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CEHopeful... you could only work in Fredericton if you work at Subway surrounded by 5 bars.
zipperhead_cop said:It's always nice to have a good "reason" to justify violence, and the "all options exhausted" sounds nice too. Spock, you are going to be training to be able to go into a situation where you may be asked to end the life of a young, motivated individual like yourself because he/she is wearing different clothing than you, and is on the opposite side of an area. Can you aim your 5.56 mm with a 3x sight, put the tip on their chest and squeeze off an accurate shot in order to kill them dead? Like Clint Eastwood in Unforgiven: "Killin' is a hell of a thing. You take away everything a man has, and everything he ever will have".
Imagine you are on a check point in Kabul and there is a woman with a child walking quickly towards you despite posted gates and your verbal direction to stop. You can see that she is wearing a green martyrs head band and has a large bulk under her burka. In her hand (the one not holding the her daughters hand) is a black item that looks like a thumb switch. The kill radius for a decent suicide bomb is around 50m, and she is 75m away and closing on you and your buddies at the checkpoint. You have rules of engagement that will allow you to take her out as a result of your training without needing permission from a superior. Again, can you take the shot? (example not provided to create hijack of checkpoint SOP's).
Violence in our society is not the same thing as violence in a war zone. There are some cold, hard, terrible things you may need to get your head around being asked to do.
I realize you are doing reserve training, and there is no current requirement to serve the Regs. However, the potential to kill on command is a characteristic your instructors will be looking for. If you can't provide this, you may get piled on a bit.
GO!!! said:I would thoroughly enjoy putting a bullet or two into Timmy Taliban as he tried to place a roadside bomb that was going to kill me and the other men in my platoon. I would feel pride that I was able to fire my weapon in defence of my nation and comrades.
I guess that makes me a sociopath - right? I personally don't give a $hit if you trust me or not - but you damn well better do your job.
Seriously, just find a job elsewhere, where you can help people, and never hear yelling or loud noises. I'll take the guys who can freely acknowledge that we are all better off with some people dead.
Futuretrooper said:I'm not on basic, I'm in PRETC awaiting QL3's. I watched Platoon, Apocalypse Now, etc. Didn't they kill some innocent civilians and rape women and children in those movies. If a person is only joining the military because they wanted to kill something become a mercenary, or something like that. People that find joy in killing I don't trust, and will never trust.
zipperhead_cop said:BTW, don't be ripping on Sweetwater! It serves a valuble function to many a troop, and I'm betting most of you nay sayers, after being shot down at the Uni pub, hit Sweets for last call "just to see what's going on". You're not fooling anyone. ^-^
Quote from: Futuretrooper on Yesterday at 18:18:10
I'm not on basic, I'm in PRETC awaiting QL3's. I watched Platoon, Apocalypse Now, etc. Didn't they kill some innocent civilians and rape women and children in those movies. If a person is only joining the military because they wanted to kill something become a mercenary, or something like that. People that find joy in killing I don't trust, and will never trust.
I would thoroughly enjoy putting a bullet or two into Timmy Taliban as he tried to place a roadside bomb that was going to kill me and the other men in my platoon. I would feel pride that I was able to fire my weapon in defence of my nation and comrades.
I guess that makes me a sociopath - right? I personally don't give a $hit if you trust me or not - but you damn well better do your job.
Seriously, just find a job elsewhere, where you can help people, and never hear yelling or loud noises. I'll take the guys who can freely acknowledge that we are all better off with some people dead.
Futuretrooper said:No, I acknowledge that in situations violence is necessary to prevent the abuse of human life. But I don't think its good to get too fond of killing as some say recruits should be on here. I don't trust people who are simply obsessed with killing, I've met those types of people, and they seem like the type of guys that don't give a crap about teamwork, military ethos, etc. more or less just killing people. I would prefer to keep myself restrained, and use violence if necessary, if not then I don't wan't to kill anybody, especially if it turns out to be innocent civilians or children.
Soldiers exist to employ deadly force towards the political ends desired by our civilian leadership. If you don CF green, then you are a weapon. We neither want nor need soldiers who don't care who/what they kill, these people are sociopaths and a danger to the force they are in. We cannot afford soldiers who cannot kill, or who will hesitate and get some of ours killed in the process. There have been times when every available soldier has been thrown into the line, right down to the traditional "cooks and clerks and Sgt Major's band", so they had better be able to fight. As seen in Iraq and Afghanistan, it is the support echelons who are as likely to find themselves in an insurgent ambush as our 031 specialists, so the support arms must either remember that they are soldiers first, or find themselves the "soft target" our enemies will seek. I am a communicator by trade, a lineman and radop, but when fired upon, my reactions and training are those of any rifleman-to seek and destroy the enemy.Futuretrooper said:No, I acknowledge that in situations violence is necessary to prevent the abuse of human life. But I don't think its good to get too fond of killing as some say recruits should be on here. I don't trust people who are simply obsessed with killing, I've met those types of people, and they seem like the type of guys that don't give a crap about teamwork, military ethos, etc. more or less just killing people. I would prefer to keep myself restrained, and use violence if necessary, if not then I don't wan't to kill anybody, especially if it turns out to be innocent civilians or children.
Futuretrooper said:I'm not on basic, I'm in PRETC awaiting QL3's. I watched Platoon, Apocalypse Now, etc. Didn't they kill some innocent civilians and rape women and children in those movies.
GO!!! said:mainer,
Excellent point about the "soft targets".
I've read more than one statement from captured terrorists and anecdotal evidence that the enemy in places like Iraq will specifically not attack a formation of infantry or other cbt arms patrolling, as they will be hunted mercilessly with snipers, infantry, helicopters and armour as soon as they fire the first shot. They instead concentrate on what appear to be logistics vehicles, and transport convoys, in order to survive the engagement.