2021 federal budget and the CAF

[Bruce Monkhouse]

My son is a first time buyer here in Ottawa. He lost multiple bids on townhouses in Orleans listed at 400K and going for over 500k. He finally succeeded with a condo townhouse that was listed at 400K and he got it at 530K.

That is insane.

Which, for the last 2 weeks I've been discussing at work. Realtors should not be allowed to say "for sale", because it's not, it's for auction. Big difference.
When Walmart has a sale at 29.99 the first person to fork over 29.99 gets the item. Should be same with houses, first person with asking, and just a home inspection as a condition, gets the house.
No more lowballing the list price knowing 3/4's of the visitors haven't got a shot but think they do.

I'm going to split this tangent off in the morning when I'm not half asleep so post away....

 

[Brad Sallows]

So the forces got out of the cheap employee housing business but kept its presence in some places where real estate was bound to experience greater demand, and doesn't have the flexibility to relocate as easily as a business might. I suppose no one saw this coming.

More people means more demand, particularly in highly desirable areas. Most of those areas are fixed in size. The shift from single- to two-income families put more money into the bidding pot. The fall in the relative cost of other things put more money into the bidding pot. The spread of income levels from top to bottom has increased, yielding advantages to some. Policies designed to preserve neighbourhoods militate against new construction. Complex architecture is more expensive to build than simple architecture.

Policies likely to succeed are those which push up supply, not demand.

 

[FJAG]

Which, for the last 2 weeks I've been discussing at work. Realtors should not be allowed to say "for sale", because it's not, it's for auction. Big difference.
When Walmart has a sale at 29.99 the first person to fork over 29.99 gets the item. Should be same with houses, first person with asking, and just a home inspection as a condition, gets the house.
No more lowballing the list price knowing 3/4's of the visitors haven't got a shot but think they do.

I'm going to split this tangent off in the morning when I'm not half asleep so post away....

There's a contractual difference between Walmart making an offer to sell a widget at 29.99 which the customer accepts to close the deal and a home owner making a listing which entertains the submission of offers to purchase which the seller can accept or reject as he wishes. That's why the real estate industry's paperwork that the buyer puts forward is called an "Offer to Purchase"

 

[Lumber]

I have absolutely no idea how a young Corporal Signaler or HRA/FSA that's posted to Ottawa with a family can afford to start homeownership without being forced to live in a postage stamp in a seedy neighbourhood.

They aren't being forced to live in a postage stamp in a seedy area. It's their choice to be in and stay in the forces. If they don't want what's available, they can release and go live some place that isn't expensive.

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

There's a contractual difference between Walmart making an offer to sell a widget at 29.99 which the customer accepts to close the deal and a home owner making a listing which entertains the submission of offers to purchase which the seller can accept or reject as he wishes. That's why the real estate industry's paperwork that the buyer puts forward is called an "Offer to Purchase"

I'm sure they have it all covered, I just think it's time to rope it in a little. Like they did with the car industry a while back with "all in pricing".

 

[SupersonicMax]

They aren't being forced to live in a postage stamp in a seedy area. It's their choice to be in and stay in the forces. If they don't want what's available, they can release and go live some place that isn't expensive.

Treat you workforce like shit and they’ll leave.

 

[dimsum]

They aren't being forced to live in a postage stamp in a seedy area. It's their choice to be in and stay in the forces. If they don't want what's available, they can release and go live some place that isn't expensive.

While that is true, it's not like said Cpl can just give 2 weeks notice and go. Assuming they don't have 25+ years in, it's 6 months of living in a place that they can't afford, etc. "If you don't like it, leave" doesn't really work when the mbr can't just leave.

Also, if this is the mindset the CAF will be going with, then we shouldn't be surprised when our retention levels plummet (even more).

 

[MilEME09]

If the CAF wants us to work in a certain location it better be prepared to make sure the member can actually live in said location. Cost of loving is much different in Ottawa vs Edmonton. The CAF must recognize this and make adjustments so the quality of life is equal for all members.

 

[dapaterson]

A bit of context for CAF Reg F pay rates, excluding allowances like SDA, LDA and PLD.

