The Merged Maher Arar Thread

[Rodders]

I would have to agree that the reason the US will not remove Arar from the no-fly list is because they(the US) made an error but are unwilling to admit it.

In response to querys by the Canadian government, US ambassador to Canada David Wilkins was quoted as saying "It's a little presumptuous for him (Day) to say who the United States can and cannot allow into our country,"

He's right! Even if the US is probably wrong in it's logic as to why they won't allow Arar into the country, they do have the right to allow or disallow anyone they wish from entering their country. It's not a store, or a place of business. It's a country!

Ironically though, it does remind me of when Trudeau passed away, and Fidel Castro was to attend the funeral. The Bush administration put up bluster that Canada should not allow him to enter our country.

I wonder if they(the US) acknowledge that we have the same rights as a nation that they so steadfastly(and rightly) claim for themselves?

 

[Trinity]

Stands to reason


Arar is currently suing the US government right now....

That alone is grounds to not let him in (IMO)

Why would you let someone in your country if he's already
alleging claims and trying to sue you?

Would you let someone into your house if they were suing you?  I doubt it.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Prime Minister releases letter of apology to Maher Arar and his family and announces completion of mediation process
News release, Prime Minister of Canada, 26 Jan 07
Article Link

Prime Minister Stephen Harper today released the letter of apology he has sent to Maher Arar and his family for any role Canadian officials may have played in what happened to Mr. Arar, Monia Mazigh and their family in 2002 and 2003.

“Although the events leading up to this terrible ordeal happened under the previous government, our Government will do everything in its power to ensure that the issues raised by Commissioner O’Connor are addressed,” said the Prime Minister.  “I sincerely hope that these actions will help Mr. Arar and his family begin a new and hopeful chapter in their lives.”

Canada’s New Government has accepted all 23 recommendations made in Commissioner O’Connor’s first report, and has already begun acting upon them.  The Government has sent letters to both the Syrian and the U.S. governments formally objecting to the treatment of Mr. Arar.  Ministers Day and MacKay have also expressed Canada’s concerns on this important issue to their American counterparts.  Finally, Canada has removed Mr. Arar from Canadian lookout lists, and requested that the United States amend its own records accordingly.

The Prime Minister also announced that Canada’s New Government has successfully completed the mediation process with Mr. Arar, fulfilling another one of Commissioner O’Connor’s recommendations.  This settlement, mutually agreed upon by all parties, ensures that Mr. Arar and his family will obtain fair compensation, in the amount of $10.5 million, plus legal costs, for the ordeal they have suffered.

The text of the Prime Minister’s letter to Maher Arar is attached.

* * * *

Dear Mr. Arar:

On behalf of the Government of Canada, I wish to apologize to you, Monia Mazigh and your family for any role Canadian officials may have played in the terrible ordeal that all of you experienced in 2002 and 2003.

Although these events occurred under the last government, please rest assured that this government will do everything in its power to ensure that the issues raised by Commissioner O’Connor are addressed.

I trust that, having arrived at a negotiated settlement, we have ensured that fair compensation will be paid to you and your family. I sincerely hope that these words and actions will assist you and your family in your efforts to begin a new and hopeful chapter in your lives.

Yours sincerely,

 

[geo]

Hmmm.... here we go again
While parties come and parties go.... Mr Harper represents THE canadian government and to the public he is the Prime Minister

Although these events occurred under the last government, once again, it's always an issue of "those dastardly liberals"
We all remember Mrs Ambrose (with the nice hair)

It doesn't matter a whit if it was the Conservatives or the Liberals.
This should not be a "photo op" for the Conservatives to get points.

 

[GAP]

One of the most interesting parts of the commentary last night, was that the Democrats are holding hearings into the rendition issues. Guess who cannot fly to the hearings to testify.

 

[The Bread Guy]

Hmmm.... here we go again
While parties come and parties go.... Mr Harper represents THE canadian government and to the public he is the Prime Minister.

