATUS    http://www.army.dnd.ca/cfb_suffield/batus.html

I hope that this helps!  Cheers

 

[Big Bad John]

I copied this from the RM web site.  I hope that it answers some general questions:


RM OFFICER ENTRY REQUIREMENTS

There are four routes to becoming an Officer. Whichever route is taken, you must still pass our regular selection procedure.

1. Scholarship and Reserved Place Scheme
Qualifications: For an award: 5 acceptable GCSE grades/SCE Standard/Ordinary Grade passes (or equivalent) including English and Maths. No break in education between GCSE (or SCE Standard/Ordinary grades and 'A' levels or SCE Highers or CSYS). Formal applications must be received by 1 June of the year of selection.

Age limits: Enter with Direct Entry.

2. Direct Entry
Qualifications: 2 GCE 'A' levels (or equivalent) and 3 acceptable GCSE (or equivalent) or SCE passes in 5 subjects to include 3 at the Higher Grade. English and maths are mandatory subjects.

Age limits: 17 to under 26 on 1 September of year of entry.

Minimum Return of Service: Return of Service begins on completion of phase 2 training and runs for three years.

3. Bursaries
Bursaries are also available for Candidates who do not want to join the Service before starting a degree course. Holders remain civilians while at university.

Age limits: 17 to under 22 on 1 September of year of entry.

Minimum Return of Service: The Return of Service runs from the beginning of the final year of degree studies and expires upon completion of five years' service from completion of phase 2 training.

4. Direct Graduate Entry
Qualifications: A UK degree or equivalent and acceptable GCSE grades/SCE Standard/Ordinary Grade passes (or equivalent in English and maths.

Age limits: Under 26 on 1 September of year of entry.

Minimum Return of Service: Return of Service begins on completion of phase 2 training and runs for three years.

Height restrictions
Officers must be at least 1.65m tall.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RM COMMANDO ENTRY REQUIREMENTS

Qualifications: Must pass selection test (Reasoning, Literacy, Numeracy and Mechanical Comprehension), interview, medical examination and Potential Royal Marines Course (PRMC). Male Only.

Age limits: 16â “27 (up to and including day of 28th birthday only).


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RM BAND SERVICE MEMBER REQUIREMENTS

Musician or Bugler (Male and Female)

Qualifications Must pass selection test (Reasoning, Literacy, Numeracy and Mechanical Comprehension, interview and medical examination. Must pass an audition for musical aptitude, as well as a dental and fitness check, at the Royal Marines School of Music.

Age limits: 16â “27 (up to and including day of 28th birthday only).

Height restrictions: Band members must be at least 1.55m tall.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

RM RESERVIST ENTRY REQUIREMENTS

Royal Marines reservists come from all walks of life.

Qualifications: You must be reasonably fit and have a strong desire to spend your leisure time developing your skills and personality in a highly professional and committed environment.

Age limits: Between 17-30.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------




NOTES AND FURTHER INFORMATION


Acceptable GCSE grades are normally grades C and above.

The term 'pass' when referring to SCE Standard/Ordinary Grade examinations means grades 1, 2 and 3/A, B and C.

GCE 'O' levels grade C or above are normally accepted in lieu of GCSE grades C or above. CSE (Certificate of Secondary Education) Grade 1 passes are normally acceptable in lieu of GCSE grades C or above.

GCSE and GCE 'A' levels must be in non-overlapping subjects, acceptable to the Ministry of Defence.

Educational qualifications other than those shown eg GNVQ at Advanced Level and BTEC may be accepted if, in the opinion of the Ministry of Defence, they are of similar or higher standard.

Details of educational requirements for every specialisation and entry are laid down in the booklet CG (ED).

The Ministry of Defence reserves the right to take into account the grades obtained in examinations and the overall time taken to attain the educational qualifications when calling candidates for interview or awarding or confirming places.
Selection and Entry
Selection for all entries is by interview and medical examination. All candidates for the Royal Marines enter at the Commando Training Centre, Lympstone, Devon.

Scholarship and Reserved Place Scheme
Candidates must be at school in the United Kingdom or at a British Forces school overseas. Parents of those awarded a scholarship may be assisted financially to help their son or daughter remain at school while taking 'A' levels or Scottish equivalent. The tenure of a scholarship can be either one or two years. Scholarship awards are made annually in January but backdated to the previous September. A number of places are also reserved at the Britannia RN College, Dartmouth or the Officer Training Wing, Royal Marines, Lympstone, for candidates who do not obtain a scholarship but are highly recommended. A reserved place does not carry any financial assistance.

Holders of scholarships and reserved places are eligible for University Sponsorship. Two-year award holders will require a further interview.

Return of Service
In return for a Commission and training, the Royal Navy expects Officers to serve a minimum length of time, known as Return of Service. This varies according to the type of Commission and the type of entry. Therefore, although it is possible to apply to leave at any time, an Officer is expected to give a reasonable Return of Service for the investment in training the Royal Navy commits to you. Details are shown alongside each method of entry.

 

[Pieman]

Could someone post a link for the British Army forums? I've searched the net for them but had no luck so far. Thanks.

There are a number of small ones around, the one I got the most information and feedback off of was on Millitary.com

http://forums.military.com/ 
look in the 'United Kingdom Military Forces Discussions' folder.

I go under the handle of PhaseSpace on that forum.

There are a few others, but the only ones I found are small,   and there does not seem to be anything like Army.ca out there.
if anyone knows of good ones, please also post a link.

 

[Kirkhill]

http://www.arrse.co.uk/html/modules.php?name=Forums&file=index&sid=2b01141a0cf5dc742f2a4e5866972eff

Try this one.  It is similar to Army.ca 

 

[meni0n]

Well, I had my application all filled up nicely except that I know no one in England so I had no one to put in as a sponsor. Would have liked to get into the 216 hq & sigs.

 

[Pieman]

Well, I had my application all filled up nicely except that I know no one in England so I had no one to put in as a sponsor. Would have liked to get into the 216 hq & sigs.

I don't really know anyone there, nor do I have someone over there to sponsor me.  Do you mean this as a residence permit issue? or a sponsor from a regiment? Neither of those should be an issue, unless the rules were a lot different when you applied.

 

[meni0n]

The application is quiet recent, I got it last october. It just says that I have to have a sponsor in the UK that they can contact and ask if he knows me and vouch for me. At least that's what it says in the documentation I got with the application.

 

[Pieman]

The application is quiet recent, I got it last October. It just says that I have to have a sponsor in the UK that they can contact and ask if he knows me and vouch for me. At least that's what it says in the documentation I got with the application.

Not what I had in any of the forms I filled out.  Maybe check into it again if you are still interested. (Were you applying as an NCM? Then that is a very different process.)

While I am at it, I should update my application situation a little:

I received a boat load of forms in the mail and official letters for my interviews. I had the interview dates pushed back to the middle of November to give myself more time to get ready, raise money etc. So I will not leave for the UK until early November.

They wanted all the original documentation and original school transcripts,  birth certificate etc. so i fired all that stuff back to them vis registered express mail.

I have set up an appointment with a Parachute regiment. I will have an interview with these people and spend two days on their base going on tours and attending lectures, it is all free too! I will need a regimental sponsor to get into sandhurst, so this is a very important point. They are not obligated to take me even if they sponsor me into training, but I cannot get into the Army without the support of a regiment. I am trying to set up appointments at a couple of other regiments.

I am currently scouting out for apartments, and that is not going to be a huge problem I don't think. With any luck I will have an apartment set up for me this soon.