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US Election: 2016

Chris Pook said:
Gentlemen.

Is anybody going to "win" this discussion?
No,  given the key participants' track record thus far, it will just go mindlessly on and on..... unless the site owner says "enough of this BS," and shuts it down like the equally repetitious dead horse beating that was the Canadian political thread.
 
Journeyman said:
No,  given the key participants' track record thus far, it will just go mindlessly on and on..... unless the site owner says "enough of this BS," and shuts it down like the equally repetitious dead horse beating that was the Canadian political thread.

I will withdraw from the discussion such as it is.I am a bit tired of the 24/7 anti-Trump bashing by the media and cannot wait until the election.Although if Trump wins then the media wont let up.Meanwhile I hope Trump learns that he doesnt have to respond to every attack.In the case of the Khans he is in a lose-lose argument.Best to avoid these in the future.Focus on Hillary there is enough damaging info out there and she isnt a very sympathetic figure.
 
tomahawk6 said:
I will withdraw from the discussion such as it is.
Unlike the ideologues with their individual chew-toys, you're the only one with a direct stake in this "discussion";  you should  be part of this.



... assuming there's any value to be had in continuing :deadhorse:
 
tomahawk6 said:
I will withdraw from the discussion such as it is.I am a bit tired of the 24/7 anti-Trump bashing by the media and cannot wait until the election.Although if Trump wins then the media wont let up.Meanwhile I hope Trump learns that he doesnt have to respond to every attack.In the case of the Khans he is in a lose-lose argument.Best to avoid these in the future.Focus on Hillary there is enough damaging info out there and she isnt a very sympathetic figure.

I think that is exactly what he needs to do.  focus on Clinton and why she is a bad choice.  I'm sure that Clinton will engage by using proxies.  Khan and his wife are perfect examples.  Trump never served, but neither have the Clintons (I know Hillary is a woman and couldn't have served at the time) but they are winning that side of things by using proxies to fight her fight.  Focus on her and why she would be a terrible POTUS.  Her approval ratings are her weak point right now.  Keep hammering at that and leave the Khans and whoever to their own things.  No one would have batted an eye over this Khan thing if he had kept his mouth shut or at least state something along the lines of him respecting his opinion but disagreeing.
 
Remius said:
I think that is exactly what he needs to do.  focus on Clinton and why she is a bad choice.  I'm sure that Clinton will engage by using proxies.  Khan and his wife are perfect examples.  Trump never served, but neither have the Clintons (I know Hillary is a woman and couldn't have served at the time) but they are winning that side of things by using proxies to fight her fight.  Focus on her and why she would be a terrible POTUS.  Her approval ratings are her weak point right now.  Keep hammering at that and leave the Khans and whoever to their own things.  No one would have batted an eye over this Khan thing if he had kept his mouth shut or at least state something along the lines of him respecting his opinion but disagreeing.
he can't.  He is incapable of not responding and hitting back.

If I were the Democrats I would have someone on TV, a sympathetic person, little girl, handicap individual, wounded war vet, grieving mother, and have them attached trump.

Then I sit back and watch as trump tries to destroy all who have takes badly about him. It makes him look like an ass while clinton stays out of the negative spotlight. And it's trumps own fault.
 
Remius said:
I know Hillary is a woman and couldn't have served at the time

My aunt served in WWII.  Is Hillary older than her?

Keep hammering at that and leave the Khans and whoever to their own things.

Their own thing?  That would be an immigration lawyer specializing in Muslim immigration.
 
Rocky Mountains said:
My aunt served in WWII.  Is Hillary older than her?

Their own thing?  That would be an immigration lawyer specializing in Muslim immigration.


You know what I meant.  She would never have deployed into combat. No offence but you seem to have missed the point of my post.

Who cares about Khan?  And who would have guessed that Clinton would have had partisan speakers at her own nomination.  Figure that.

Trump cannot win this particular fight.  He won't and can't.  So why even bother.  Do you know why no one is not too up in arms about the speaker at the GOP convention who lambasted Clinton about her son dying during the Benghazi incident? Because Clinton didn't respond.  Trump responded and created this mess.  KHan could have been an obscure footnote but he couldn't let it go.
 
Remius said:
You know what I meant.  She would never have deployed into combat. No offence but you seem to have missed the point of my post.

