Who makes the C6??

[1feral1]

The C6 is an 'off the shelf' basic purchase from FN Herstal, and there is nothing unique about it. Commonly known as the MAG 58.

As for the US (made in USA by a FN plant in SE USA) MAG 58. Its known as the M240B, nad has a few mods including a different flash suppressor, heat guard, rail system around the barrel, and a picatinny rail on the feed cover. Plastic butts are alos used. wanna see a pic? Go to the photo section here on this site as I posted a few pics of one that I was working on.

It has replaced the M60 in both the uS Army and USMC.

Anyways go have a squiz of the pics.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[1feral1]

Good one about the carrying handle scope Mike. LMAF.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[1feral1]

Those MG42's are most likley Yugoslavian SARAC 53's which are still made in Yugoslavi and used in the original 7.92 x 57mm. Yes many original WW2 German made MG42's can still be encountered.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[AlphaCharlie]

I'm pretty sure knowledge of a .50HMG would make any ETF team rethink an assualt on a clubhouse.   I'm assuming that .50HMG fire would go right through standard body armour used by the police and their ETF teams, right?

Ahum... YEAH. Even if a .50cal misses your head by 1-2 inches it can still be blown apart by the concussive shockwave.

And Wesley, you can edit your posts, no need to make 3 in a row.

 

[KevinB]

Ahum... YEAH. Even if a .50cal misses your head by 1-2 inches it can still be blown apart by the concussive shockwave.

Well considering their are USN pers that have been documented surviving point blank hits with .50 (ND's on the boats)  :

I think some of you guys have watched to many movies - where are they going to get ammo  ???
The .50 has such a low ROF it is not a very good anti-pers weapon.

Now if MG42's started popping up in HA clubhouses...

 

[Spr.Earl]

Wes,Mike correct me if I'm wrong.
The Mag 58 was designed from the MG 42?
Just a improved version and but still kept the sustained roll as the MG.'s had in WW2.?

 

[AlphaCharlie]

Well considering their are USN pers that have been documented surviving point blank hits with .50 (ND's on the boats)   :

I find that hard to believe. Maybe point blank on their arm or something...

 

[stukirkpatrick]

well i found more about the .50 cal story today, - the weapon was seized from a farm off of highway 61 (!), from drug dealers, who had it mounted in a window, and wanted to use it to protect their operation - the weapon was going to be used against police cruisers (and their occupants).

 

[Infanteer]

I find that hard to believe. Maybe point blank on their arm or something...

How many times have you fired the .50 cal?

You don't seem to recognize when you are being told something.  Have you not yet recognized the fact that you are for the most part unqualified to give any sort of facts or statements on small arms characteristics?

 

[Spr.Earl]

I find that hard to believe. Maybe point blank on their arm or something...

How many times have you fired the .50 cal?

You don't seem to recognize when you are being told something.   Have you not yet recognized the fact that you are for the most part unqualified to give any sort of facts or statements on small arms characteristics?

Alfa,on my machine gunner's course we did a penetration shoot with .50 and I can avow that the .50 can penetrate anything when aimed   on a concentrated target with the correct ammo. ,by which I mean aiming at one target with a few belt's!


A .50 would rip a body apart

Case in piont,when we did our Anti Air with the .50,the old seagull's saw the balloon's and when we fired the round's it took the air from under neath them,quite funny seening the shite hawk's losing air as the round's passed under them and they just flapping about like bunch of young sprog's which you are.

So don't try to B.S. an old B.S.'er.

 

[AlphaCharlie]

How many times have you fired the .50 cal?

You don't seem to recognize when you are being told something.   Have you not yet recognized the fact that you are for the most part unqualified to give any sort of facts or statements on small arms characteristics?

I may be not be a small arms SME but I can tell you by using simple logic, a person should NOT be able to survive a .50 cal shot. Granted everything has exceptions, and i'm sure this incident was one in a million (same way a kid took a .38 special to his head and lived... albeit with half a head).

The .50cal projectile is huge, and if a 7.62mm round makes a mess, a .50 caL can only be worse.

 

[1feral1]

Hi Nick. The MG 42 and the MAG 58 are two different MGs with entuire different gas systems, and they dont have much in common.

See ya on Monday.

Cheers,

Wes

 

[1feral1]

WRT the Nifty .50:

I have ben directly involved in complete and total re-builds of the M2 HB, and QCB conversion in Australia. From bare recievers to torture testing, belt after belt. From indoor ranges to the amazing trg areas of Shoalwater Bay and beyond. I have been around this wpn since 1977.

One time I viewed USMC WW2 colour footage of the .50 being fired at ranges under 5 metres from an AMTRAC on Japanese troops who were lying in a trench, and who all were manily already dead. I can only describe it as shooting a 12 ga shot gun into piles of fish guts. Pretty shocking stuff!