Although these events occurred under the last government, once again, it's always an issue of "those dastardly liberals"
We all remember Mrs Ambrose (with the nice hair)

It doesn't matter a whit if it was the Conservatives or the Liberals.
This should not be a "photo op" for the Conservatives to get points.

Here, here!

 

[2 Cdo]

Hmmm.... here we go again
While parties come and parties go.... Mr Harper represents THE canadian government and to the public he is the Prime Minister

Although these events occurred under the last government, once again, it's always an issue of "those dastardly liberals"
We all remember Mrs Ambrose (with the nice hair)

It doesn't matter a whit if it was the Conservatives or the Liberals.
This should not be a "photo op" for the Conservatives to get points.

Sorry Geo, but I have to disagree with you. It should be not only mentioned but mentioned loudly that this incident happened on the Liberals watch. The Canadian public should be reminded of every single f*ck up the Liberal party committed in their near 13 year reign.

As far as Arar goes, no way no how does he deserve 12 million Canadian dollars. Why doesn't he try to get "compensation" from those who "actually" tortured him? Maybe he doesn't because, just maybe no torture actually occured. ??? Just a little food for thought.

 

[observor 69]

Sorry Geo, but I have to disagree with you. It should be not only mentioned but mentioned loudly that this incident happened on the Liberals watch. The Canadian public should be reminded of every single **** up the Liberal party committed in their near 13 year reign.

Riiiight, so the CPC will be implementing the recommendations of the O'Connor Report to fix all those Liberal  **** ups?

http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/story.html?id=e41280c9-18ea-49d9-b9dc-34ddf2a35bbd

 

[Rodders]

Fair enough. I agree that the people should be aware of a governments errors or possible ineptitude.

Do you agree that this is true regardless of the political stripe of that government? if(and when) the Conservatives are shown to have blundered or otherwise made bad decisions, will you be as ardent in those facts being put to the Canadian public? That's not an attack, but a genuine question.

On what basis do you offer the assertion that he was NOT tortured? Because someone is Muslim, or just because the US says so, doesn't always mean he or she is in fact a terrorist, or a liar.

 

[George Wallace]

On what basis do you offer the assertion that he was NOT tortured? Because someone is Muslim, or just because the US says so, doesn't always mean he or she is in fact a terrorist, or a liar.

I think that this is taken for granted, as NO physical evidence was provided to prove that he was.  No photos of injuries.  No medical examination or documentation.  Nothing.  Just verbal statements from him and the others who were also claiming having been tortured. 

 

[The Bread Guy]

I think that this is taken for granted, as NO physical evidence was provided to prove that he was.  No photos of injuries.  No medical examination or documentation.  Nothing.  Just verbal statements from him and the others who were also claiming having been tortured. 

It appears that Justice O'Connor, in his recommendations, found that quite enough - from the Analysis and Recommendations of the O'Connor Report....

While in Syria, Mr. Arar was interrogated, tortured and held in degrading and inhumane conditions.

Mr. Arar arrived in Syria on October 9, 2002 and was held incommunicado until October 22, 2002. In the intervening period, he was interrogated and tortured.

The actions of the (Syrian Military Intelligence) with respect to Mr. Arar were entirely consistent with Syria’s widespread reputation for abusing prisoners being held in connection with terrorism-related investigations.

Léo Martel, the Canadian consul in Damascus, visited Mr. Arar the next day in an office at the Palestine Branch. He did not observe any physical signs of torture on Mr. Arar and indicated in his report of the meeting that Mr. Arar had appeared healthy, but added, “of course, it is difficult to assess.”

During the August 14 visit, Mr. Arar also said that he had not been beaten, tortured or paralyzed. Mr. Martel was understandably sceptical of this last comment, yet his report made no reference to his scepticism.

After Mr. Arar’s return, some officials in the Canadian government did not believe Mr. Arar’s
public statements that he had been beaten or tortured. As it turns out, their conclusions were wrong. Mr. Arar had indeed been beaten and physically tortured during the first two weeks of his imprisonment in Syria.