VAdm / LGen - Top 1% of household income.

Cmdre / BGen - Top 5% of household income.

CDR / LCol - Top 10% of household income.

Lt(N) / Capt & PO1 / WO (non spec) - Top 25% of household income.

LS / Cpl (non spec) - Top 50% of household income.

Somehow, Canadians outside the CAF are able to live on those incomes...

 

[Halifax Tar]

A bit of context for CAF Reg F pay rates, excluding allowances like SDA, LDA and PLD.

VAdm / LGen - Top 1% of household income.

Cmdre / BGen - Top 5% of household income.

CDR / LCol - Top 10% of household income.

Lt(N) / Capt & PO1 / WO (non spec) - Top 25% of household income.

LS / Cpl (non spec) - Top 50% of household income.

Somehow, Canadians outside the CAF are able to live on those incomes...

Not debating your stats, but how do you get those ?

 

[dapaterson]

Amounts taken from Household Income Percentile Calculator for Canada Including 17 Household Income Statistics for 2021 | The Kickass Entrepreneur

Then mapped basic pay rates (x12) against those thresholds.

 

[lenaitch]

Honest questions. Does the CAF has some kind of allowance for postings to locations classified as 'high cost'? Are RHU rates set as a reflection of the local rental housing market? If 'yes' to the allowance and if RHU rates are below local rates, does the CRA consider them as taxable benefits?

 

[dapaterson]

RHUs are supposed to be market rate.

Post Living Differential (PLD) is supposed to compensate for high cost of living, but has had rates frozen for a long time and needs an overhaul. It is a taxable benefit, but not pensionable.

 

[PuckChaser]

Rates frozen, and rates baselined at Ottawa which is turning into major metropolitan center. The median household income in Ottawa is also around $83k, 25% above that Cpls salary.

 

[SupersonicMax]

A bit of context for CAF Reg F pay rates, excluding allowances like SDA, LDA and PLD.

VAdm / LGen - Top 1% of household income.

Cmdre / BGen - Top 5% of household income.

CDR / LCol - Top 10% of household income.

Lt(N) / Capt & PO1 / WO (non spec) - Top 25% of household income.

LS / Cpl (non spec) - Top 50% of household income.

Somehow, Canadians outside the CAF are able to live on those incomes...

Sure but a civilian doesn’t have to move and often doesn’t move as often as CAF members. If I was a civilian, I wouldn’t move to Ottawa this year simply because I can’t afford it.

 

[daftandbarmy]

While that is true, it's not like said Cpl can just give 2 weeks notice and go. Assuming they don't have 25+ years in, it's 6 months of living in a place that they can't afford, etc. "If you don't like it, leave" doesn't really work when the mbr can't just leave.

Also, if this is the mindset the CAF will be going with, then we shouldn't be surprised when our retention levels of the best people plummet (even more).

There, FTFY

 

[Remius]

Ottawa is a crazy market. I would not be able to afford my home right now if I had to get into this market. I could probably list it for a million. And my house is just over 2 years old. Bought at about 600k for 2700 sq ft 4 bedroom three bath. New townhomes in the next phase over are going for over 700K.

While I agree with the “you choose where you live” and what you do, there are still limits to outside factors that are out of people’s control. This market situation is one of them. 2 years ago I could afford my house now if I had to buy it I couldn’t. That has nothing to do with where I chose to live or what I do.

 

[Good2Golf]

Market heat moves around. Years ago, Cold Lake was effectively unaffordable because of the spillover of Fort MacMurry’s hot real estate market.

 

[Loachman]

Cost of loving is much different in Ottawa vs Edmonton.

Is there an allowance to help with that?

 

[Lumber]

If the CAF wants us to work in a certain location it better be prepared to make sure the member can actually live in said location. Cost of loving is much different in Ottawa vs Edmonton. The CAF must recognize this and make adjustments so the quality of life is equal for all members.

No, it's your choice to stay in the forces or not. If you can't afford a house where the CAF plans on moving you, you have the option to release and move some place less expensive.