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Synthetic materials clothing now banned outside the wire in A'Stan

Actually this is old news:

When exposed to extreme heat and flames, clothing containing some synthetic materials like polyester will melt and can fuse to the skin. This essentially creates a second skin and can lead to horrific, disfiguring burns, said Navy Capt. Lynn E. Welling, the 1st Marine Logistics Group head surgeon.

It is a 'trade off' that we have known about for years.  Even our old combats were bad for this. 
 
I see. Do our soldiers currently wear these or similar products while outside of the camp patrolling in vehicles?

 
I'm not sure what the 'blend' is now in most of our underclothes, but it was at one time a 60/40 blend of polyester/cotton.  Now there is Nomex, issued.

We still have horror stories of soldiers having 'accidents' when they are careless in burning the threads on their combats prior to an inspection.
 
It was bad enough "in the old days" with the cotton and burns. Just visualizing the problems polyester would bring makes me shudder. What is made of Nomex??
 
I realize that ;) What I meant was, what clothing is made of Nomex that troops would use everyday
 
Crewsuits, Flightsuits, gloves and various undergarments.  There are still undergarments that are made of blends though.  

Cotton was not as much a problem as nylon or polyester.  Cotton would burn, of course, but it would not melt into the skin.

On the question of Polartec(tm), it is recycled plastics.  I don't think that they would be that great in a fire or extreme heat situation either.  In fact cigarettes tend to ruin any Polartec(tm) outer garment, as do bonfires.  ;D
 
There is a plan for Nomex crew suits for the LAV's and we all know that the chopper pilots use them (I believe).
 
Race car drivers have worn Nomex suits - with Nomex underwear - for 20 years. It's manditory.

DG
 
When on the road I wear a nomex flight suit, nomex gloves, CarbonX hood, underwear and socks.

Anybody riding in a vehicle in Iraq/Afghan should consider wearing fire resistant clothing. At the very least try to stick with cotton instead of mixes.

CarbonX is vastly superior to Nomex. It can withstand 2000 degrees of direct flame for 2 minutes before igniting.

Just for fun a buddy lit a set of 5.11s poly/cotton mix, they burned like a plastic garbage bag.
 
Could the airforce share some of the wealth and give out LAV and HL drivers flightsuits to wear or is that right out to lunch?

Are the Canadians in Afghanistan currently allowed to wear underarmor outside of the camp?
 
Ghost778 said:
Could the airforce share some of the wealth and give out LAV and HL drivers flightsuits to wear or is that right out to lunch?

A CADPAT flightsuit is currently in development for use by aircrews and armour guys. There are, apparently, some difficulties in transferring the distributive pattern onto NOMEX, so I'm not too sure if or when the kit will be released.
 
Roger what Civi U(ntrained).  Heard it from the CTS guys direct.  Another effort to save money by having the airforce and army share some stuff.
 
The nature of firefighting that I did in the oilfield dictated that we could not wear the traditional flame retardant suit that you see most firefighters dressed in. We wore Nomex IIIA, which is about the best as far as Nomex goes as well as PBI and PBI Black Gold Kevlar with Ripstop. The differences are quite impressive.

6 oz. Nomex III costs around 250 bucks to get a guy of coveralls (No doubt a flight suit would be more)

PBI Black Gold with ripstop has those same covies at 700 bucks.

Differences? Having worn both I can't say much for either. If I were spending my own money I'd go with Nomex. But the PBI was nice because you couldn't tear it. The only drawback to anything that is truly "ripstop" is that it wears heavier.

Big drawback to Nomex is that anyone working in an oxygen enriched area may find that their flame retardant suit is not so flame retardant when hit with +35% Oxygen.

FWIW
 
Under Armour and its competition are now banned outside the wire in A' Stan.  Fleece will most likely be included in this.  I recieved this by my OC via army email.  Unfortunately our combats would most likely melt as well.  Oh well.
I wonder if that includes the rain suit whether it be Gortex or something else.  Yes I know the article is about Iraq but it appears to be applied to our situation now.

"These items are now banned for wear outside the wire in TFA (Afghanistan).  This should may also apply to fleece as it made of the same material.

89
http://www.defenselink.mil/news/Apr2006/20060412_4800.html "

When exposed to extreme heat and flames, clothing containing some synthetic materials like polyester will melt and can fuse to the skin. This essentially creates a second skin and can lead to horrific, disfiguring burns, said Navy Capt. Lynn E. Welling, the 1st Marine Logistics Group head surgeon.

Synthetic Clothes Off Limits to Marines Outside Bases in Iraq
By Lance Cpl. Stephen Holt, USMC
Special to American Forces Press Service


CAMP TAQADDUM, Iraq, April 12, 2006 - Marines conducting operations outside forward operating bases and camps in Iraq can no longer wear synthetic athletic clothing containing polyester and nylon, Marine Corps commanders have ordered.

The ban on popular clothing from companies like Under Armour, CoolMax and Nike comes in the wake of concerns that a substantial burn risk is associated with wearing clothing made with these synthetic materials, officials said.

When exposed to extreme heat and flames, clothing containing some synthetic materials like polyester will melt and can fuse to the skin. This essentially creates a second skin and can lead to horrific, disfiguring burns, said Navy Capt. Lynn E. Welling, the 1st Marine Logistics Group head surgeon. Whether on foot patrol or conducting a supply convoy while riding in an armored truck, everyone is at risk to such injuries while outside the wire. "Burns can kill you and they're horribly disfiguring. If you're throwing (a melted synthetic material) on top of a burn, basically you have a bad burn with a bunch of plastic melting into your skin, and that's not how you want to go home to your family," said Welling.