Who cares about Khan?  And who would have guessed that Clinton would have had partisan speakers at her own nomination.  Figure that.

Trump cannot win this particular fight.  He won't and can't.  So why even bother.  Do you know why no one is not too up in arms about the speaker at the GOP convention who lambasted Clinton about her son dying during the Benghazi incident? Because Clinton didn't respond.  Trump responded and created this mess.  KHan could have been an obscure footnote but he couldn't let it go.
He never let a slight go.after the rnc who did he attack? Ted cruz
 
Remius said:
You know what I meant.  She would never have deployed into combat. No offence but you seem to have missed the point of my post.

Who cares about Khan?  And who would have guessed that Clinton would have had partisan speakers at her own nomination.  Figure that.

Trump cannot win this particular fight.  He won't and can't.  So why even bother.  Do you know why no one is not too up in arms about the speaker at the GOP convention who lambasted Clinton about her son dying during the Benghazi incident? Because Clinton didn't respond.  Trump responded and created this mess.  KHan could have been an obscure footnote but he couldn't let it go.

But there is the salient point that has been brought up by others.  Mr. Trump is too quick to rise to the bait and swallow it whole.  I would expect that most folks would want someone at the tiller who isn't so easy to get going like that.  He continues at times to behave as one might expect on a reality television garbage type show.  I would hope he could do better.
 
I'm sure he is getting plenty of pointers from his family and GOP supporters. If he can put them into practice and polish his tone and his speech a bit, I'm sure he'd have no trouble finishing off Clinton. They just need to take his phone away from him so he can't post to anything.

The whole Khan debacle should have run its course by now. Given all the ties the guy has shown he has with the Clintons and his conflict of interest, he's outlived his usefulness and the Clintons are ready to jettison him and not look back.
 
recceguy said:
I'm sure he is getting plenty of pointers from his family and GOP supporters. If he can put them into practice and polish his tone and his speech a bit, I'm sure he'd have no trouble finishing off Clinton. They just need to take his phone away from him so he can't post to anything.

The whole Khan debacle should have run its course by now. Given all the ties the guy has shown he has with the Clintons and his conflict of interest, he's outlived his usefulness and the Clintons are ready to jettison him and not look back.
he was on abc (?) when he attacked the khan family.
 
recceguy said:
I'm sure he is getting plenty of pointers from his family and GOP supporters ... They just need to take his phone away from him so he can't post to anything.
:nod:  I wouldn't want to be the one to try to take it, though.
 
The last year has shown that no one can do anything to rein him in, or they would already have done it.

Trump has been this way since he was old enough to politely ask the servants wipe his butt.

His father taught him that any sign of weakness was a failure and failure was to be rejected. Upthread I posted a link to an article about one of his mentors, Roy Cohn. Trump learned a lot of his adversarial, punch back harder than they hit you, scorched earth approach from Cohn.

https://army.ca/forums/threads/108210/post-1441397.html#msg1441397

Trump will not change, and there is no one within the campaign organization, or his family that can. Short of literally threateniing his manhood, The only thing that he understands is a beatdown, both literally and figuratively. And this is a man that has the resources to destroy all that challenge him and the willingness to use them. Short of having him locked up in solitary, we are stuck with him.

I will be interested to see how he reacts should he lose the electiion. I don't expect there will be a consession speech. There may be a long diatribe on how the system was rigged, and that Clinton bought the election, and there may well be a court challenge, especially if the final results are anywhere close. Which now makes the vacant SCOTUS seat all the more problematic.
 
And as further proof of Trump's vindictive nature towards those he perceives as being disloyal:

Trump refuses to support Paul Ryan, John McCain in upcoming Republican primaries

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-refuses-to-endorse-paul-ryan-in-gop-primary-im-just-not-quite-there-yet/2016/08/02/1449f028-58e9-11e6-831d-0324760ca856_story.html

Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump is refusing to back House Speaker Paul D. Ryan in his upcoming primary election, saying in an interview Tuesday that he is “not quite there yet” in endorsing his party’s top-ranking elected official.

Trump also said he was not supporting Sen. John McCain in his primary in Arizona, and he singled out Sen. Kelly Ayotte as a weak and disloyal leader in New Hampshire, a state whose presidential primary Trump won handily.

