The Great Gun Control Debate
- Thread starter Jarnhamar
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logau
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Ref the Gun registry
I have a 9mm pistol and registration was very simple.
I filled out a form when I got it via my dear old daddy‘s estate. Had to take the test to get the Fire Arms Certificate. No problem.
Then I renewed it on the Internet - again - no problem.
What I believe is the problem is the average Joe out there has a morbid fear of government forms - maybe from the annual joy of tax preparation?
Maybe H and R block should be recuited to fill out the form - for a fee of course.
All tongue in cheek - no flames please - but whoever designed this program - to dump $$$ into Computer Database companies - should be fired. No other words for it.
I have a 9mm pistol and registration was very simple.
I filled out a form when I got it via my dear old daddy‘s estate. Had to take the test to get the Fire Arms Certificate. No problem.
Then I renewed it on the Internet - again - no problem.
What I believe is the problem is the average Joe out there has a morbid fear of government forms - maybe from the annual joy of tax preparation?
Maybe H and R block should be recuited to fill out the form - for a fee of course.
All tongue in cheek - no flames please - but whoever designed this program - to dump $$$ into Computer Database companies - should be fired. No other words for it.
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Don‘t even get me started on this one. We have been registering guns since the 1930‘s. That wasn‘t good enough for a few squeaky special interest groups that the Gov. promptly greased with my money. They gave the right to police to come into my home and inspect storage and the registration of firearms that are found. Now, as a law abiding sports shooter I find that offensive. Especially when the criminals always have arms and run them across the border frequently. These are usually stolen and readily available. Also, the criminals tend to use them in the violent situations that the special interest groups are so concerned about. Duck hunters, not so much. Unless you have a thing for ducks of course. I think they are tasty. Now, look at the sentences of the gun runners who were caught with 45 weapons near the border...2 years and no firearms licence for 5 years? Something like that. WTF????? I could get that for improper storage or posession of a restricted weapon!! Criminals caught with handguns in the city center...suspended sentence and no firearms licence for 5 years...WTF????? We are truely a ****ed up nation. I believe in safe storage and who wouldn‘t lock ‘em up but the police state action of the CFC...absolutely criminal. I know many a police officer that has told me they have not registered their own yet as the whole thing will fold eventually...WTF??? I have given them enough personal info for my retricted license that they can reach up my *** and tell me what I had for breakfast in Petawawa 12 years ago. Truly a case of Government gone wrong and strapping on the old sandpaper condom and giving it to the public. For $ 1,000,000,000 dollars they take six months to answer your e-mail. Where did the money go? I am mildly curious.
We are a long way from the days of carrying an SMG in a bag on Air Canada eh boys? Where you fellers off to? Just goin‘ to Edmonchuck for a little shootin‘. No sweat, enjoy the trip. Try that today.
We are a long way from the days of carrying an SMG in a bag on Air Canada eh boys? Where you fellers off to? Just goin‘ to Edmonchuck for a little shootin‘. No sweat, enjoy the trip. Try that today.
- Reaction score
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Well, considering I live in Vancouver, it isn‘t some country dude with a shotgun I am worried about...its the punk gangster that shoots up a downtown bar (happened twice in the last few months...5 deaths)
My question is what is gun control, with the vast amount of resources being thrown into it, doing to stop these kinds of crimes...nothing, as it affects law-abiding gunowners only.
On a side note to what Old School said, I find it ironic that when to get a search warrant on a criminal, police have to go through a judicial process proving reasonable grounds, but as a registered gun owner, some guy has the right to walk into my house whenever he wants.
Just who are the bad guys these days?
My question is what is gun control, with the vast amount of resources being thrown into it, doing to stop these kinds of crimes...nothing, as it affects law-abiding gunowners only.
On a side note to what Old School said, I find it ironic that when to get a search warrant on a criminal, police have to go through a judicial process proving reasonable grounds, but as a registered gun owner, some guy has the right to walk into my house whenever he wants.
Just who are the bad guys these days?
Old School hit the nail on the head: the registry is a thinly veiled usurption of our basic rights.
I find it difficult to discuss the treachery that has been foisted on us by our own Government. I sincerely hope that the next one will return the concept of personal responsibility and self determination to the people of Canada- and quickly, before the last vestiges of morality and work ethics depart the fix.
I find it difficult to discuss the treachery that has been foisted on us by our own Government. I sincerely hope that the next one will return the concept of personal responsibility and self determination to the people of Canada- and quickly, before the last vestiges of morality and work ethics depart the fix.
J
jrhume
Guest
Well, the bad guys are gun owners, of course.