According to Tension Technology International, a company that specializes in synthetic fibers, most man-made fabrics such as nylon, acrylic or polyester will melt when ignited and produce a hot, sticky, melted substance. This can cause extremely severe burns. For these reasons, Marines have been limited to wearing clothing made with these materials only while on the relatively safe forward operating bases and camps where encounters with fires and explosions are relatively low, officials said.These products have risen in popularity in the past few years and are now sold at military clothing stores. Some companies have come out with product line  specifically catering to military needs. This makes polyester clothing readily available to servicemembers, said Welling.

The Under Armour company, a favorite among many servicemembers here, advertises that the fabric used to make their garments will pull perspiration from the skin to the outer layer of the clothing. This, the ads say, allows the person wearing it to remain cool and dry in any condition or climate. While these qualities have been a main reason for Marines to stock up on these items, the melting side effect can be a fatal drawback, said Welling.

This point was driven home recently at a military medical facility at Camp Ramadi, a U.S. military base on the outskirts of the city of Ramadi, arguably one of the most dangerous cities in Iraq. "We had a Marine with significant burn injuries covering around 70 percent of his body," said Navy Cmdr. Joseph F. Rappold, the officer in charge of the medical unit at the base. The Marine was injured when the armored vehicle he was riding in struck an improvised explosive device, causing his polyester shirt to melt to his skin. Even though he was wearing his protective vest, Navy doctors still had to cut the melted undergarment from his torso. His injuries would not have been as severe had he not been wearing a polyester shirt, said Rappold.

Burns have become a common injury in Iraq as the enemy continues to employ IEDs and roadside bombs. Currently, these hidden explosives are the No. 1 killer of servicemembers in Iraq, said Welling. For years, servicemembers with jobs that put then at a high risk of flame exposure, such as pilots and explosive ordnance disposal personnel, were kept from wearing polyester materials because of the extra burn threat. Now, with so many encounters with IED explosions, the Marines are extending this ban to everyone going outside the wire, officials said. With the approach of summer, temperatures during some days are expected to hover around 130 degrees Fahrenheit. These blistering temperatures spur many to wear the the moisture-wicking, quick-drying clothing in an attempt to beat the heat and stay cool.

"I understand it gets to be 150 degrees in a turret during the summer time," said Welling. "My goal is not to make it more uncomfortable or harder on the servicemembers. My job is to make sure that when they hit an IED and are engulfed in flames, they have the best protection possible and the least risk of something (going wrong) that could have been prevented."

The directive is straightforward and simple, Welling said. "The goal is not to bubble wrap the warrior going outside the gate. The idea is to minimize the (hazards) we have control over," said Welling. Commanders have expressed concern that troops will downplay the problem of wearing wicking materials in combat settings because they think their body armor or uniforms will protect them. The camouflage utility uniforms are designed to turn to ash and blow away after the material is burned, but the burn hazard remains, said Welling. She recommends wearing 100 percent cotton clothing while on missions.

So far, Marines have been responding well to the new regulations. "The policy is good because it's designed for safety and is about keeping Marines in the fight," said Cpl. Jason Lichtefeld, a military policeman with the 1st Marine Logistics Group, who plans to ensure his Marines comply with the new rules.
Even Marines who never venture off base should be aware of the risks associated with wearing the wicking fabrics, officials said. For example, a Marine's high-performance undershirt recently started smoking when an electrical current shocked him. Fortunately, it didn't catch on fire or melt, but the potential was there, said Welling.

Officials acknowledged that high-performance apparel may be the best way to stay cool when working in a low-risk environment with a minimal chance of exposure to flames or intense heat. "We've got a great piece of gear, but when you put it in the wrong environment, it could cause more problems than it's worth," said Welling.


(Lance Cpl. Stephen Holt serves with the 1st Marine Logistics Group.)
 
Ghost,

Our flight suits won't do you any good unless you're wearing double layers like we're required to do under 1CAD Flying Orders. Yes the Nomex is fire retardant, but the fire doesn't cause the burns, the heat does and unless you've got a double layer which provides a pocket of air between your long underwear and Nomex flight suit, you're going to get burned. If it's just the outer garment melting that's the concern, then yes, a flight suit will solve that problem.

Most guys don't wear proper fitting flight suits anyway, they're supposed to be baggy and loose fitting to create that airspace I mentioned above. However, the large majority of aircrew wear a flight suit that's a little closer fit so that it doesn't look as sloppy, sure it looks better, but who gives a damn when you've got 3rd degree burns wherever your flight suit was tight to your body?

Currently we're wearing an intermediate flight suit. The green ones we wear are temporary until the new suits come out. Word on the street is that the new ones are going to run in the $1200 per suit price range. We're currently issued 4 suits so you're looking at nearly $5000 per aircrew to outfit the AF.
 
CFL said:
Oh well.  I wonder if that includes the rain suit whether it be Gortex or something else.

Actually I have yet to see a proper GORE-TEX trademark on any of the CF garments that I'm come across (which admittedly is not many).  Even the new Army/Airforce converged rain jacket samples have no markings inside.  The US Marine Marpat combo is covered inside with GORE-TEX labels/seams, watermarks.  As any rep. from that company will say, "if it does specifically say "GORE-TEX", it's not".

What exactly is the CF stuff made from (Micro-fibre? Trademark/tag is just tiny?) or did they find some way to use GORE-TEX and avoid the legal branding/trademark issue? 

Just curious.
 
Most Canadian waterproof/breathable gear is made from fabric from Stedfast, because of canadien content rules. They use either a ptfe film from BHA or their own urethane membrane. Almost all big US military contracts use BHA film as well.

Hobey
 
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