Unless there was some kind of devine intervention, I cant see anyone survivng a point blank shot from this type of weapon.

 

[MedCorps]

>>The .50cal projectile is huge, and if a 7.62mm round makes a mess, a .50 caL can only be worse.

It is not the size that REALLY matters... it is the velocity of the round.

Work with me for a second...

Kinetic Energy = (Mass x Velocity squared) / 2 

Thus velocity almost to the exclusion of mass is the primary factor in wounding power.  If you plug some numbers into the formula above it is easy to see that doubling the mass of a round only doubles the KE.  If you double the velocity (which from a practical standpoint I am told is quite hard to do) you quadruple the KE.   

Something to think about. 

Does a round reach peak velocity when it is exiting the barrel? 

Cheers,

MC

 

[jswift872]

i failed science sorry.... ???

i read that a few times and couldn't get what you meant..lol

 

[Scott]

There was an RCA Captain who survived a hit from a .50 in Yugo about 10 years ago, I did my QL3 with his son. Read about him in Tested Mettle. As much as I hate to promote the Useless Taylor he reported very well the story of this Captain. I don't use his name here for privacy reasons. As far as I know he is still serving today, he took a few months off after being shot though!

 

[Michael Dorosh]

I may be not be a small arms SME but I can tell you by using simple logic, a person should NOT be able to survive a .50 cal shot. Granted everything has exceptions, and i'm sure this incident was one in a million (same way a kid took a .38 special to his head and lived... albeit with half a head).

The .50cal projectile is huge, and if a 7.62mm round makes a mess, a .50 caL can only be worse.

Robert Lawrence was a platoon commander in the Scots Guards at Tumbledown Mountain in the Malvinas war in 1982; an Argentinian soldier shot him through the head at point blank range with an FN.  The 7.62 mm round took away half his brain, but he survived, was awarded the Military Cross, and had sufficient mental capability left to write a book on his experiences as well as have a movie made about him.  From what I read in the book, he was invalided out of the Army but was able to lead a normal life; could walk, talk and think.  There are, as you say, exceptions.

 

[KevinB]

In all seriousness 5.56mm can be worse at close range than either the .50BMG (beleive it or not) or the 7.62mm NATO round - assuming a ball round for all three.

Why:
5.56mm fragments

7.62mm will make a hole - and .50 will make a big hole, but neither typically yaw or fragment - meaning the wound channel is caused entirely by the primary missle - not by secondary fragments (which gets messy and more damage not in a linear path with the projectile).

That said I won't be voluntering to demo this fact.


Secondly the weapon seized was not used - nor was it in fact operational, yeah that bolt group is kinda necessary, the weapon appears to be a dewat that a group tried to reactivate   :

unfortunately no matter of laws will get illegal gangs to obey laws

 

[MedCorps]

This reminds me of a British study that looked at 5.56 mm bullet wounds in Northern Ireland from 1969-1979.  It contained a data base of 67 people shot. 


Location of Hit              Dead before hospital      Died at Hospital        Lived

Head (Brain)                  7                                            1                                  0
Head (Face)                    0                                            0                                  4
Neck                                0                                              0                                2
Chest                                7                                            2                                  9 
Chest & Abdm                0                                              1                                1
Abdominal                      0                                              4                                5
Upper Limbs                    0                                              0                                11
Lower Limbs                  0                                              0                                  13

Total Died: 32.8%
Total Lived: 67.2%

Hit in the limbs your ok...
Hit in the head your not so ok
Hit in the Chest or Guts it is 50 / 50
Wear your body armour and brain buckets kids

Cheers,

MC

 

[Redeye]

I may be not be a small arms SME but I can tell you by using simple logic, a person should NOT be able to survive a .50 cal shot. Granted everything has exceptions, and i'm sure this incident was one in a million (same way a kid took a .38 special to his head and lived... albeit with half a head).

The .50cal projectile is huge, and if a 7.62mm round makes a mess, a .50 caL can only be worse.

Robert Lawrence was a platoon commander in the Scots Guards at Tumbledown Mountain in the Malvinas war in 1982; an Argentinian soldier shot him through the head at point blank range with an FN.   The 7.62 mm round took away half his brain, but he survived, was awarded the Military Cross, and had sufficient mental capability left to write a book on his experiences as well as have a movie made about him.   From what I read in the book, he was invalided out of the Army but was able to lead a normal life; could walk, talk and think.   There are, as you say, exceptions.

John Tescione took five 7.62x39s at close range on a cold Croatian night and lived to tell the tale, he even stayed in the Army for several years afterward.  Two of the rounds hit him in the head.  Just about anything is possible with effective medical attention.