With Ryan’s Wisconsin primary scheduled for next Tuesday, Trump praised the House speaker’s underdog opponent, Paul Nehlen, for running “a very good campaign.” Trump said that Ryan has sought his endorsement — an assertion that a Ryan spokesman denied later Tuesday — but that as of now he is only “giving it very serious consideration.”

“I like Paul, but these are horrible times for our country,” Trump said. “We need very strong leadership. We need very, very strong leadership. And I’m just not quite there yet. I’m not quite there yet.”

Trump’s refusal to back Ryan represents an extraordinary breach of political decorum and signals that the Republican Party remains divided two weeks after a national convention in Cleveland staged to showcase party unity.

Trump made his comments during a wide-ranging interview Tuesday afternoon over lunch at the Trump National Golf Club in Northern Virginia.

Trump and Ryan have had a difficult and tense relationship over the past few months. Ryan endorsed Trump this spring after he became the presumptive nominee and spoke on his behalf at the convention, but only after a period of public soul-searching.

Ryan has disagreed with Trump on several key issues — including his proposed temporary ban on Muslims entering the United States — and issued a statement over the weekend that indirectly took issue with Trump’s belittling of the parents of dead U.S. Army captain Humayun Khan.

“Many Muslim Americans have served valiantly in our military, and made the ultimate sacrifice,” Ryan said in the statement. “Captain Khan was one such brave example. His sacrifice — and that of Khizr and Ghazala Khan — should always be honored. Period.”

McCain could not be reached immediately for comment. The Ryan spokesman, Zack Roday, issued this statement: "Neither Speaker Ryan nor anyone on his team has ever asked for Donald Trump's endorsement. And we are confident in a victory next week regardless."

With wife Ghazala at his side, Khizr Khan spoke at last week’s Democratic National Convention. He said Trump “smears the character of Muslims” and challenged the Republican nominee’s knowledge of the U.S. Constitution.

Asked about the Khans, Trump said in Tuesday’s interview, “I was viciously attacked on the stage, and I have a right to answer back. That’s all I have to say about it.”

In making his comments Tuesday, Trump may have been seeking retribution for Ryan’s dragging his feet about endorsing Trump in May. Trump’s phrasing of his uncertainty about Ryan — “I’m just not quite there yet” — echoes what Ryan told CNN’s Jake Tapper in a May interview about endorsing Trump: “I’m just not ready to do that at this point. I’m not there right now.”

Nehlen came to Trump’s defense for his comments about the Khans, for which Trump thanked him in a tweet Monday night. Trump’s shout-out sparked speculation that he might endorse Nehlen.

Asked about this in the Tuesday interview, Trump said that Nehlen “sent me a nice letter and I merely thanked him.”

“[Ryan’s] opponent is a big fan of what I’m saying — big fan,” Trump said. “His opponent, who’s running a very good campaign, obviously, I’ve heard — his opponent sent me a very scholarly and well thought out letter yesterday and all I did was say thank you very much for your very nice letter. You saw my statement.”

Trump added, “I’m giving very serious consideration to that whole situation, to Ryan, to Paul.”

On Monday, McCain, a Vietnam war hero, issued a lengthy statement denouncing Trump for his comments about the Khan family. Asked about McCain’s rebuke, Trump said, “I haven’t endorsed John McCain.

“I’ve never been there with John McCain because I’ve always felt that he should have done a much better job for the vets,” Trump continued. “He has not done a good job for the vets and I’ve always felt that he should have done a much better job for the vets. So I’ve always had a difficult time with John for that reason, because our vets are not being treated properly. They’re not being treated fairly.”
McCain is locked in a three-way Republican primary — the election is Aug. 30 and early voting begins this week — against former state senator Kelli Ward and tea party activist Clair Van Steenwyk. A third challenger, Alex Meluskey, suspended his campaign this week.

Trump said he thought it was a mistake for senators to distance themselves from him because of his popularity with the Republican base. He singled out Ayotte, who like McCain condemned Trump’s comments about the Khans.

“New Hampshire is one of my favorite places,” Trump said. “You have a Kelly Ayotte who doesn’t want to talk about Trump, but I’m beating her in the polls by a lot. You tell me. Are these people that should be representing us, okay? You tell me.”