Did you miss the Get-Your-Mind-Right seminars that explained all this? I think there was some electro-shock therapy involved . . . it‘s so hard to remember . . .
Jim
Did you miss the Get-Your-Mind-Right seminars that explained all this? I think there was some electro-shock therapy involved . . . it‘s so hard to remember . . .
Jim
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In my opinion these bills get passed because of the fact that 10% of Canada‘s population lives in T.O. They as a general rule have a horrible time with guns. A duck hunter‘s shotgun is all the same as some badguy‘s pistol to them. Toronto(GTA), Otawa, Montreal and Vancouver to a lesser extent have such a huge impact on the Feds that what they want we have to deal with. Their special interest groups can show us all sorts of stats to validate this foolishness.
Is it a bad idea?
No, every little bit that helps to keep my little boy(5) and young daughter(7) safe is fine by me. If a few duck hunters get upset cause they get treated like a pariah, oh well.
What‘s the honest big deal of it? The way it was conducted is what gets me. How some guy can railroad this through, when other bills get held up forever is what gets me. Has it changed the fact that young men are blowing each other away in record numbers? Nope. It‘s still a good idea to try and make our country safe. But murder with guns have never been as rampant here as down south of the 49th. This has more to do with Canada‘s intolerance of violence as a whole than anything else. The myth of the wild west and all it‘s machismo is prevelant in American society. Media, entertainment, movie legends all force this down our throats,much of it on airwaves traveling north. Let‘s concentrate on that instead of this feelgood bill that only make duckhunters feel suspicious but the granola crunchers all smug in their hemp ponchoes.
End of rant.
Slainte,
Is it a bad idea?
No, every little bit that helps to keep my little boy(5) and young daughter(7) safe is fine by me. If a few duck hunters get upset cause they get treated like a pariah, oh well.
What‘s the honest big deal of it? The way it was conducted is what gets me. How some guy can railroad this through, when other bills get held up forever is what gets me. Has it changed the fact that young men are blowing each other away in record numbers? Nope. It‘s still a good idea to try and make our country safe. But murder with guns have never been as rampant here as down south of the 49th. This has more to do with Canada‘s intolerance of violence as a whole than anything else. The myth of the wild west and all it‘s machismo is prevelant in American society. Media, entertainment, movie legends all force this down our throats,much of it on airwaves traveling north. Let‘s concentrate on that instead of this feelgood bill that only make duckhunters feel suspicious but the granola crunchers all smug in their hemp ponchoes.
End of rant.
Slainte,
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Cdn$1 000 000 000.00 (that‘s about US$315.45 in case you‘re wondering S.Baker) can buy an awful lot of hospital beds, or teachers, bring much needed help to far off communities in Northern Ontario, train new soldiers and still have enough for anti-crime programs.
I can‘t agree with you more ShOrtbUs.
I can‘t agree with you more ShOrtbUs.
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Padraig. You are on crack. Your kids are not safer with the gun registry. The duck hunter was never going to jack your car. Did the criminals register theirs?
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I concur with Padraig. I‘ve no problem with the concept of firearms registration. It‘s the implementation that needs a serious accounting. The cost is insane. The idea of centralizing and streamling seems fine on paper, but there is no excuse for this exhorbitant cost.
But we have to be clear, firearms registry is simply that, a registry. It has it‘s place, but at nowhere near this price.
The bigger problem is the lack of responsibility or accountability to the people over this mess.
But we have to be clear, firearms registry is simply that, a registry. It has it‘s place, but at nowhere near this price.
The bigger problem is the lack of responsibility or accountability to the people over this mess.
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Law abiding citizens have registered since the 1930‘s.
Criminals...never
There wasn‘t a problem before CFC came into being...that is the point.
Criminals...never
There wasn‘t a problem before CFC came into being...that is the point.
The bashing of michael moore is kinda funny. I mean, he doesn‘t insult people without providing backed up data.
(Do you think the NRA wouldn‘t have jumped on "bowling for columbine" if they had found an inaccuracy somewhere in there?)
yeah, he hates bush. and he‘s given us plenty of legit reasons to understand why. the extent thbat some people can do is call him a joke and a fat ****. he‘s better known than any of you, has more credibility (yeah, that IS true!) and gets all of his "ammunition" against the right from legitimate news services...reuters, the BBC, etc.
"left wing" news services to be sure, but they‘ve got infinetely more credibility than most of us...
(Do you think the NRA wouldn‘t have jumped on "bowling for columbine" if they had found an inaccuracy somewhere in there?)
yeah, he hates bush. and he‘s given us plenty of legit reasons to understand why. the extent thbat some people can do is call him a joke and a fat ****. he‘s better known than any of you, has more credibility (yeah, that IS true!) and gets all of his "ammunition" against the right from legitimate news services...reuters, the BBC, etc.
