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The CF After Afghanistan - Missions, Roles & Capabilities

retiredgrunt45

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Posted with the usual disclaimers

Something we all new would happen, but here it is anyway now that it has passed in the house.

http://news.sympatico.msn.ctv.ca/TopStories/ContentPosting.aspx?feedname=CTV-TOPSTORIES_V2&showbyline=True&newsitemid=CTVNews%2f20080313%2fresp_bill_080313

Parliamentarians overwhelmingly passed a motion Thursday to extend the military mission in Afghanistan, which means Canadian troops will stay in the war-torn country until at least 2011.

Passage of the confidence motion was basically assured after the Liberals and Conservatives ironed out a compromise last month. The Conservatives agreed to set a mission end date and focus on reconstruction efforts and training instead of seeking combat.

The vote came ahead of a meeting of NATO allies slated for Bucharest, Romania, in a few weeks. Canada has said it will not extend its role in Afghanistan unless NATO countries provide an additional 1,000 troops. There have been indications that some European countries or the U.S. will provide more troops.

The NDP voted against extending the mission, along with most Bloc MPs.

NDP Leader Jack Layton told CTV Newsnet before Thursday's vote that he was "sorry that (Liberal Leader Stephane) Dion has decided to essentially prop up (Prime Minister Stephen) Harper and support the continued war effort."

"We don't have a sense of the final cost and even (where) the additional troops . . . are going to come from," Layton said. "We are embroiled in something that is not taking us towards peace."

RESP confidence motion

The Afghan vote was not the only confidence motion on Parliament's agenda today.

A budgetary ways-and-means motion also passed the Commons. It sets the stage for cancelling a Liberal private member's bill which would give tax breaks to parents saving for their kids' education.

That bill is currently before the Senate. The Tories have argued the private member's bill could cost $900 million a year by giving parents big tax breaks on RESPs.

Dion had signalled that his party was not ready for an election, therefore, most Liberal MPs didn't defeat Thursday's Tory motion. Most abstained and the motion passed 124-87.

Dion has said that he will wait until a few weeks after next Monday's byelections to decide whether or not to topple the government.
 
Dang you beat me, after I jumped the gun earlier.  Hopefully this means that TF 1-10 will start moving along now.
 
Did it get extended to Dec 2011 ?
 
STEVEN CHASE

Globe and Mail Update and Canadian Press

September 10, 2008 at 1:24 PM EDT

TORONTO — Conservative Leader Stephen Harper is vowing his government would completely withdraw Canadian troops from Afghanistan in 2011 – a promise that goes beyond a Parliamentary motion this year which merely committed to pull soldiers out of Kandahar province.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20080910.welxntories0910/BNStory/Front

I am rather surprized by this

WrenchBender
 
Here is the CTV link.

I hope this won't affect any military spending, for the things that we need.


-Deadpan
 
Arbitrary calendar end dates are all around foolish.  If we are not ready to stay until the job is done (the end-state is reached and irreversable), then we may only be wasting time, resources & lives.
 
I suspect this is to defuse the issue because Dion said the same thing.  I get the distinct sense that whatever government is in power in 2011 will be smart enough to assess the situation at the time.
 
Harper says 2011 'end date' for Afghanistan mission
'The mission, as we've known it, we intend to end,' PM tells reporters

Last Updated: Wednesday, September 10, 2008 | 11:44 AM ET
CBC News

Canada will withdraw the bulk of its military forces in Afghanistan as scheduled in 2011, Conservative Leader Stephen Harper pledged on Wednesday, saying the Afghan government "at some point has to be able to be primarily responsible" for the country's security.

Speaking to reporters at a breakfast briefing in Toronto, Harper said the Canadian public has no appetite to keep soldiers in the war-torn country any longer than the pullout date agreed on by Parliament.

"You have to put an end date on these things," Harper said.

He added that while Canada's military leaders have not acknowledged it publicly, a decade of war is enough.

"By 2011, we will have been in Kandahar, which is probably the toughest province in the country, for six years," Harper said.

"Not only have we done our bit at that point, I think our goal has to be after six years to see the government of Afghanistan able to carry the lion's share of responsibility for its own security.

"At that point, the mission, as we've known it, we intend to end."

The unusually candid remarks from Harper included the Tory leader acknowledging he cried the first time he had to call the family of a soldier killed in Afghanistan.

Troops would stay 'in some technical capacities'
The Tory government, supported by the Liberals, extended the military mission in Kandahar province to 2011 earlier this year, with a shift to emphasize the mission's priorities to reconstruction and development in the region.

Harper has made past statements in support of a shift in Canada's priorities in Afghanistan, but the prime minister's latest comments appear to show for the first time his acceptance of a troop pullout by the date.

"It's fair to say he was clearer and perhaps more forceful than before on what is going to happen in 2011," the CBC's Paul Hunter reported from the Harper campaign.

While there may be a few Canadian soldiers who stay on after 2011 as advisers, the bulk of the troops will be home by then, Harper said.

"I don't want to say we won't have a single troop there, because obviously we would aid in some technical capacities," he said.

Dion: Harper 'ambiguous' with allies
Speaking to reporters in Ontario on Wednesday, Liberal Leader Stéphane Dion said Harper's comments show "he knows now that Canadians want to leave in 2011" despite sending mixed messages abroad.

"He's saying that, but he has been ambiguous with our allies," Dion said during a campaign stop in Walkerton. "We have asked him many times in the House, 'Did you say that to them?'"