Trump continued, “I don’t know Kelly Ayotte. I know she’s given me no support — zero support — and yet I’m leading her in the polls. I’m doing very well in New Hampshire. We need loyal people in this country. We need fighters in this country. We don’t need weak people. We have enough of them. We need fighters in this country. But Kelly Ayotte has given me zero support, and I’m doing great in New Hampshire.”

Ayotte tweeted a response later Tuesday: “I call it like I see it and I'm always going to stand up for our military families and what's best for the people of New Hampshire.”

She also still plans to vote for Trump, according to her campaign
 
Really, the only person who has had the cahones to call Trump out, and stand on his convictions is Ted Cruz.

I'm now going to go have a long hot shower and try to wash that icky feeling away. [:D
 
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3635882/Hillary-Clinton-called-disabled-children-Easter-egg-hunt-f-ing-ree-tards-referred-Jews-stupid-k-s-Bill-called-Jesse-Jackson-damned-n-r-claims-Bill-s-former-lover.html

EXCLUSIVE: Hillary Clinton once called disabled children at an Easter egg hunt 'f***ing ree-tards' and referred to Jews as 'stupid k***s' while Bill called Jesse Jackson a 'damned n****r,' claims Bill's former lover
• Bill Clinton's former lover Dolly Kyle claims the Clinton couple regularly used racial epithets in her new book, Hillary: The Other Woman
• She writes that Hillary was caught on record blurting out the terms 'stupid k**e' and 'f***ing Jew b*****d'
• She says Bill called the Reverend Jesse Jackson a 'Goddamned n****r'
• But rumors of Bill's trysts with black women were rampant in Little Rock
• One prominent black female newscaster bragged openly about her relationship with the governor, although 'only' indulged in oral sex
• Bill Clinton's 'three strikes' rule incarcerated 2.5 million people, including poor people of color who couldn't afford lawyers during their trials
• When Hillary moved to Arkansas, she looked down her nose at what she viewed as 'ignorant hillbillies'

By CAROLINE HOWE FOR DAILYMAIL.COM
PUBLISHED: 16:00 GMT, 17 June 2016 | UPDATED: 15:15 GMT, 20 June 2016

Bill and Hillary Clinton profess to have always been supporters of racial equality, but anecdotes published in a new book by his ex-lover claim otherwise.
Hillary was heard calling mentally challenged children 'f*****g ree-tards' and caught on record blurting out the terms 'stupid k**e and 'f***ing Jew b*****d', while Bill called the Reverend Jesse Jackson a 'G**damned n****r'.
Bill was also sued several times by blacks and Hispanics for violations of the 1965 Voting Rights Act.
Dolly Kyle - who was just 11 when she first crossed paths with Bill, dated him through high school and began sleeping with him once they graduated - published the claims about the Clinton couple's racial epithets and politics in her new book, Hillary: The Other Woman, published by WND Books

She writes of one occasion, when developmentally challenged children were having difficulty picking up the eggs at a traditional Easter egg hunt on the grounds of the governor's mansion during Bill's tenure in the Arkansas state house.

Reluctant hostess Hillary had enough.
'The frustrated Me-First Lady demanded, "When are they going to get those f*****g ree-tards out of here?"' Dolly writes.10

Behind the Reverend Jesse Jackson's back, the Clinton duo called him, 'That G**damned n****r'.
Dolly claims the couple used the same insult toward Robert 'Say' McIntosh, one of the leading African-American activists in Little Rock, Arkansas when Bill was governor. McIntosh was dogging Clinton about ongoing relationships with black prostitutes, q charge, she says, Bill never denied
.
Clinton never denied stories that he was having an ongoing relationship with one black prostitute as well as her friends. He did deny a rumor that he had fathered a child with a black prostitute while governor and took a DNA test that was reported as negative.
Rumors of the trysts throughout Little Rock and were aided by 'one prominent black female newscaster who used to brag openly around the television station about her relationship with the governor, although they were 'only' indulging in oral sex'.

Bill Clinton and Dolly grew up with Jim Crow laws in place in the plantation mentality of the South and they were in full force during the 1950s and '60s.

