US Navy cutting basic to 9 weeks from 10.

[SeaKingTacco]

All my ships were special to me. PRO was probably the most impactful, but I really enjoyed CAL, OTT and VAN- all for different reasons.

 

[brihard]

Sadly no FRE, is an alongside training platform at the moment. Shes in bad shape. So we will be putting NEP and QL3 sailors through their paces in what we can train while not under way.

I have an attachment to FRE. She and I have lot of time together, I'm sad to see her in this state.

All good man, pick away.

Presumably the crew complement for Freddy (which sounds like it’ll be staying alongside) is going to be less? And why the outright crew swap? Balancing personnel tempo?

 

[FSTO]

All my ships were special to me. PRO was probably the most impactful, but I really enjoyed CAL, OTT and VAN- all for different reasons.

Once a Fraser, always a Fraser.

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

Didn't know you started life in the army: 78th Fraser Highlanders - Wikipedia

 

[Halifax Tar]

Presumably the crew complement for Freddy (which sounds like it’ll be staying alongside) is going to be less? And why the outright crew swap? Balancing personnel tempo?

So we are quite literally going to walk from side of the jetty to the other put on a new hat and trade ships with the Freddy crew. The reason is CHA is going work up again and deploy again in the near future. She is in a better material state than FRE. And the current crew (Mine) is due for some downtime.

But yes, out core will get whittled away as the requirements are less.

I expect to go down to 4 cooks, 3 clerks, 4 storesmen... Or less.

Just enough to keep the lights on and the water on the outside.

 

[Halifax Tar]

All my ships were special to me. PRO was probably the most impactful, but I really enjoyed CAL, OTT and VAN- all for different reasons.

PRO x 2, STJ x 2, TOR, FRE x 3 (Including Stalker/COVID), CHA.

FRE and I have been through a lot together, 2020 was a hell of a year. I'm very happy my CHOD tour will end under a FRE hat; I just wish she was in better shape.

 

[brihard]

So we are quite literally going to walk from side of the jetty to the other put on a new hat and trade ships with the Freddy crew. The reason is CHA is going work up again and deploy again in the near future. She is in a better material state than FRE. And the current crew (Mine) is due for some downtime.

But yes, out core will get whittled away as the requirements are less.

I expect to go down to 4 cooks, 3 clerks, 4 storesmen... Or less.

Just enough to keep the lights on and the water on the outside.

Oh, got it. I assumed the actual ship would be stood down for longer refits or something. Not sure why I assumed that. If she’s headed back out then yeah, crew swap makes sense.

 

[Halifax Tar]

Oh, got it. I assumed the actual ship would be stood down for longer refits or something. Not sure why I assumed that. If she’s headed back out then yeah, crew swap makes sense.

Because our small fleet and big fleet level taskings we tend to run specific ships into the ground. Since 2020 it was FRE, she's finally been paused, now it's CHA. CHA will be heading off on Op Horizon in the near(ish) future.

If we had a big enough fleet, I would hope proper refits between readiness cycles would be a thing. Right now we drive'em like we stole'em until they quit and then move onto the next ship.

I've heard rumors FREs need refit (2027) will be upwards of 4 to 7 years long.

 

[FSTO]

Didn't know you started life in the army: 78th Fraser Highlanders - Wikipedia

Ha ha

HMCS Fraser (DDH 233) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[Oldgateboatdriver]

I knew that - I served on Skeena!

 

[quadrapiper]

You are forgetting all of the overhead of running a school- that would then be duplicated 3 times (or more), if each service ran their own BMQ.

Wouldn't it be more in the nature of expanding the Fleet Schools' (or whoever's running NETP), and equivalent CA and RCAF establishments', capacity?

 

[dimsum]

Wouldn't it be more in the nature of expanding the Fleet Schools' (or whoever's running NETP), and equivalent CA and RCAF establishments', capacity?

