Air Navigators

[niceasdrhuxtable]

Hello, I am applying for the position of a Pilot with Air Nav as a backup. I want to eventually go on to do commercial aviation. How well will this work if I get Air Nav. I realize Air Nav's do not do the flying (they sit in the plane though) and so I won't have flying hours logged, but I will still have "experience in a jet plane or other type of plane". Has anybody gone from Air Nav to commercial pilot? I will likely have to do my flight training privately, or is there some basic flight training in the CF for Air Nav's? Will an ex-Air Nav still look better than a person trained as a civilian pilot doing bush-work for example when applying to the major airlines?

  -bwa

I think your question would be better posed to someone involved in a civilian airline. The only people who get trained to fly aircraft in the CF are pilots.

http://www.recruiting.forces.gc.ca/v3/engraph/jobs/jobs.aspx?id=31&html=False&bhcp=1 will give you an idea what sort of training and qualifications you can expect.

 

[bwa]

Was just reading over that, and it says we recieve basic flight training ~120 hours in a single engine aircraft. It says "once you recieve your wings"......meaning we get our private pilots license?

 

[yoman]

Was just reading over that, and it says we recieve basic flight training ~120 hours in a single engine aircraft. It says "once you recieve your wings"......meaning we get our private pilots license?

From dnd site:

"You will receive basic and advanced navigation training on the T-67C Slingsby and the CT-142 Dash 8 aircraft, for a total of 120 flying hours."

http://www.recruiting.forces.gc.ca/v3/engraph/jobs/jobs.aspx?id=31&bhcp=1

 

[bwa]

Ok, I am new to these terms, I take it that does not mean flying the aircraft. Thanks for your help.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

bwa-
As a Navigator, you will be "flying IN" an aircraft, not "flying" as in actually at the controls.  With that said, when the new CH-148 cyclone arrives in 2008, the distinction between who tells the computer to the tell the aircraft what to do next is going to get pretty moot.

An airline won't even talk to you for a pilot position, unless you already are a commercial pilot.

 

[niceasdrhuxtable]

bwa-
With that said, when the new CH-148 cyclone arrives in 2008, the distinction between who tells the computer to the tell the aircraft what to do next is going to get pretty moot.

The buzz is that the navigator is going to be doing more flying than the pilot on the Cyclone. I've heard that on most missions all the pilot will do is take off and land.

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Lets be clear here- Computers will "fly" the Cyclone.  Sometimes it will be a Nav giving the commands, sometimes it will be a pilot.

 

[Sub_Guy]

So what you are saying is that the Pilot could be in the back with the AESOP making sandwiches?   

 

[aesop081]

So what you are saying is that the Pilot could be in the back with the AESOP making sandwiches?   

Acoustics officers are in the back making sandwiches......lets be clear on that !

 

[x-zipperhead]

After he has received sufficient training in sandwich making

 

[x-zipperhead]

Cdnaviator, you beat me to it!

 

[Sub_Guy]

Acoustics officers are in the back making sandwiches......lets be clear on that !

Good to know, that will be part of my decision process if I get accepted and have the choice to either work on Aurora's or Sea Kings......The Aurora has the galley, and if Acoustics Officers are "Sandwich Artists" that will be a check in the box for the CP-140!

 

[aesop081]

have the choice ....

:rofl:

 

[csharding]

We'll this seems as good of place as any to ask my questions about ANAVs or ACSOs as I'm told the name is.  First off, I am in 3rd year university as an ROTP student with acceptance to the ANAV trade.  I have completed my Basic Training and am now unsure of what comes next.  I do still have another year of school, but I am supposed to do some type or training or OJT during the summers to keep me occupied.  Now at one point I understood that I was to spend 2 week intervals at Trenton, Greenwood and Shearwater learning the respective ANAV positions but recent information has confused me.  There has been mention of OJE(?¿?) but I am not sure what that is, nor what it entails.

So basically I'm wondering, what's next for me?

Side bar to that, I currently have the wonderful Tri-service Cornflake cap brass.  At which point am I allowed to swap it out for the Air Force Brass?
Thanks for all your help. :yellow:

 

[Zoomie]

First question regarding the cornflake - get rid of it now.  I am assuming that you are civi-U ROTP - get the Air Command cloth cap-badge and put it up.

You will go on summer OJT (On the Job Training) where you will be exposed to the AF way of life.  Photocopies, menial labour, occasional flying, etc,

Upon graduation from University, expect some sort of ceremony where you will get your 2Lt rank and then expect a wait for CFANS (soon to be 1CFFTS).  While waiting, you will get a choice of where you want to wait out your time.  Choose a good base to hang out at, as your wait may be lengthy.  If you want to wait out the delay at home - ask for the local recruiting centre.

 

[csharding]

Thanks Zoomie...
do I get any choice of where I go for the OJT or will they just send me somewhere? and if I do get the choice, any suggestion where to go?

I tried to get rid of the cornflake before but because I am responsible to ASU London (an army reserve base) they didn't exactly under stand what I was looking for and I got no help from the clerks.

Thanks again

 

[dimsum]

For the OJT, you can ask for where to go.  A good suggestion would be either an Aurora or Sea King sqn; most ACSOs will be involved in one of those two platforms and a taste of sqn life would be nice before going to CFANS.  For weather-related reasons, pick the west coast 

As for the cap badge, just go to Supply and ask for the AF cap badge. 

 

[Bograt]

There is the possibility that your life as a NAV will not involve you leaving the ground. It is my limited understanding that ACSO will have the responsibility of UAVs. I believe the first pipes from CFANS (1CFFTS now ??) have been streamed into that community.

Also it appears now with the reactiviation of 414 squadron, Electronic Warfare is keeping the trade busy for a while.

 

[dimsum]

From what I've heard, the UAV stream is still in its early stages and so far only 1 person has been slotted for that community; he's still in the Div somewhere working on training plans, etc so it might be a while before any significant numbers of ACSOs are piped there.

As for 414 Sqn, word on the street is that they are looking for more senior EWOs vice pipes.

 

[prima6]

We'll this seems as good of place as any to ask my questions about ANAVs or ACSOs as I'm told the name is.  First off, I am in 3rd year university as an ROTP student with acceptance to the ANAV trade.  I have completed my Basic Training and am now unsure of what comes next.  I do still have another year of school, but I am supposed to do some type or training or OJT during the summers to keep me occupied.  Now at one point I understood that I was to spend 2 week intervals at Trenton, Greenwood and Shearwater learning the respective ANAV positions but recent information has confused me.  There has been mention of OJE(?¿?) but I am not sure what that is, nor what it entails.

So basically I'm wondering, what's next for me?

Side bar to that, I currently have the wonderful Tri-service Cornflake cap brass.  At which point am I allowed to swap it out for the Air Force Brass?
Thanks for all your help. :yellow:

In the ROTP program you should do what is called Summer Orientation Training (SOT) where you spend 3 weeks in each of Trenton, Shearwater and Greenwood to see the main 3 airframes that you could fly on to get an idea of what your preference may be.  Other entry programs do not have SOT and from what I've seen it's a significant advantage to get it.  When you get to CFANS (1 CFFTS shortly) you will only get about 3 days on what is called the Motivex in the middle of the course where you will either get to visit the east or west coast to see some of the squadrons amongst a few other things.  You can imagine that you can get a better idea of squadron life at the various units on 9 weeks of SOT that you can on the 3 days of the Motivex.