It was a segregated society in Hot Springs at that time. Black and white students went to different schools. In the movie theaters, black people had to watch the movie from a balcony, use separate bathrooms and water fountains.
'Signs that separated 'WHITES' and 'COLORED' were deadly serious and always enforced', Dolly writes.
In Arkansas, everyone had to pay a $2 poll tax to vote, and the cost was a huge sum for many black people.
The black vote was further diluted by 'gerrymandering, a wide-spread practice of dividing electoral districts along racial lines to dilute the black vote'.

Not one black was voted into the Arkansas legislation in hundreds of elections.
In the 1980s, Clinton was sued several times by blacks and Hispanics for violations of the 1965 Voting Rights Act and he lost every case.
The district lines were redrawn under court order.
Ben McGee was a black Democrat was elected to the state legislature in 1988. Clinton tried to replace McGee with a white Democrat of his choice, claims Dolly.
The case went all the way to the Supreme Court was ruled 8-0 against Clinton and the Arkansas officials who challenged McGee's election.

In the 1980s, Hispanics were moving into Arkansas in greater numbers and Clinton began racial profiling against Hispanics, she claims.
He instituted the racial profiling program three years after his brother, Roger Clinton went to prison in 1985 for dealing cocaine.

The program was initially part of his anti-drug program, although Roger's drug suppliers and buyers were white.
'For no good reason, Bill and Hillary decided to profile Hispanics as drug dealers,' Dolly writes.
State troopers now had the authority to stop and search any vehicle remotely suspect of carrying drugs.
'Specifically, the troopers were to stop and search cars driven by Hispanics, especially those cars with Texas license plates.' Clinton was sued in federal court for his Criminal Apprehension Program that was ruled unconstitutional.
'Billy threw one of his infamous temper tantrums about the ban on his racial profiling of Hispanics and he threatened to renew the racial profiling program in spite of the court's ruling', Dolly reports.

Racial profiling remained in Clinton's head and several years later, he gave state troopers the right to stop and search any car.
Bill and Hillary have been very verbal in criticizing racial profiling as a 'morally indefensible, deeply corrosive practice'.
Clinton's crime bill, the Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994, was dubbed the 'three strikes' law and is one which has incarcerated over 2.5 million people, predominately poor people of color who could not afford lawyers during their trials.
The 'three strikes' rule sent people to jail for a petty crime or a major felony. It meant prison for life on the third offense, whatever that happened to be.
Clinton's solution was to 'lock 'em up and throw away the key', Dolly writes. Now he could claim credit for less unemployment.

'The unemployment numbers actually did go down, but that was partly because the young black males in prison were no longer counted as unemployed,' she adds.
And when Hillary arrived in Arkansas, Dolly writes, she looked down her nose at what she viewed as 'ignorant hillbillies'.

She was raised in a middle-class suburb in Illinois and considered herself above the southerners – unless she was campaigning in New York state where she declared herself to be a lifelong Yankees fan.
She has repeatedly told the story that she was named after Sir Edmund Hillary who became the first climber to reach the summit of Mt. Everest in 1953. Hillary was born in October 1947, six years prior to the New Zealand explorer's climb.

She was forced to amend her statement when asked about it, Dolly writes.
'Hillary didn't belong in Arkansas but here she was'.
In the governor's mansion for eight years, Bill and Hillary were both getting tired of the routine and frustrations of the small Southern state and Bill opted out of running for reelection in 1990.
He was marking his time until he could make a move for the White House.
'Hillary decided that, if Billy didn't run for reelection in 1990, she would run for governor in his place,' Dolly writes.
A statewide political poll in 1989 revealed that 'she didn't have a snowball's chance in hell of being elected governor of Arkansas'.
Back in the early 1980s, Hillary, working as a lawyer for the Rose Law Firm, was making more money than Bill was as governor.
The couple always made it known they had 'good investments', although they had no money to invest.

They were always 'on the lookout for additional income', Dolly writes.
She adds: 'I first heard about this particular deal when a couple of guys from Canada contacted me in Dallas to ask for my help.'
Dolly agreed to meet the men who were 'terrified of the Clintons'. One man stated he was going to die soon so he wasn't afraid.
'Steve was one of over two thousand Canadians infected with HIV, the AIDS virus,' Dolly claims. The source was traced to bad blood collected from inmates in Arkansas' prisons.
Inmates were paid $7 a pint for their blood and 'Billy's cronies then sold the prisoners' blood to some blood brokers for $50 per pint'.