The RCAF does not have a common trade school after BMQ. Each trade or set of trades goes to a different place - Portage or Winnipeg for aircrew, Borden for techs, etc.

 

[SupersonicMax]

I’ve worked with the US military to realize that for a service the size of the CAF, we need to smash cultural stovepipes if they don’t make sense, and if you inculcate recruits into a specific service without showing them the broader picture (as in there are three inter-related services for most of the trades) then they get blindered going forward.

Except the "big" picture is all Army.

I didn’t get much from BOTC (predecessor of BMOQ). I could have not done it and do fine. In fact, I know someone that has never done BMOQ/BOTC as they were CEOTP, and someone mistakenly put the course as completed on their file before they had done it. They are doing fine today.

 

[dimsum]

Except the "big" picture is all Army.

Sort of? Presumably some of the staff are RCAF and RCN.

I didn’t get much from BOTC (predecessor of BMOQ). I could have not done it and do fine. In fact, I know someone that has never done BMOQ/BOTC as they were CEOTP, and someone mistakenly put the course as completed on their file before they had done it. They are doing fine today.

Sure, but you’re arguing a different thing altogether (not having BMQ / BMOQ at all, versus splitting it to service-specific courses).

I don’t totally disagree, but for recruits who have zero knowledge of the military, they all have to start somewhere.

 

[daftandbarmy]

Except the "big" picture is all Army.

I didn’t get much from BOTC (predecessor of BMOQ). I could have not done it and do fine. In fact, I know someone that has never done BMOQ/BOTC as they were CEOTP, and someone mistakenly put the course as completed on their file before they had done it. They are doing fine today.

Special Forces, I understand, is looking at recruiting direct from civvie street.

I'm not sure how much bed block building/ close order drill etc. might be required to become an operator, but I'm sure they'll be able to figure that out

Canadian Forces looking at recruiting elite, special-forces soldiers right off the street - National | Globalnews.ca

Traditionally, special-forces soldiers need to spend several years in the military. But times are changing.

globalnews.ca

 

[Navy_Pete]

Because our small fleet and big fleet level taskings we tend to run specific ships into the ground. Since 2020 it was FRE, she's finally been paused, now it's CHA. CHA will be heading off on Op Horizon in the near(ish) future.

If we had a big enough fleet, I would hope proper refits between readiness cycles would be a thing. Right now we drive'em like we stole'em until they quit and then move onto the next ship.

I've heard rumors FREs need refit (2027) will be upwards of 4 to 7 years long.

2027? Jesus that's a long time since the last refit, no? I thought that was around 2019, and she was sailing around with restrictions on the hull since 2021 or something.

I'd be surprised if some of the ships don't get retired when the price comes in, and we're already not maintaining them to basic SOLAS standards.

 

[dimsum]

Special Forces, I understand, is looking at recruiting direct from civvie street.

I'm not sure how much bed block building/ close order drill etc. might be required to become an operator, but I'm sure they'll be able to figure that out

Canadian Forces looking at recruiting elite, special-forces soldiers right off the street - National | Globalnews.ca

Traditionally, special-forces soldiers need to spend several years in the military. But times are changing.

globalnews.ca

That was from 2019 and I’m pretty sure it didn’t end up happening.

 

[Eaglelord17]

2027? Jesus that's a long time since the last refit, no? I thought that was around 2019, and she was sailing around with restrictions on the hull since 2021 or something.

I'd be surprised if some of the ships don't get retired when the price comes in, and we're already not maintaining them to basic SOLAS standards.

It’s almost like 30+ year old hulls with questionable maintenance done on them during that time don’t hold out as well as we would like.

 

[quadrapiper]

The RCAF does not have a common trade school after BMQ. Each trade or set of trades goes to a different place - Portage or Winnipeg for aircrew, Borden for techs, etc.

Would an RCAF common course be useful?

 

[SeaKingTacco]

Would an RCAF common course be useful?

To do what?