- edited to fix formatting -

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

I'm still wondering why we're giving this man 12 million dollars and his lawyers 2 million?
That's going to buy a lot of therapy...is that why he's getting money?
I just don't get why we have to throw money at people who've been wronged. Arar himself says it's not going to buy his life back. It's the same in the Residential School case....the lawyer who got that case settled says that the money will be squandered and not used for therapy.
In my opinion there is a growth industry out there in victimhood and it's proving very lucrative for some folks and a lot of lawyers! :

 

[GAP]

In the Arar case....it ends it...period...full stop...he is now a non-issue that can't be used against the government.

 

[The Bread Guy]

In the Arar case....it ends it...period...full stop...he is now a non-issue that can't be used against the government.

On!

 

[IN HOC SIGNO]

In the Arar case....it ends it...period...full stop...he is now a non-issue that can't be used against the government.

That's a lot of money to make an issue go away.
Where do we all sign up?

 

[GAP]

That's a lot of money to make an issue go away.
Where do we all sign up?

Well you need a beard, accent, bit of a travel history, whiny routine, then we fly to someplace that goes over the US. Then we tell them, nope....don't know him....
Then we ship you away for a year or so, but don't get lost!! or you don't pass GO
Then you have to have someone feel sorry for your sorry A**!!
Then we have a former judge (once we make it understand that he's not sentencing you to jail time) say, he's OK by me.

get all that done, and you're in......now off you go, get busy!!  ;D

 

[riggermade]

I think that this is taken for granted, as NO physical evidence was provided to prove that he was.  No photos of injuries.  No medical examination or documentation.  Nothing.  Just verbal statements from him and the others who were also claiming having been tortured. 

I always thought he looked pretty fit for a guy who claims he was tortured


Edited by Vern to fix the quote.

 

[observor 69]

Well you need a beard, accent, bit of a travel history, whiny routine, then we fly to someplace that goes over the US. Then we tell them, nope....don't know him....
Then we ship you away for a year or so, but don't get lost!! or you don't pass GO
Then you have to have someone feel sorry for your sorry A**!!
Then we have a former judge (once we make it understand that he's not sentencing you to jail time) say, he's OK by me.

get all that done, and you're in......now off you go, get busy!!  ;D

So easy, you should give it a try. 
Hope you don't mind the rubber hose beatings, the feeling that there is absolutely no hope of anyone getting you out and an Embassy staff member in Damascus who is absolutely clueless and uncaring. Hey it's only for a year!
And don't forget those brave Americans defending the US who shipped your a** of to Syria!

What's a former judge, is that like a former Colonel?

 

[Bruce Monkhouse]

And don't forget those brave Americans defending the US who shipped your a** of to Syria!

You have very little time to explain what you meant here...................

 

[observor 69]

You have very little time to explain what you meant here...................

Extraordinary rendition is an American extra-judicial procedure which involves the sending of untried criminal suspects, suspected terrorists or alleged supporters of groups which the US Government considers to be terrorist organizations, to countries other than the United States for imprisonment and interrogation.[2] Critics have accused the CIA of rendering suspects to other countries in order to avoid US laws prescribing due process and prohibiting torture, even though many of those countries have, like the US, signed or ratified the United Nations Convention Against Torture. Critics have called this practice "torture by proxy"[3] or "torture flights".[4]

Reportedly, in a number of cases (such as Khalid el-Masri) the practice of "extraordinary rendition" has been applied to innocent civilians, and the CIA has reportedly launched an investigation into such cases (which it refers to as "erroneous rendition"). In el-Masri's case, he may have been mistaken for another man with a similar name, Khalid al-Masri. The introduction of the term "erroneous rendition" should not be interpreted to mean that extraordinary rendition of any intended subject is legal.

Although rendition is not new, the current US policy of "extraordinary rendition" appears to be different in nature, and its usage as a tool in the US-led "war on terror" to apprehend suspected terrorists, but not place them before a court of law, is new.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extraordinary_rendition

Unfortunately for Arar he feel victim to this practise. The O'Connor report  details this.

This reference, page two, notes US agents were responsible for the rendition of Arar:

http://www.ararcommission.ca/eng/ReleaseFinal_Sept18.pdf