When it was discovered that the blood was tainted, prisons instituted a 'screening process' which was merely a 'screening clerk' who was selling 'the right to bleed' to prisoners.
Infected prisoners continued to sell their blood as long as they bribed the screening clerk. Instead of the $7 fee, some received drugs.
Arkansas prisons were banned from selling blood when government officials learned that the bad blood was coming from the state.

Getting around that ban, dummy corporations were set up in other states to purchase the bad blood and then resell it.
All of that infected blood went to Canada, where between 8,000 and 10,000 people died.
Little Rock journalist Suzi Parker took on Clinton and his role in the tainted blood scandal in an exposé. She quit her investigation when she started receiving threatening phone calls in the middle of the night, writes Dolly.
The infamous Whitewater scandal was another 'good investment' for the Clintons.

The Whitewater scandal came about in the late 1970s when the Clintons partnered with friends James and Susan McDougal to purchase 220 acres of land in Arkansas that would become the Whitewater Development Corporation and was a quick-money-making scheme to build vacation homes.

With a quarter-million dollars from Madison S&L, the team bought land in an undeveloped area with 'no roads’, infrastructure, amenities, shopping and no chance to draw the kind of people who had money to buy a vacation home'.

The venture failed, thousands of dollars were lost, and James McDougal moved on to start Madison Guaranty Savings and Loan.
When federal regulators began to investigate another McDougal deal, questions about the Clintons' involvement in the Whitewater arose during President Clinton's first term in office. An investigation into the legality of the Whitewater transactions was launched.
Hillary was a partner in the Rose Law Firm as well as a partner in the Whitewater deal.
When criminal charges were brought against McDougal, he hired the Rose Law Firm.
Some of the players went to jail, one died in jail and 'the half of it has not been told'.
The Rose Law Firm was once the preeminent firm in Little Rock before the arrival of Hillary Clinton.
During the Whitewater investigation, one of the old-timer partners was asked for his opinion on Hillary.
'That b**** is going to ruin my firm', he answered.

Vince Foster, Bill's Deputy White House Counsel, had been a childhood friend of Bill's and a former partner of Hillary's at the Rose Law Firm.
He knew all of the Whitewater secrets including 'Hillary's double-billing practices that had enabled her to receive questionable foreign money with strings attached,' says the author.
He knew the skinny on the firing of the White House Travel Office [ostensibly so Hillary could hire her Arkansas cronies] and using FBI files to go after people through the IRS.
Hillary pushed Foster to end the fifty-day standoff during between the Branch Davidians and the federal and Texas state law enforcement in Waco, Texas in 1993.

Seventy-four men, women and children died a violent death, and Foster was devastated.
Dolly writes: 'I believe that Vince Foster was a man of integrity, despite his friendship with Billy and Hillary Clinton.
'I believe that Vince was about to resign because of what he had seen in his first six months of the Clinton co-presidency. I believe that his resignation would have raised a lot of probing questions.'

But before he could leave Washington, the Deputy White House Council was found dead in Fort Marcy Park off the George Washington Parkway in Virginia on July 20, 1993.
An antique, rarely-fired, gun was found in his hand.
His office safe was opened and emptied by Hillary's people, and his death was quickly ruled a suicide.
'I do not believe that Vince Foster committed suicide,' Dolly writes. 'You don't have to believe what I believe, but know this.
'The news of Vince Foster's death was being talked about in beauty shops here in Little Rock before his dead body was found in Fort Marcy Park.'

When Hillary moved into the White House, she requested nine hundred files from the FBI containing private information on people from both political parties.
'Thousands of politicians in Washington still wonder what Hillary has on them.' Dolly writes. 'If they have any secrets at all, they must live in constant dread of being publicly exposed.
'Terrorism is the use of violence and intimidation for political aims. By this definition, Hillary Clinton is a terrorist.
'With her silent threats to the nine hundred, who is going to make a peep?'
The files were subpoenaed and Hillary declared, 'We are the president'. These were the files that had been removed from Vince Foster's office and found two years later.
Hillary has been declaring herself president since Bill stepped into office in 1992.


This isn't the only unfavourable book to be coming out about her either. Should add grist for the mill, just before the elections.





 
Based on how this has gone for Trump this cycle, it's quite likely to get her a landslide.  ;D
 
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