"left wing" news services to be sure, but they‘ve got infinetely more credibility than most of us...
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Aww...nULL. Your making me feel bad about myself. I really regret losing your popularity contest.
If being a social nuiscence and harrassing 80 year-old men to make some bucks for my movie is what you respect, than cheers to you and your role models.
Maybe when lala-land finally becomes reality, and the means of production belong to a bunch of intellectuals and union bosses, you and Mr. Moore can enjoy a government subsidized bucket of chicken together.
The fact is, the crux of his argument in his movie is plain wrong.
How can guns be the root cause of violence in American society? America has always had a "gun culture". Why is it only recently that 15 year olds have been mowing each other down.
That is from a respected psychologist with a bestselling book on the subject...not some news service. See Dave Grossman.
Michael Moore should pack it up and head to North Korea since he finds his country so morally reprehensible. nULL, you are going to have a fun time in the military when you defend the actions of people who believe you are the biggest contributer to the world‘s problems and go out of their way to **** on you.
Credibility with whom? The Spartacus Youth League? Its credibility with those who matter that counts.
Infanteer‘s Quote of the Week
"Nearly all of the opposition to our conduct in this war was expressed by professors and those in law, the media, government, and entertainment, who as a general rule lead lives rather different from those of most Americans [who were behind the war]...Those who were tenured, highly paid, or leisured, both Republican and Democrat, I think have forgotten how hard it is to survive and raise a family-how often daily life is muscular and dangerous, and how frequently evil people can and must be stopped only through physical strength from hurting those who are helpless....
Many enlightened and well-educated Americans-simply cannot believe that awful men abound in the world who cannot be cajoled, bought off, counsled, reasoned with, or reported to the authorities, but rather must be hit and knocked hard...Domestically, such hypocricy and naivete are problematic, but in a war with deadly adversaries like those we face today, utopianism is near suicidal."
Victor Davis Hanson
"An Autumn of War"
So as for the credibility we lack here, its a question of mind over matter for us.
I don‘t mind because they don‘t f***ing matter.
Infanteer Out
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The availabilty of the guns and the gun culture in the US is a sore point for many including Michael Moore. But in his movie he uses Canada as a basis of comparison effectively. Per capita, we have almost as many firearms in our population and the homicide rates are much, much lower. He asks why that is. As for Mr. Heston, he may have been an 80 year old man, but at the time he was the president of the NRA and that meeting showed that he was woefully out of touch, literally. The best thing the NRA could do is find a more energetic president who may lead the organization into a moderate age. I just perused the NRA‘s website, I notice many celebs posing and showing their solidarity beside target rifles and shotguns. None of them are shown with an assault rifle. Compromising a little in certain areas may increase the credibility of the NRA as it works with the government instead of fighting it. Only my opinion though. Their country to do so as they wish. I‘ll never be able to support the idea of a Tec-9 as a hunting weapon. I‘m a happy firearms owner in Canada and I left my C-7 at the base.
The movie uses the gun culture in many of its facets to support his arguments, but much of the film is also critical of the policies of the nation that allow such a disparity amongst its population. Why is it that a single mother can work 70hrs a week and not be able to meet her basic costs? Social questions such as that are rampant within. As for his credibility, I have to agree with that. Back to back books at number 1 for months on many a best seller list and an Academy Award winning movie allow him to claim credibility. If it‘s only people who lean to the left who support him, then that is still support nonetheless. In this age, I‘d hardly say that the right is lacking for representatives to carry their flag. It‘s about balance.
As for going to developing countries, that‘s a good thing for certain. But when your country is the major consumer of energy and goods in the world, that affects everyone. Then the idea of cleaning up from within is not so ignoble.
I‘ve no problem with Moore, Rush Limbaugh, Howard Stern or Triumph the comic dog. Every view should have a voice and allow the populace to decide for themselves, peacefully. That‘s the ideal, isn‘t it?
The movie uses the gun culture in many of its facets to support his arguments, but much of the film is also critical of the policies of the nation that allow such a disparity amongst its population. Why is it that a single mother can work 70hrs a week and not be able to meet her basic costs? Social questions such as that are rampant within. As for his credibility, I have to agree with that. Back to back books at number 1 for months on many a best seller list and an Academy Award winning movie allow him to claim credibility. If it‘s only people who lean to the left who support him, then that is still support nonetheless. In this age, I‘d hardly say that the right is lacking for representatives to carry their flag. It‘s about balance.