Dion added the only way for Canadians to ensure the government "will say to the world the mission will end in June 2011 is to vote Liberal."

The prime minister's assurances come as the death toll for Canadians in Afghanistan since troops deployed there in 2002 approaches 100. One Canadian diplomat has also died in the mission.

Taliban insurgents have stepped up their attacks in Afghanistan in the last month, in what they claim is an attempt to influence Canada's federal election.

With files from the Canadian Press
 
At the end of the day, if we leave before the job is done, we will just have to go back... In 5 years? 10?

Can we get the job done between now and 2011?

That is one big fricken hill to climb... I honestly do not know.

I do know, that we will do as government and the people of Canada demand, and we will pour everything we have into doing it.
 
PuckChaser said:
Maybe we can go to Darfur! Oh wait....we're not allowed in Darfur.

This is where I look at the Loonie Left and shake my head.  They want us out of Afghanistan, but wonder why we aren't in Darfur, or one or more of a dozen other places in Africa or the Far East as Peacekeepers.  Do these people have even the slightest clue of how many people make up the CF and what our capabilities are?  Silly question.  Of course they don't.
 
Redeye said:
I get the distinct sense that whatever government is in power in 2011 will be smart enough to assess the situation at the time.
I really hope so. If the job is done by 2011, awesome. If not I hope some sort of loop-hole can be found allowing getting the job done. I'd hate for it all to be in vain.
 
forcerecon85 said:
I really hope so. If the job is done by 2011, awesome. If not I hope some sort of loop-hole can be found allowing getting the job done. I'd hate for it all to be in vain.

Define "getting the job done". If it means eliminating the Taliban then we will be there for decades.
 
NINJA said:
Define "getting the job done". If it means eliminating the Taliban then we will be there for decades.
I agree. The Taliban may be people who are our enemy, but it is also an ideology.

The enemy can be defeated, but an ideology, that's a whole new ball game.


-Deadpan
 
Come on, let's not act like we all didn't see this coming...

Edit to add: Even if it we're possible to "get the job done" we as a nation do not have the stomach or will to follow through. That's just the way it is.
 
George Wallace said:
This is where I look at the Loonie Left and shake my head.  They want us out of Afghanistan, but wonder why we aren't in Darfur, or one or more of a dozen other places in Africa or the Far East as Peacekeepers.  Do these people have even the slightest clue of how many people make up the CF and what our capabilities are?  Silly question.  Of course they don't.

"Loonie left"  ??

Public support for Afghan mission lowest ever: poll
Last Updated: Friday, September 5, 2008 | 7:50 PM ET Comments272Recommend80
CBC News
The number of Canadians who disapprove of the country's military action in Afghanistan is at its highest point since 2002, according to the results of a new poll sponsored by CBC News.

The survey, conducted by Environics between Friday and Tuesday, found that 34 per cent of respondents "strongly disapprove" of Canada's participation in military action in Afghanistan, while 22 per cent "somewhat disapprove," making a total of 56 per cent.

By comparison, 41 per cent of respondents were in favour of military action, with 14 per cent saying they "strongly approve" and 27 per cent "somewhat approve."

The latest figures stand in contrast to previous responses to the same survey question, posed in March 2008, where 54 per cent of respondents said they disapproved and 44 per cent said the opposite.

The March numbers had represented the highest level of disapproval since polling began in 2002, the same year Canada launched its military mission in Afghanistan.

Do you strongly approve or somewhat approve, somewhat disapprove, or strongly disapprove of Canada’s participation in military action in Afghanistan?

Answer %
Strongly approve

14

Somewhat approve

27

Somewhat disapprove

22

Strongly disapprove

34

Don't know/No answer

3

"Overall, the level of disapproval of our involvement is at its highest point that we've seen in our tracking, and support is at its lowest," Donna Dasko, senior vice-president of Environics Research Group, told CBC News on Friday.

"So we can see the public is clearly, at this point, leaning against the mission."

A total of 2,505 people from across the country were surveyed by telephone for the latest Environics poll. It is considered accurate to within plus or minus two percentage points, 19 times out of 20.

Also down is the number of Canadians who think the Canadian mission in Afghanistan is likely to be successful.

Only 28 per cent of respondents said they think the Canadian mission in Afghanistan is likely to be successful, compared with 34 per cent who responded affirmatively during a November 2006 poll.

The current number of Canadians who said the mission wasn't likely to be successful was 65 per cent, compared with 58 per cent in the 2006 poll. In both instances, seven per cent of people said they did not know.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/09/05/poll-afghan.html
 
as a person who has been there , Ill be glad when we are not needed there but the timing of the end ops announcement is suspect. my 2 cents
 
So does anyone think the CF will go back to the peacekeeping attitude/low funding ways of the past? Will we be forced to by our political masters, with afghanistan being chalked up nothing more then a momentary lapse in the quiet disarming of our nation? I have never voted before, anyone that's been around the block care to predict? GW?
 
I'm surprised no one's actually picked up on the fact that Harper didn't say "the CF will be withdrawn from Afghanistan in 2011". What he said was "the mission as we know it will end." That could mean anything from a deployment to a quieter region, to the existing commitment plus a whole lot more development aid. Words are being put into his mouth so that he will have to correct them and be made to look bad. I think it's safe to say that the Globe is throwing everything they've got towards taking down the Conservatives.
 
hamiltongs said:
What he said was "the mission as we know it will end." That could mean anything from a deployment to a quieter region, to the existing commitment plus a whole lot more development aid.

That is what I'm betting for.
 
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