As for going to developing countries, that‘s a good thing for certain. But when your country is the major consumer of energy and goods in the world, that affects everyone. Then the idea of cleaning up from within is not so ignoble.
I‘ve no problem with Moore, Rush Limbaugh, Howard Stern or Triumph the comic dog. Every view should have a voice and allow the populace to decide for themselves, peacefully. That‘s the ideal, isn‘t it?
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Old School,
How I want to throw a couple of zingers your way. But I won‘t. I never stated that the guns registery was the only answer. What I did say was any idea to make my neighbourhood safer was fine by me. If this bill is only one small part of it then so be it.
I‘ve hunted and fished when I lived up north. I dropped the hunting but not the fishing. So I‘m not some granola crunching long haired grease ball who thinks all gun owners are potential criminals. I know for a fact that not all gun owners are criminals. Many are my friends and some are family.The wrong people are being inconveniencedby this. But not all gun owners are responsible. If they have to think about safe storage and take actions to rectify this then what was the harm.
Anyone of those guys in Ottawa could have actually made the idea of a safer commnunity work with this bill had they planned it out better and left in out of the hands of those who don‘t understand what it is all about.
How I want to throw a couple of zingers your way. But I won‘t. I never stated that the guns registery was the only answer. What I did say was any idea to make my neighbourhood safer was fine by me. If this bill is only one small part of it then so be it.
I‘ve hunted and fished when I lived up north. I dropped the hunting but not the fishing. So I‘m not some granola crunching long haired grease ball who thinks all gun owners are potential criminals. I know for a fact that not all gun owners are criminals. Many are my friends and some are family.The wrong people are being inconveniencedby this. But not all gun owners are responsible. If they have to think about safe storage and take actions to rectify this then what was the harm.
Anyone of those guys in Ottawa could have actually made the idea of a safer commnunity work with this bill had they planned it out better and left in out of the hands of those who don‘t understand what it is all about.
Michael Dorosh
Army.ca Veteran
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I just watched Bowling for Columbine and loved it. I worked in a gun shop part time, incidentally, for a couple of years as well as owning firearms myself.
I thought Moore‘s interview with Charlton Heston was quite interesting. Heston came right out and said that gun violence is so prevalent in the States because of race issues - no idea how anyone could actually think that was true. Yes, he may have been an 80 year old man, but he was also the spokesman for a VERY influential interest group who clearly made some controversial decisions (like holding those rallies in Denver and Flint right after the fatal school shootings).
As for Moore‘s weight - that‘s his business. Einstein had long hair, so did Beethoven. Most people know not to judge them by their personal appearance alone.
I think everyone is on the same page as far as the cost of the registry.
What needs to happen is for existing laws to be enforced - you get caught using a gun in the commission of a crime, that should not get plea-bargained out, that should ensure you get locked up for a long, long time, and not in the current system of day care we call prisons.
Morons who don‘t keep firearms and ammunition locked up seperately and securely should also have their weapons confiscated.
If the justice system prosecuted existing criminal offences to the full extent of the law, there would be a lesser perceived need for a registry.
I‘m in favour of a registry, but given the Canadian Constitution, which does not guarantee any right to private property, the inevitable fear is that it might lead to confiscation.
I also resent that replica firearms (including airsoft BB guns) are considered as dangerous as machine guns (ie THEY ARE PROHIBITED) but dewats are perfectly acceptable. Someone explain that to me in words that make sense.
I thought Moore‘s interview with Charlton Heston was quite interesting. Heston came right out and said that gun violence is so prevalent in the States because of race issues - no idea how anyone could actually think that was true. Yes, he may have been an 80 year old man, but he was also the spokesman for a VERY influential interest group who clearly made some controversial decisions (like holding those rallies in Denver and Flint right after the fatal school shootings).
As for Moore‘s weight - that‘s his business. Einstein had long hair, so did Beethoven. Most people know not to judge them by their personal appearance alone.
I think everyone is on the same page as far as the cost of the registry.
What needs to happen is for existing laws to be enforced - you get caught using a gun in the commission of a crime, that should not get plea-bargained out, that should ensure you get locked up for a long, long time, and not in the current system of day care we call prisons.
Morons who don‘t keep firearms and ammunition locked up seperately and securely should also have their weapons confiscated.
If the justice system prosecuted existing criminal offences to the full extent of the law, there would be a lesser perceived need for a registry.
I‘m in favour of a registry, but given the Canadian Constitution, which does not guarantee any right to private property, the inevitable fear is that it might lead to confiscation.
I also resent that replica firearms (including airsoft BB guns) are considered as dangerous as machine guns (ie THEY ARE PROHIBITED) but dewats are perfectly acceptable. Someone explain that to me in words that make sense.
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